Post-Game Talk: Leafs lose in OT 4-3

[Pebble live]

Dreadful road trip shows Maple Leafs GM Dubas has not built a Cup contender

This article hit EVERYTHING right on the nose.

It needs to be shoved down the throats of Dubas and leaf management / ownership.

 

[Mess]

Leafs are 4-4-2, anyone know what the Leafs record was after 10 games last year?

5-4-1

Leafs compare favourably this year to the recent expansion Seattle Kraken for the month of October 2022.

Probably not what you would expect from a what some consider a "Cup contender".

Likely has something to do with this years goalie choices of Samsonov, Murray and Kallgren posting a .895 sv% during 10 games in October.

 

[notDatsyuk]

My issue is what does a new coach do? They wanted the other one gone and for good reason. They got the one they wanted and yet same problem. Keefe has weaknesses but he's not the main problem here.

I'll tell you what a new coach probably wouldn't do - put together a new line that proves to be the best line (with the only ES goal) in the first period, and then virtually sit them for the rest of the game.

In the second and third periods, the fourth line got almost double their ES ice time (27:23 to 15:41).

After the Ducks tied it with 7 minutes left, the Leafs best line got one shift.

 

[ZEBROA]

I'll tell you what a new coach probably wouldn't do - put together a new line that proves to be the best line (with the only ES goal) in the first period, and then virtually sit them for the rest of the game.

In the second and third periods, the fourth line got almost double their ES ice time (27:23 to 15:41).

After the Ducks tied it with 7 minutes left, the Leafs best line got one shift.

Did not watch the game. The best line was?

 

[BallardEra]

Did not watch the game. The best line was?

From Mitch after the game when he said confidence is still high and media "shambling" his brains.

 

[Leaf Rocket]

not here to cause trouble because we have been thru this many times as well

How long would they go before pulling the plug and installing Trotz? Dubas has to protect his job so coach will be first causality

Unsure but it's similar to what happened with your coach last season when the start was atrocious and woodcroft came in. Usually, the American thanksgiving is a good indicator, however, the team has been slow from the get-go, and coach is easier to replace than make trades.

 

[ZEBROA]

From Mitch after the game when he said confidence is still high and media "shambling" his brains.

Words from a "man" wich brain is so easily shambled.

 

[IPS]

I have no problem saying I still believe in Kyle Dubas as a GM. He is a very smart hockey mind, and he has only gotten better as time has passed.

How can you logically say this with the offseason he just had?

 

[Socreges]

Father said this is the turning point! The players will dig deep now when all looks lost and come out guns blazing!!! I can't wait to see it! Father was pretty adamant about this, he did injure his hand a bit in frustration but when he regained his wits he told me not to worry.

 

[IPS]

Our D is da joke of da NHL .. I can't believe but we are bottom 5 in league again .. Holl Sandin are not NHLers .. Rielly looks scared in hos won end .. Brodie can't prop up Holl sorry no one can .. Gio really is off and on at this stage .. pathetic personnel grouping as a whole .. completely unacceptable we are so bad

Hands up for everyone who saw this coming.

Soon as I heard about Muzzin not even being able to start camp I knew this D was fking doomed.

 

[Clark4Ever]

After Kerfoot missed the penalty shot, I had that familiar feeling that we would find a way to blow the lead and lose yet another humiliating game.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

It's remarkable how we can just tell that even when they were up 3-2, that Anaheim was destined to score. Not to mention blow it entirely and let up the go-ahead goal like they did, except they were saved for once with a no-goal call that went their way.

No push back. On the heels at all times. Anaheim completely dictating the play. You know it's coming, and it's frustrating to watch because this has been going on for years, no matter if it is Keefe or were Babcock coaching.

 

[Oilers in NS]

Unsure but it's similar to what happened with your coach last season when the start was atrocious and woodcroft came in. Usually, the American thanksgiving is a good indicator, however, the team has been slow from the get-go, and coach is easier to replace than make trades.

Our start last year was great, we started 5-0. In February, the firing of Tippett took place after a losing streak. It was the 2nd losing streak of the year. Holland had to do it and go with younger blood in coaching due to the McDavid effect. It has worked for us but I will admit we have gone thru a pile of coaches

 

[notDatsyuk]

Only thing positive I can say was Willy decided to play his best game of season .. man he tiled ice to us when he was on da ice .. way to go Willy .. we need that effort and speed every night (but good to see after taking last game off)
Take willy away from JT and he looks so much better .. JT is an anchor for Willy .. but then you can see da real JT now and it looks to me like a LWer right now .. he got caved again last night

Exactly. Then Keefe breaks up his best line and puts Willy back with JT.

Why? The only thing that seems to make any sense is he was told after the first period to stop showing people how much better Willy is without JT and how much worse JT is without Willy.

 

[Twine Tickler]

Taking a timeout in the 3rd period of a game to calm your team down while you hold a 1 goal lead against the worst team in hockey should tell you everything we need to know about how fragile this group is mentally.

As someone who has a lot of empathy for mental health, I can completely understand how challenging this is to overcome. At this point their demons are just too large to put in the rear view. You cannot feel this nervous to fail in game 10 of the season against the worst team in the NHL.

The talent we have is unquestionably good enough to win the cup, but we don't have the mental strength to grind out the must win games.

I don't doubt for one second that our core players give it their all when they practice and play. Unfortunately they tend freeze in that fight or flight moment. We should never be treating game 10 of the year against the 32nd placed team in the NHL as a must win. That is a major issue.

I don't know where we go from here. Again, I just don't think firing Keefe/Dubas will do anything. I really think it is time for a major shakeup. It's tough because we almost certainly lose any deal involving any of the core members, but I just don't know if we can continue to allow this level of play to continue without consequence.

 

[Marmoset]

Everybody love and underdog and so it appears our Leafs are the underdogs in any game they play.

Leafs started with the easiest QofC schedule with 7 of their first 10 games against non playoff teams from last year and lost 5 of them.

View attachment 601293

Thanks for posting this.

I don't think we should be panicking based on their start but concerned, absolutely. There are two main reasons for this that I see:

1. The poor record in combination with the easy strength of schedule as shown above. Early in the season the record has a small sample size, but the fact they have done this against weaker opposition is troubling.

2. The eye test. This team is making the same mistakes it has for years with the giveaways, overly aggressively offensive instincts, etc. The atmosphere around the team is negative - players, coach, everyone. That's to be expected to a point when a team is in a slump, but when guys say cliche things like 'we've just got to get them next game", etc., it feels like they're saying it to camera rather than actually believing it.

If I was to add a number three, it's that the goaltending hasn't been as poor as some people thought it would be so far. I still would not say I'm confident in it but considering Murray went down right away, things could be worse there.

I think you have to give this a while longer. Dubas had faith in the team and the coach and you have to see if things turn around, or not. Also, the reality is that significant trades are very rare early in the season, meaning the only realistic move would be a coaching change. Personally I don't believe the coach is the main problem.

 

[BallardEra]

Father said this is the turning point! The players will dig deep now when all looks lost and come out guns blazing!!! I can't wait to see it! Father was pretty adamant about this, he did injure his hand a bit in frustration but when he regained his wits he told me not to worry.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Did not watch the game. The best line was?

Robertson - Nylander - Malgin

 

[ACC1224]

Was Marner the only one who spoke after the game?

 

[Magic Man]

Fire Kallgren into the sun he got torched by the Coyotes, Sharks and Ducks.

 

[Nogatco Rd]

Marner blaming people for putting shambles in his brain. What a fool

That quote sounds like what you get when you translate something from English to Russian and then back to English

 

[Twine Tickler]

How can you logically say this with the offseason he just had?

Because I am looking at Kyle's entire tenure as GM, not just a single offseason, or 10 games into any given season.

Despite the overwhelming distaste for Kyle, he's done a lot of good things for this organization. I think there was justifiable reason to wonder if this core group could get it done the last 2 off-season's. So his stance to run it back with the same core was one that split the fanbase in half when it came to his support level. But in all honesty, this core group is the most talented core group we have ever seen. I understand completely why Kyle did not to succumb to the outside pressure to change it up.

People constantly say he is too loyal, but he's never been afraid to let key contributors walk if their demands did not fit our long term vision (Soup, Hyms, Freddy...etc) . The only thing he has remained loyal to is this core. Which may be his undoing unfortunately. I still believe in his ability to extract value out of castaway talent, his ability to draft, and his ability to handle the outside noise/pressure of this market. All of these characteristics are massively important for our GM to have. Something I don't think was the case in any previous GM.

It's a really tough spot for me. I feel a great deal of confidence in Kyle as a GM, but it will start to fade if this core group goes unchanged and the results stay the same. Like I said in an earlier post, if I were him, I'd be working the phones hard right now trying to extract value out of these players, but I'd also wait a couple of weeks before I'd pull the trigger. I'd let it known to the players that play time is over, and they have 2-4 weeks to right the ship before changes occur.

We cannot continually allow our coaches and GM's to fall on the sword and have nothing come down on the players. They need to be held accountable.

For the record, as I have said many times, I believe every player/coach/manager holds blame in the way they are performing. Including Kyle. I just believe the players hold the most.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

What word(s) rhyme with Connor Bedard ?

Tank hard for Bedard.

 

[glue]

Team is built wrong. You cannot rely on 4-5 guys to be the saviour. Hockey isn’t basketball, we need a full team of solid players to win. Furthermore, playing in T.O is not for everyone, we need a lot more physically and mentally tough players in a market like this. I honestly believe a team full of Hymans would have actually produced an end result better than this group. OK skill but crazy will > crazy skill and ok will.

 

[saffronleaf]

Father said this is the turning point! The players will dig deep now when all looks lost and come out guns blazing!!! I can't wait to see it! Father was pretty adamant about this, he did injure his hand a bit in frustration but when he regained his wits he told me not to worry.

who is your daddy and what does he do