Last chance for Dubas and or Keefe?

[Nylanderthal]

They lost the play ins and didn't make the top 16.
Not sure why some feel like that is an achievement.

Nobody’s saying it’s an achievement but to say they weren’t a playoff team is disingenuous

 

[ShaneFalco]

And the current gm bears 0 responsibility for those decades or even recent lack of success minus the second Boston series onward. Like many others have stated many times before a gm is measured by how they build the organization as a whole not just success in the post season in a small sample size.
They have done a good job Putting the pieces in place, it’s on those pieces to execute. Last year is the only real disappointment unless you’re just dishonest and choose to lump them all together without context.

A GM is measured by the results. He's had no results unless you want to hang a banner for the regular season. I love how the Dubas can do no wrong supporters tell everyone else how to be a fan. Context - ok Dekes.

 

[IPS]

So they made the playoffs leaving your statement incorrect

It's a tired debate so I won't add to it but if you really want that moral victory even though they lost to a team they really should have beat - then go ahead and have it.

 

[ShaneFalco]

So they made the playoffs leaving your statement incorrect

Ok let me correct- they f***ing lost in round 1 5 times in a row then. Happier?

 

[Nylanderthal]

It's a tired debate so I won't add to it but if you really want that moral victory even though they lost to a team they really should have beat - then go ahead and have it.

A team they were tied with in the standings was a team they “really should have beat”? According to who

 

[ShaneFalco]

A team they were tied with in the standings was a team they “really should have beat”? According to who

Most level-headed fans who don't make excuses for failure

 

[IPS]

A team they were tied with in the standings was a team they “really should have beat”? According to who

I'm just trying to imagine if all of you guys were told that the team is nothing more than a Blue Jackets level bubble team during that year you guys would have lost your minds over it. Don't even try and deny it.

 

[ACC1224]

It's a tired debate so I won't add to it but if you really want that moral victory even though they lost to a team they really should have beat - then go ahead and have it.

 

[ACC1224]

I'm just trying to imagine if all of you guys were told that the team is nothing more than a Blue Jackets level bubble team during that year you guys would have lost your minds over it. Don't even try and deny it.

I don't know about that, just wait.

 

[keonsbitterness]

A second monumental failure ??

Dubas/Shanny doubled and tripled down on the core. Bet your life that the media will let MLSEL hear about it until the cows come in if they suffer another monumental failure. I am afraid that Management may force/pressure Dubas/Shanny into making a trade that will come back to haunt us.

The boys said they would get it done when it counted. The school year is over. Final exams start next week. Get it done.

That also means MLSE doubled down on the status quo.

 

[IPS]

I don't know about that, just wait.

Pretty sure I remember the narrative that year because I believed it myself. Babcock got fired and I (and many others) really wanted the team to ascend to that next level to stick it to him. Turns out the team just wasn't that good, but it appears they're a lot better now so I don't fret about it.

 

[ACC1224]

Pretty sure I remember the narrative that year because I believed it myself. Babcock got fired and I (and many others) really wanted the team to ascend to that next level to stick it to him. Turns out the team just wasn't that good, but it appears they're a lot better now so I don't fret about it.

Keefe held them back, IMO.
I'm with you though, bright days ahead.

It's just so entertaining seeing the defense crew come to the rescue about any topic that is perceived as a slight. Arguing that it's a playoff team because they made the top 24 has always been a little special.

 

[Willchel Marlynder]

I hope it’s not the last chance ..
Stability and continued growth in the current regime is what’s needed …

I'm with you, but they have to make it out the first round (conference finals should really be the minimum). Another 1st round exit and it'll be hard justifying keeping the regime together.

 

[Ignatius Reilly]

Shanny, Dubas and Keefe have built something pretty special here, what with Matthews' 60 goal season, Marner closing in on 100 points, and the team getting a record number of points and wins.

Very special.

Also special is our first round losing record, which might be approaching some sort of all time high.

It's too bad we're facing Tampa, but that's just the way things have fallen. Another first round exit means something has to change.

Given how the guys at the top seem to have put together a special team, I would look to trade one of our big stars. I don't know how that could possibly work, but we need to find another team with an allstar who just hasn't been able to take them to the next level. McDavid for Matthews, that sort of absolutely massive kind of thing.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Arguing that it's a playoff team because they made the top 24 has always been a little special.

What's "special" is arguing against the NHL's established position for 2 years, and trying to claim that a 13th overall ranked playoff team isn't a playoff team because they lost a playoff series.

 

[tmlms13]

If the Leafs lose this series it will be 6 straight first round losses. 3 since Keefe took over and 4 since Dubas took over. What happens if they lose?

How many of those series were they the legitimate favourite?

One, last year when they got goalied by someone who is probably a hall of famer.

 

[nuck]

If the Leafs lose this series it will be 6 straight first round losses. 3 since Keefe took over and 4 since Dubas took over. What happens if they lose?

A really interesting press conference for sure The one time of the year when I will be absolutely hanging on every word Steve Simmons has to say.

 

[Byron Bitz]

How many of those series were they the legitimate favourite?

One, last year when they got goalied by someone who is probably a hall of famer.

They were a heavy favourite against both Columbus and MTL. It was pretty even odds for the second Boston series.

 

[Gary Nylund]

How many of those series were they the legitimate favourite?

One, last year when they got goalied by someone who is probably a hall of famer.

I don't think anyone counts the WSH series so let's look at the last 4.

BOS twice, slight underdogs both times, maybe 43-45% chance or so to win each one.

CLB, very slight favourites, maybe 52% to win?

MTL, heavy favourites, maybe 70% or so to win.

Overall, in the long run we should win about 2 out of these 4.

Small sample size of course so sometimes we would win all 4 or lose all 4. What bugs me personally is how we for some inexplicable reason seem to play some of our worst hockey of the playoffs in game 7. I think we've been outscored something like 18-6 in the last 4 series deciding games, 11-2 in the last 3 such games and that just stinks to high heaven.

I'm not one of those who says if we lose again, heads have to roll but we do need to show a MUCH higher level of compete.

 

[ToneDog]

That also means MLSE doubled down on the status quo.

Yup but I doubt they fire themselves if push comes to shove.

 

[Gary Nylund]

They were a heavy favourite against both Columbus and MTL. It was pretty even odds for the second Boston series.

They were not heavy favourites against Columbus.

 

[cannucky]

The question probably should have been What Should Happen When ? instead of What Happens If ? Given we've been hearing about the Management group being given 1 last chance for the past 3 seasons I really don't think it's realistic to expect anything to Happen If .

 

[keonsbitterness]

What's "special" is arguing against the NHL's established position for 2 years, and trying to claim that a 13th overall ranked playoff team isn't a playoff team because they lost a playoff series.

Problem is the NHL originally suggested to some media members that the qualifying round would be considered as something separate from the regular playoffs. There was also the stupidity of calling it a qualifying round, which logically means that the winners should be advancing to something different. FIFA qualifying leads to a final 32 countries advancing to the World Cup, not the 210+ who begin qualifying. Then finally the league decided they had no choice but to call all 24 playoffs teams because the qualifying round used standard playoff rules.

It was a total shit-show by the league.

 

[tmlms13]

I don't think anyone counts the WSH series so let's look at the last 4.

BOS twice, slight underdogs both times, maybe 43-45% chance or so to win each one.

CLB, very slight favourites, maybe 52% to win?

MTL, heavy favourites, maybe 70% or so to win.

Overall, in the long run we should win about 2 out of these 4.

Small sample size of course so sometimes we would win all 4 or lose all 4. What bugs me personally is how we for some inexplicable reason seem to play some of our worst hockey of the playoffs in game 7. I think we've been outscored something like 18-6 in the last 4 series deciding games, 11-2 in the last 3 such games and that just stinks to high heaven.

I'm not one of those who says if we lose again, heads have to roll but we do need to show a MUCH higher level of compete.

If you're going to take out the Washington series then I expect you've quoted every person who has said 5 straight loses to say lets not count the first one.

Have you ever had a coin flip be Heads 5 times in a row? I have, I've probably seen a Heads steak of 10.....

 

[keonsbitterness]

Yup but I doubt they fire themselves if push comes to shove.

Two points about that: they trotted Dubas out there about three seconds after the Habs series. Tells me MLSE was anxious to show its full support. Secondly, Bell and Rogers are contractually obligated to vote as a united block on all MLSE matters. One party wanting to oust Shanahan and/or Dubas would not be enough.