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LA KINGS 2023/4 Regular season discussion

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bland said:
Your disdain for Mike Richards is comical, Herby.
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Well it's true, it was the worst contract in the sport and people thought a magical switch was going to be flipped. And just like with PLD this season, every single person he played with that season was noticeably worse when he was with them.

You hated PLD from the start and can see it in this instance but you loved Richards and were to blinded to see it was the same exact thing, even to this day. The only difference is one guy just doesn't seem to care and sucks the life out of everything, and the other one just wasn't physically able to do it any longer and sucked the life out of everything.

Raccoon Jesus said:
Told ya, everything under 25 is gone in an attempt to Dave Taylor his job

We are about to enter the darkest days since the last time Blake f***ed this franchise
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This is why you fire the GM before he can make another Parrish/Sopel or Bishop trade.

In theory this should be the role that Robitaille is doing as President, as a hockey guy safety net to an incompetent GM destroying the team. But since Blake is his crony we know this will never happen, especially since Luc's job could also be tied to making the playoffs.

Kaliyev will go somewhere else, be put into a situation where his positives are utilized and his negatives aren't the only thing a team/coach sees and while he may not be the star 40G guy we hoped, he will find a role in someones top 9.
 
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GoldenBearHockey said:
PLD is kinda like the mystery party favor, you just don't know what you are gonna get, and you sure as hell don't know if it's good or bad,

Anyone who says his play ALL of the time has been bad, is just biased, anyone who says his play has been GOOD at all times, is biased as well, goes with every player, but more for PLD whose eye test fails miserably, most of the game, when things don't go his way, there's no battle there, you can see the allure of him absolutely taking over a game, and then you watch it fizzle like Lizotte hitting Trouba.... there are parts of PLD games, that absolutely make him the best player on the ice at times/nights, the problem is the consistency is one of melted butter. Maybe they can coach that into him, maybe not, maybe he matures, maybe not,
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Sure, he hasn't been bad every single shift. By and large though, I find his engagement level in each game has been underwhelming. He still has had good bursts in games, but that's why he's so maddening.

I don't think he was worth the package even if he scored at his usual clip. It's monumentally bad with how things have turned out. Even if you find the package acceptable, I agree that a 1 or 2 year contract to see how he fits would have been wise - particularly with his history of being unhappy with his teams within 3 or 4 seasons.
 
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DoktorJeep said:
Richards contract, as signed, had a $69M total value. Dubois is $68M.
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The cap in 2014 was $64.3m, Richards was taking up about 9% of the cap. Had 6 more seasons left at age 28.

In 2024 the cap is 83.5, Dubois is taking up about 10% of the cap. Has 7 more seasons left at age 25.

Obviously in both cases the cap was going to go up and those % of cap numbers were going to improve, but there are a lot of similarities.

Richards could have been CBO'ed, (and for some reason known only to DL) he was not. PLD buyout will count against the cap until 2038, but is less now than it will be in a couple of years do to age.

Richards was progressively getting worse on the ice, even his final years in Philly there as sign of decline, he had no chance to rebound, his body was cooked. This season for PLD kind of came out of nowhere, and he's younger, bigger and doesn't play that type of game where you'd expect this. There is certainly a better chance he recovers than we had with Richards, but it's no guarantee.
 
Herby said:
Well it's true, it was the worst contract in the sport and people thought a magical switch was going to be flipped. And just like with PLD this season, every single person he played with that season was noticeably worse when he was with them.

You hated PLD from the start and can see it in this instance but you loved Richards and were to blinded to see it was the same exact thing, even to this day. The only difference is one guy just doesn't seem to care and sucks the life out of everything, and the other one just wasn't physically able to do it any longer and sucked the life out of everything.



This is why you fire the GM before he can make another Parrish/Sopel or Bishop trade.

In theory this should be the role that Robitaille is doing as President, as a hockey guy safety net to an incompetent GM destroying the team. But since Blake is his crony we know this will never happen, especially since Luc's job could also be tied to making the playoffs.

Kaliyev will go somewhere else, be put into a situation where his positives are utilized and his negatives aren't the only thing a team/coach sees and while he may not be the star 40G guy we hoped, he will find a role in someones top 9.
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Nah, it’s not true. You don’t win 2 championships with “the worst contract in sports”.

That title is reserved for overpaid midgets like Gaudreau and Caufield that get stupid money and never win a damn thing.
 
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Bandit said:
Nah, it’s not true. You don’t win 2 championships with “the worst contract in sports”.

That title is reserved for overpaid midgets like Gaudreau and Caufield that get stupid money and never win a damn thing.
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The Kings were paying 9% of their cap to an AHL caliber player. And it had six more years after the failure to CBO. What Richards did in the past, when he was still an effective player didn't matter in the present situation, where he was physically incapable of playing any kind of role in the NHL.
 
Herby said:
[..]

You hated PLD from the start and can see it in this instance but you loved Richards and were to blinded to see it was the same exact thing, even to this day. The only difference is one guy just doesn't seem to care and sucks the life out of everything, and the other one just wasn't physically able to do it any longer and sucked the life out of everything.
[..]
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I followed you up until here. Richards was totally instrumental in the 2011-2012 cup run..So his situation is not the same as PLDisaster exactly. Richards became progressively useless and shouldve been bought out with the CB free buyout as you mentioned. Why DL didnt pull the trigger is a big mystery.
 
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The players play for each other and for paychecks they don’t give a flying fu k about fans unless they are fluffing them.

Star players are even worse!!!!

Anyone 4th line that plays less than 5 years in the show is normal if you get them away from the big earners.

All star hall of fame players have egos that would rival a politicians. Blake and Luc don’t give a shit what the fans have to say all they care about is their ego.

Nothing wrong with all of that as long as they are winning. I guarantee you though these guys are not willing to take criticism from people they feel are beneath them. You guys thing Goldenbear is bad, imagine someone with 10x the ego!

f*** em bring us some new hockey people that win. Personally I’m not here to pad their ego! If they aren’t winning they aren’t worth a damn to me!
 
The thing that's pissing people off about PLD is that it's multiple-faceted

It's not just his play

It's his contract

AND the trade

Like you cannot colossally f*** that up any harder, can you? Handicap your cap, purge your young assets, and get the worst "-" on the team and his worst season ever out of it while your team trends down instead of up and the team receiving your assets is pacing for a nearly 30 point standings improvement.

Like you can salvage almost any other trade. Even Lucic was 'understandable' from the standpoint of the short contract and clearly open window (maybe not the Bishop trade., lol). This team went all in before doing anything right and ended up worse with a completely capped out roster, no rounds won, diminished and completely vaporized of all youthful assets and picks, and trending down. It's actually kind of impressive when you see a guy win the lottery then buy and light a stick of dynamite in your pocket to celebrate.

I literally cannot think of a worse trade maybe in NHL history. Even Huberdeau was understandable and unpredictable, but Blake got exactly what everyone thought he was getting, maybe worse.
 
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Herby said:
The cap in 2014 was $64.3m, Richards was taking up about 9% of the cap. Had 6 more seasons left at age 28.

In 2024 the cap is 83.5, Dubois is taking up about 10% of the cap. Has 7 more seasons left at age 25.

Obviously in both cases the cap was going to go up and those % of cap numbers were going to improve, but there are a lot of similarities.

Richards could have been CBO'ed, (and for some reason known only to DL) he was not. PLD buyout will count against the cap until 2038, but is less now than it will be in a couple of years do to age.

Richards was progressively getting worse on the ice, even his final years in Philly there as sign of decline, he had no chance to rebound, his body was cooked. This season for PLD kind of came out of nowhere, and he's younger, bigger and doesn't play that type of game where you'd expect this. There is certainly a better chance he recovers than we had with Richards, but it's no guarantee.
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I agree that Richards was declining and, IMO, the failure to buy him out at the first opportunity was DL’s biggest mistake. Followed by the Kopitar 8 year deal and Gaborik 5 year deal. But I think the number of years is the difference when Richards is compared to PL.

Giving out $68M in 8 years is a heavier payout than $69M over 12 years. Again, ignoring what happened with the Richards buyout. The percentage of the cap numbers isn’t the main thing when looking at it from the perspective of an owner who is signing the checks.

I just saw the signing bonus structure. PL has already been paid $8M this season before it even started. This combination of trade protection, bonuses, dollars and term is absolutely the worst use of money in franchise history. This is damning evidence why you shouldn’t let uneducated players make expensive, long term decisions.

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AbsentMojo said:
I followed you up until here. Richards was totally instrumental in the 2011-2012 cup run..So his situation is not the same as PLDisaster exactly. Richards became progressively useless and shouldve been bought out with the CB free buyout as you mentioned. Why DL didnt pull the trigger is a big mystery.
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I was talking about the 2014 season and beyond in the context of the conversation, not the 2012 one, when Richards, while in a slow descent from his glory days in Philly was still a good player and one, who as you said contributed significantly to the Kings success that season.

Richards season in 2014 is strikingly similar to PLD's in this one, most notable being that every single combo of line-mates he has been tried with has done worse with him than they did with any other linemate, that was the thing that really made you realize that Richards was beyond cooked at that point and it's pretty terrifying to know that history seems to be repeating itself with PLD.

My only hope is that with PLD its more of an effort thing, where with Richards it was a physically unable to thing, but we have heard these whispers before with PLD and his compete level, people kind of theorized it was a miserable in Winnipeg and Columbus thing, but that loses credence since this is supposedly where he wanted to be. I think it's way more likely the guy just has no heart or passion for the game. Now that is not as bad as physically not being able to do it anymore like with Richards, but it's also not something that probably can be fixed. If he's done it in three places now, what's it say about the player?
 
I can't call Richards the worst contract by sheer virtue of him being so physically damaged that he was dealing with painkillers to an extreme degree. He should have been LTIRed.

Anyway, onto the present, not surprised if Kaliyev wants out. He's been relegated to a grinder role, struggled to adjust back to a scorer, relagated to a grinder again, and is being scratched while watching the org bend over backwards to accommodate PLD, who's getting paid 10x as much and only getting 5 more points.
 
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Herby said:
I was talking about the 2014 season and beyond in the context of the conversation, not the 2012 one, when Richards, while in a slow descent from his glory days in Philly was still a good player and one, who as you said contributed significantly to the Kings success that season.

Richards season in 2014 is strikingly similar to PLD's in this one, most notable being that every single combo of line-mates he has been tried with has done worse with him than they did with any other linemate, that was the thing that really made you realize that Richards was beyond cooked at that point and it's pretty terrifying to know that history seems to be repeating itself with PLD.

My only hope is that with PLD it's more of an effort thing, where with Richards it was a physically unable to thing, but we have heard these whispers before with PLD and his compete level, people kind of theorized it was a miserable in Winnipeg and Columbus thing, but that loses credence since this is supposedly where he wanted to be. I think it's way more likely the guy just has no heart or passion for the game. Now that is not as bad as physically not being able to do it anymore like with Richards, but it's also not something that probably can be fixed. If he's done it in three places now, what's it say about the player?
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Got it - makes sense now. This is one of the hits I remember that messed up Mike for awhile

 
If we end up having to move Kaliyev just blow up the whole team.

I don't think he ever played more than two games back to back in a top six role. It was always with Lizotte/Lemieux or whoever the hell was on the 3rd line.
 
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