Confirmed with Link: Kyle Dubas Not Returning

[myleafs]

Can’t build a team with 4 forwards making half the cap when they don’t play with any jam. If half the cap was Draisaitl, Tkachuk, MacKinnon, ok, but not Micky, Minnie and Donald.
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Nailed it

 

[LaPlante94]

I'm splitting my sides laughing at some of this. Has a guy ever been worshipped so much for doing nothing but failing in the playoffs every year?

I wanted Dubas to do good and I actually wanted him to stay but to see how the media is acting makes me wonder how much he let the media in. Imagine if this was Lou and he had the same playoff success as Dubas during the same amount of time with this core.

 

[rumman]

Where are all the Leafs optimists here?
Maybe a new GM/Coach will finally get this core playing as great as I’ve been told they are. Expected goals might actually become real ones. I mean unless Dubas is the only one who can get the core 4 motivated?

I’m over the moon with optimism, this is the best day for the Leafs in a very long time……..

 

[keonsbitterness]

Im still trying to wrap my head around whats transpired and how this all ended for Dubas. Like someone said earlier in this thread ..."so much goodwill gone just like that"

Gonna be a good book or two written in the future about this subject.

 

[Legion34]

At first I was totally on board with dubas for making them sweat after not extending him. Just like any player
If management refuses to negotiate going into your ufa year and let’s you dangle totally take it to them

But then again dubas does this to players every year so it seems hypocritical. With that in mind

He did this to himself. He chose to hold a press conference to say he doesn’t know if it is in him and demanded MORE money after saying he doesn’t know if he wants it

Can’t do that. I don’t blame the team for this. You want to be here or you don’t.

 

[PromisedLand]

I don't think Dubas fans realize how instrumental the talent he INHERITED was into propelling the regular season success of the club. All Dubas did was foment a strong losing culture (not to mention the bonehead Kadri trade). Leafs will be better off but only if they hire somebody with a resume of actual winning.

not only did he inherit talent but he also had plenty of cap space, cupboard full of assets (prospects/picks); and the financial leeway he was afforded by the MLSE board

Dubas will go down as one of the WORST GMs ever IMO. If one was to apply the context as to what he as afforded, and how little he did with it. An absolute incompetence !

Worst thing to happen to this Franchise. Only Ballard tops him

 

[SprDaVE]

He touches both sides pretty well. I think his point about the new GM is a little off base, while experience will be looked at, I don't think Shanahan meant head GM experience but just front office experience. Kyle Dubas was VERY green when he took over but say they find Jim Nill 2.0, I don't think the experience is an issue despite never being a GM.

He does say Treliving does appear to be the favourite at this time.

 

[Gabriel426]

Lol. McJesus and Drai are not signing here. It’s not any better here.

Countdown doesn't mean they are going to sign, lol.

 

[Trapper]

I’m over the moon with optimism, this is the best day for the Leafs in a very long time……..

It’s a start…I’m still looking for more change.

 

[baton elevated]

Not necessarily, the other side of the fence is claiming he bailed on the team by not accepting the offer and his holding out cost him. He is probably remorseful now because he thought he was bulletproof. He miscalculated this move and now is job hunting.

 

[Gallagbi]

I wanted Dubas to do good and I actually wanted him to stay but to see how the media is acting makes me wonder how much he let the media in. Imagine if this was Lou and he had the same playoff success as Dubas during the same amount of time with this core.

A lot of those media folks have seen all the lows without many highs. They see a highly regarded, young, GM who apparently wanted to stay with a lot of noise around his departure. Now theres big decisions with a relatively fixed timeline and a ton of questions.

People saying he was the worst are out to lunch. People saying he was flawless are out to lunch (though I havent read any).

 

[Leaf Rocket]

He touches both sides pretty well. I think his point about the new GM is a little off base, while experience will be looked at, I don't think Shanahan meant head GM experience but just front office experience. Kyle Dubas was VERY green when he took over but say they find Jim Nill 2.0, I don't think the experience is an issue despite never being a GM.

He does say Treliving does appear to be the favourite at this time.

Trading Dubas for Treliving shouldn't be a victory for us at all even though he was hindered by ownership meddling obviously.

As many pointed our Canes, Wild AGM would be ideal for sure.

 

[SprDaVE]

Trading Dubas for Treliving shouldn't be a victory for us at all even though he was hindered by ownership meddling obviously.

As many pointed our Canes, Wild AGM would be ideal for sure.

Shanahan has done very well so far finding the right people and also his initiatives around the team through the years. I don't think he'll have an issue finding the right person, or at least a competent GM.

I feel optimistic he can fix it to a certain degree.

 

[MCR74]

Well I am off the opinion that if Matthews wants anything more than 12 AAV then trade him too.

I don't mind another scorched earth if we need to do it.

paying Matthews anything like 14 to 15 AAV is going to bite us on the behind anyway. I haven't seen Matthews take the bull by its horns in the playoffs in any year since we drafted him

Same here. If Matthews wants that much, l hope the next GM slams the hammer down.

 

[7even]

He touches both sides pretty well. I think his point about the new GM is a little off base, while experience will be looked at, I don't think Shanahan meant head GM experience but just front office experience. Kyle Dubas was VERY green when he took over but say they find Jim Nill 2.0, I don't think the experience is an issue despite never being a GM.

He does say Treliving does appear to be the favourite at this time.

Brad Treliving? The guy who just traded Tkachuk for Huberdeau and signed Nazem Kadri to $7x7?

Boy.

 

[The Panther]

I’m over the moon with optimism, this is the best day for the Leafs in a very long time……..

Wait and see if they hire Peter Chiarelli before saying that....


No surprise they fired Dubas, but I'm not sure he really had a fair shake either. Promoting your 18-year-old farm team guy to manage the world's biggest profile hockey team was asking a lot.

That said, my impression as a casual observer is that Dubas did a reasonably good job, with the glaring exceptions of losing too much grit with Hyman and Kadri. It seemed like Dubas waited too long to replace that grit, and consequently they lost in the first round in 2022 when they might have won and gone on a run otherwise.

 

[Statsman1]

Ultimately, we all wanted changes, and we are going to get them. You can say losing Dubas was good, you can say it was bad….but they are all just opinions. What we know to be true is that we all feel like the Leafs should have been better than they’ve shown for the last 5-6 years.

Give me a summer of chaos/hope for change over a summer of run-it-back/no real hope for change ANYTIME. We didn’t win much before today…so who can say today is a bad day for the Leafs?

Anyone who starts a post with, “I guarantee the Leafs will be (better/worse)…” because of today has no idea at all about what the future holds for the Leafs. As fans we can only hope for the best. Whether or not you have faith in the MLSE braintrust to deliver is up to you.

 

[IPS]

I'm relatively indifferent about Dubas not extending. My issue is how badly the organization botched it to the point we're hearing the goodwill is gone, guys like Spezza resigned, and the people loyal to Dubas are PISSED. Who's loyal to Dubas? Matthews, Rielly, Nylander, Tavares, etc, etc. Seems insane to do this when two of those guys need new contracts in a couple months or they'll be traded too.

They're loyal to Dubas because their agents bent him over badly to overpay them

You're gonna like someone and want them around when they took care of you that well. And given that a few of them are gonna be UFA's in a short time, you seriously think it's some mystery why they're loyal to him?

 

[Kurtz]

Lol. McJesus and Drai are not signing here. It’s not any better here.

McDavid will sign here eventually.

The only question is if it'll be when he's well past his prime like Lindros and Spezza, or when he's just on the back 9 like JT was.

 

[Gabriel426]

I am not anti-Dubas and actually wanted him to stay.
Reality is that losing Dubas, AM, MM, or whoever, what is the actual loss?
It is really making the playoffs or not bc beside this season, our season is only 7 more games than half the league.

I am not saying lets blow it up and rebuild.....but the truth is that the past five years or more had shown that this current core can't do it together.
Not losing hope but it is always the same story with them, maybe change is good for both the players and the club. Esp MM, bc it hurts to see someone like him played the way he did in the Panthers series.

 

[PromisedLand]

If Dubas ends up in Ottawa then his crocodile tears were completely full of shit.

for a dude that didn't want to do GMing he was quick to ask his agent to send Shanny a brand new financial ask which Shanny probably laughed at.

IMO Shanny was more than a gentleman today; if it was me on the podium i'd rip dubas a new one for his fraudulent behavior and sabotaging the organization

 

[myleafs]

The Dubas arrogance and sense of entitlement permeates top-down into all levels of the organization.

It is clear now that Dubas is the real problem and this is coming from a fan of his…. prior to today’s revelations.

I wanted him gone but I still dont want to believe that he is that guy

 

[Petrus]

LeBrun: Rival NHL GMs weigh in on Kyle Dubas after his split with the Maple Leafs

Former Flames GM Brad Treliving on Dubas: "Kyle is a smart, calculated and thoughtful manager, and he did a good job."

theathletic.com

Partly a matter of money, partly a wrestle for power, people can and will debate for years how this played out and which exact version of events they want to believe, but the bottom line is that Dubas is out as Leafs GM after five years.

Maybe we’ll look back in years and say this was a bold and brilliant pivot from Shanahan after seeing what he perceived as red flags in Dubas’ hesitance or contract counter. Or maybe it’ll go down as one of the organization’s great blunders to let this 37-year-old GM go.

And there will be time for Dubas, too, to look back at whether he overplayed his hand.

No one has that answer yet.

...........

“Came in as a young GM, was very respectful with his peers,” Bergevin said. “Montreal and Toronto are the most pressure markets in the NHL, for sure. Passionate fan bases.”

Here’s what they said.

Blue Jackets GM Jarmo Kekalainen: “I have the utmost respect for Kyle, both as a professional and as a person. He’s always a straight shooter to deal with. No bulls—. Just an all-around really good person and a professional. All our discussions were straightforward and analytical. I think he has a very thorough approach to everything; you have to be prepared when you talk to him because he’s going to look at things from every angle. I have a lot of respect for him.”

Oilers GM Ken Holland: “Very bright young man. Very respectful. I thought he did a great job in his time running the Leafs, having them near the top of the standings every year.”

Panthers GM Bill Zito: “Obviously, a very bright man. And a guy that I have a lot of faith in his character. He’s a guy you could do a deal with. And if it wasn’t papered, you could tell the (player) go ahead get on the plane. As an agent, we used to say if you did a deal with a GM and you didn’t have a contract back yet, would you send your player on the plane? That’s a level of respect I have for Kyle’s integrity. Obviously, I’m very fond of him. I think he did a hell of a job there.”

Outgoing Predators GM David Poile: “I think Kyle is one of the finest young minds in hockey. I really enjoyed getting to know him. He was a great contributor at the GM (meetings) level. Always good to talk to on the phone on hockey and GM things, players. Very impressed with Kyle every time I talked to him.”

Hurricanes team president and GM Don Waddell: “Kyle is a very smart person. Being in a tougher media market, he doesn’t allow the pressure to affect his decisions.”

Former Flames GM Brad Treliving: “Kyle is a smart, calculated and thoughtful manager, and he did a good job.”

And finally, when reaching out to Lightning GM Julien BriseBois, he referred me to the comment he gave me after the first round of the playoffs when the Leafs beat Tampa Bay and I asked him about Dubas and the Leafs finally winning a playoff series.

“Kyle has done a remarkable job from the day he was promoted to GM,” BriseBois told me on April 29. “He and his management team never leave any stone unturned. They are always grinding and coming up with creative ways to move their team forward. He has been bold and resolute in a very challenging environment in which to act thusly.

“The stars finally aligned for him to be rewarded for all of his great work with a playoff series win. Good for him.”

I have no doubt Dubas has support across the league. But I would also say nobody will be throwing him under the bus given the circumstances.

 

[LeafSteel]

This whole thing looks like it’s going to reek of the Encarnacion fiasco from a few years ago, where both the player and Blue Jays wanted to stay together and ended up both regretting that they didn’t get it done….

 

[The Panther]

Regarding the contracts thing: I think we're reaching a point in the current NHL---wherein some clubs' strategy with young stars is to lock them down for 6-8 years with big contracts while they're young---where "negotiation" is longer going to be a thing.

In other words, clubs have only so much money they can invest in a high-priced core. Beyond that, there's no room for negotiation. Also, GMs (like Dubas, with Tavares and Marner) have been burned a lot recently with some of these big contracts.

So, I think what the Leafs and several other clubs are going to do in the near future (if not already) is simply say to the player and agent: We have X-dollars to give you for the next one-or-two years, or X-dollars for the next five years. Take it or leave it. And the deadline to decide is July 1st (or whatever). And players and agents are going to have to decide quickly.