Confirmed with Link: Kyle Dubas Not Returning

[francis246]

I was merely reacting to a statement - Dubas is/was above average GM.
There are 32 GMs in this league, I'm not buying that he was better than 17 of them.


You can't pick random GMs from history and use them as proof of how great Kyle is.

Did Kyle really outwork 17 GMs in 2023? Because that's what it takes to be above average, not historical examples.

They made it to the second round, so yes Kyle did outwork 17 other GM’s. Just by making it to the playoffs he did better than 15 of them lol. Not to mention Toronto was among the best heading into the playoffs.

Then another 8 GM’s and their teams were bounced in round 1. Kyle and the Maple Leafs were not apart of that group. So by your standard and logic, Kyle would then qualify as an above average GM for 2023.

 

[Arzak]

They made it to the second round, so yes Kyle did outwork 17 other GM’s. Just by making it to the playoffs he did better than 15 of them lol. Not to mention Toronto was among the best heading into the playoffs.

Then another 8 GM’s and their teams were bounced in round 1. Kyle and the Maple Leafs were not apart of that group. So by your standard and logic, Kyle would then qualify as an above average GM for 2023.

I was worried all these Kyle supporters think GM that inherited the cup conteder can be praised for making playoffs.


I'm sorry but you need to start evaluating Kyle properly. He s not a better GM because he had better players when he came in.

If he started in Arizona he would be the worst GM ever ? Whan an excellent way of evaluating Kyle. Was it even theoretically possible for Kyle not to be great by your "matric" with the team he had at his disposal?


State of affairs prior to his arrival and after. That goes for every GM .


It would be a great joke, but I'm afraid you really believe it: a team making playoffs = GM above average .

 

[Leaf Fans]

Those cans in the millions now go unsold &consumers all across the US refuse to buy their beer. The company was pushing a transgender social agenda....do you understand the implications? If not do your research...

I just don't care whether someone is trans or not. It is not even an issue from my perspective. I don't think they can force me into anything. If that makes me woke, I don't even care. It is crap beer. That is why I wouldn't buy it.

 

[DarkKnight]

Just cuz.

 

[francis246]

I was worried all these Kyle supporters think GM that inherited the cup conteder can be praised for making playoffs.


I'm sorry but you need to start evaluating Kyle properly. He s not a better GM because he had better players when he came in.

If he started in Arizona he would be the worst GM ever ? Whan an excellent way of evaluating Kyle. Was it even theoretically possible for Kyle not to be great by your "matric" with the team he had at his disposal?


State of affairs prior to his arrival and after. That goes for every GM .


It would be a great joke, but I'm afraid you really believe it: a team making playoffs = GM above average .

First off all I could give 2 shits about Kyle. Like I said it’s hyperbole both ways. People think Kyle is the scum of the earth (not true), people think he’s God’s gift to hockey (not true). He did an okay job here. Made the playoffs every year (which in itself after 10 years of never sniffing the playoffs, is good) however the lack of playoff success was concerning. However that is not ALL on Dubas’ feet.

Dubas may have been too committed to the core 4. However he gave the teams a chance at success and continually evolved as years gone on. Keefe has been out coached in most series and I’m sorry but the core 4 failing to score goals isn’t Kyle’s fault. He can’t go down there and pass them the puck.

The reality is Kyle is a decent GM, who tried his best, but the players and coach he believed in let him down. For that Kyle is to blame because he chose that group. But there is an element of blame/accountability that needs to be placed on the players for not executing and producing.

This may be a massive overreach on my part and I’ll accept it if not true. But I can tell you’re probably a young fan who never had to endure what it was like to be a leafs fan in other eras and watch the shit product that was there.

 

[Arzak]

First off all I could give 2 shits about Kyle. Like I said it’s hyperbole both ways. People think Kyle is the scum of the earth (not true), people think he’s God’s gift to hockey (not true). He did an okay job here. Made the playoffs every year (which in itself after 10 years of never sniffing the playoffs, is good) however the lack of playoff success was concerning. However that is not ALL on Dubas’ feet.

Dubas may have been too committed to the core 4. However he gave the teams a chance at success and continually evolved as years gone on. Keefe has been out coached in most series and I’m sorry but the core 4 failing to score goals isn’t Kyle’s fault. He can’t go down there and pass them the puck.

The reality is Kyle is a decent GM, who tried his best, but the players and coach he believed in let him down. For that Kyle is to blame because he chose that group. But there is an element of blame/accountability that needs to be placed on the players for not executing and producing.

This may be a massive overreach on my part and I’ll accept it if not true. But I can tell you’re probably a young fan who never had to endure what it was like to be a leafs fan in other eras and watch the shit product that was there.

While not agreeing with all you said, I respect your opinion.

It's just speculation on my part, but I firmly believe playoff appearance was almost guaranteed regardless of GM at that point.

On the other hand, It's hard to objectively measure GMs impact. I liked his last year here, but not much before. At the same time, he outmaneuvered himself out of the GM position - meaning people responsible for this team thought he did a good job.

edit: I'm 34 - so young not that long ago?

 

[Larcos_Unal]

Just cuz.

We're just letting him marinate guys, we learned our lesson with Dubas.
Hunter will be ready when he's 72.

 

[notDatsyuk]

I don't like this whole mess but I don't blame Dubas for going to Pittsburgh, he obviously meant when he said "here or nowhere" is if HE decided not to come back. He decided to come back and then got canned, so it's not the same situation. This doesn't mean he wasn't leveraging family for $$$ or whatever, just that quote doesn't have the teeth people think it does.

So if he decided not to come back, it would only have been here that he wouldn't come back to?

 

[notDatsyuk]

I just don't care whether someone is trans or not. It is not even an issue from my perspective. I don't think they can force me into anything. If that makes me woke, I don't even care. It is crap beer. That is why I wouldn't buy it.

The only positive thing I can say about Bud is that it keeps people who will drink it away from good beer.

 

[notDatsyuk]

First off all I could give 2 shits about Kyle. Like I said it’s hyperbole both ways. People think Kyle is the scum of the earth (not true), people think he’s God’s gift to hockey (not true). He did an okay job here. Made the playoffs every year (which in itself after 10 years of never sniffing the playoffs, is good) however the lack of playoff success was concerning. However that is not ALL on Dubas’ feet.

Dubas may have been too committed to the core 4. However he gave the teams a chance at success and continually evolved as years gone on. Keefe has been out coached in most series and I’m sorry but the core 4 failing to score goals isn’t Kyle’s fault. He can’t go down there and pass them the puck.

The reality is Kyle is a decent GM, who tried his best, but the players and coach he believed in let him down. For that Kyle is to blame because he chose that group. But there is an element of blame/accountability that needs to be placed on the players for not executing and producing.

This may be a massive overreach on my part and I’ll accept it if not true. But I can tell you’re probably a young fan who never had to endure what it was like to be a leafs fan in other eras and watch the shit product that was there.

Since he acquired (and overpaid) one and overpaid two more so that he couldn't provide appropriate support players, then to an extent it definitely is his fault.

Keefe takes some of the blame for not using the players he's given properly, but who gave him those players?

 

[rumman]

We're just letting him marinate guys, we learned our lesson with Dubas.
Hunter will be ready when he's 72.

he'll be Shanahan's replacement, wouldn't that be fun..............

 

[Antropovsky]

I'm sure he could get $4 million...I don't think he's happier in that case...he was in a much better situation in Toronto.

Penguins we're paying Hextall 3.5 million. Dubas might get a bit more, but if Dubas played his cards right he probably would've gotten 6 million per for Toronto and all the work he put into his staff and organization processes wouldn't have gone to waste. Not to mention he wouldn't have had to uproot his family...and he had a young core in place that he was familiar with. If his family was stressed before, it certainly won't be getting any easier. Winning in Toronto would be a hell of a lot more exciting than in Pittsburgh too.

We will see though, if it's the same or less than it has to sting for Dubas.

 

[socko]

Can't really blame Dubas for being gun-shy on the Pens job. He couldn't win with a stacked roster on ELCs in Toronto. If he goes to Pitt and can't win with that old sinking roster, he might not get another chance.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

This is all Shanahan's fault.

Dubas is pretty much my number one choice as the worst general manager of this team in my lifetime.

Divisive, egotistic, self promoting and self indulgent. With a "me first" attitude that bled down to the player level. One that, apparently, eventually led to his downfall.

Hard to believe Shanahan overlooked such obvious character flaws when hiring him.

Five years with a competitive team is a very long time in the world of professional sports. When you factor in where they already were when he took over, the best you could say is the team is marginally better. I'm sorry, but marginally better isn't good enough with the most talented Leafs team possibly ever.

A once in a lifetime opportunity pissed away by Kyle Dubas.

And it's all Shanahan's fault.

 

[rocketman588]

Can't really blame Dubas for being gun-shy on the Pens job. He couldn't win with a stacked roster on ELCs in Toronto. If he goes to Pitt and can't win with that old sinking roster, he might not get another chance.

I mean sure but dragging it out for as long as he has with them is pretty insane

I get the feeling he may have done the same with us if Shanny didn't just get rid of him

 

[rumman]

Can't really blame Dubas for being gun-shy on the Pens job. He couldn't win with a stacked roster on ELCs in Toronto. If he goes to Pitt and can't win with that old sinking roster, he might not get another chance.

BS can get you to the top, but it can’t keep you there, he’s been exposed for what he really is, someone else's problem going forward………..

This is all Shanahan's fault.

Dubas is pretty much my number one choice as the worst general manager of this team in my lifetime.

Divisive, egotistic, self promoting and self indulgent. With a "me first" attitude that bled down to the player level. One that, apparently, eventually led to his downfall.

Hard to believe Shanahan overlooked such obvious character flaws when hiring him.

Five years with a competitive team is a very long time in the world of professional sports. When you factor in where they already were when he took over, the best you could say is the team is marginally better. I'm sorry, but marginally better isn't good enough with the most talented Leafs team possibly ever.

A once in a lifetime opportunity pissed away by Kyle Dubas.

And it's all Shanahan's fault.

I don’t know how anyone can think Dubas is incompetent and not think the same about Shanahan………

I mean sure but dragging it out for as long as he has with them is pretty insane

I get the feeling he may have done the same with us if Shanny didn't just get rid of him

I can see the Penn’s having second thoughts if he keeps jerking them around……..

 

[justashadowof]

Can't really blame Dubas for being gun-shy on the Pens job. He couldn't win with a stacked roster on ELCs in Toronto. If he goes to Pitt and can't win with that old sinking roster, he might not get another chance.

Instinctively he may know that he has little chance of being anything other than the GM who managed the decline of the Penguins before some future White Knight comes in to built it back up.

 

[rumman]

Instinctively he may know that he has little chance of being anything other than the GM who managed the decline of the Penguins before some future White Knight comes in to built it back up.

Then he’ll disappear like a fart in the wind…….

 

[SprDaVE]

 

[Peasy]

About time.

Good luck, pens are a mess with a core right at the end of their life span.

 

[hockeywiz542]

 

[Burnie97]

Sweet... good for him.

Now for f*** sakes let's lock it up and move on.

 

[All Mod Cons]

Dubas is such a liar. Very untrustworthy.

 

[MapleLeafs77]

Dont care about this loser. Close up the thread and lets move on to our current GM and our team.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Wow that talk with his family and recovering from such a stressful time here - glad he worked through it all so quickly