Confirmed with Link: Kyle Dubas Not Returning

[Antropovsky]

If Shanny blocked Dubas from making a trade of one of the core 4 then I will admit and switch my opinion on Dubas.

I think MLSE should have gotten rid of both but that’s above my pay grade.

Agreed, but one of the core two. Marner or Nylander. Though I'm thinking just Marner. It would be hard to argue that this team might be had more success in the playoffs without Nylander. Matthews isn't getting traded.Tavares has a nmc and isn't going anywhere, so there was nothing for Shanahan to block.

 

[SmoggyTwinkles]

I wonder if something goes down today? I feel like Shanny could have been waiting for the long weekend to be over before doing a major shakeup.

We'll see. Really curious to see what happens next.

 

[4thline]

Out of town for a bachelor party.. come home to this...
I've made no effort to hide that I've appreciated Dubas' time here. Classy, well run organization, strong (early returns) on drafting, good recruiting and talent identification, perennially top team that has never been really hamstrung, always had the flexibility to tweak or even take things in a completely different direction in the offseason.

That being said- was fine with his departure going into this offseason. Running back the core 4 was gambling his job with the Leafs. Winning a round and coming back looking at rectifying at that mistake put things in a grey zone where I was kind of ambivalent. 7 years is 7 years, and regardless of how healthy the org is and how high performing they were in the regular season, the lack of playoff runs makes a good argument for cold, calculated change with a clear vision for what comes next.

But where we are now and how things went down... just wow. Shooting from the hip based on reaction to a press conference/ negotiation..... not cold, calculated change with a clear vision for what comes next. In the space of three days went from a relatively safe place where a GM could evaluate Matthews (publicly stated) intention to re-sign and either trade him or not, to one with no-one in charge and almost no chance of getting a commitment without paying through the nose.

I think Shanny needs to step into the role and take ownership of this offseason. An interim is a lameduck, no credibility with Matthews/Nylander and to a lesser extent Samsonov outside of money. Can a new hire come in, evaluate, chart a course, build those relationships, and execute in 4-6 weeks? Tall order.

 

[Throw More Waffles]

That appears to be the case... yes. According the Chris Johnston, Shanahan has called the core 4, and assured them that they are all in the future plans of the org.

You've got to be freaking kidding me....

The specific reason I wanted Dubas out is because I thought he was too committed to the freaking core 4.

 

[29Potvin]

I disagree. I liked that Shanahan was quite forthcoming with what transpired, and as to why Dubas was ultimately relieved of his duties. Being vague in his press conference would have led to even more questions than answers, and it would have been picked apart ten-fold in particular by this city's media.

i agree with you. It also sets the tone for dealing with Willy, AM34 and MM.
We want you back but we want you on our terms, we will dictate the process and if not that you for your service! We wanted hard lines and this is the first time we have witnessed them.
Shanny was willing to die on betting on KD, KD overplayed his had and will now have a nice mess to cleanup in Pitt with limited cap and a older core

 

[Fogelhund]

You've got to be freaking kidding me....

The specific reason I wanted Dubas out is because I thought he was too committed to the freaking core 4.

My feeling is Dubas would have made changes... he alluded to this in his interview. I understand where people wanted the change in GM, but I believe that Dubas is actually pretty cut throat, despite the nice guy presentation. I think if Dubas had been given autonomy, you would have seen more of what you want in roster changes, than what will happen now.

I mean we will see how this plays out, but that's the way it is looking.

 

[andora]

You've got to be freaking kidding me....

The specific reason I wanted Dubas out is because I thought he was too committed to the freaking core 4.

I thjnk it was reported that the 4 came away from the phone calls a little more relaxed that they were staying together but nothing in stone... ne gm could change that

 

[Fogelhund]

i agree with you. It also sets the tone for dealing with Willy, AM34 and MM.
We want you back but we want you on our terms, we will dictate the process and if not that you for your service! We wanted hard lines and this is the first time we have witnessed them.
Shanny was willing to die on betting on KD, KD overplayed his had and will now have a nice mess to cleanup in Pitt with limited cap and a older core

I don't think he goes to Pittsburgh. I think he'll end up in Ottawa. That will be friggin painful, if Dubas in Ottawa hands it to us. Literally a worst case scenario.

 

[thewave]

You've got to be freaking kidding me....

The specific reason I wanted Dubas out is because I thought he was too committed to the freaking core 4.

They don't make money off the gates. They make some money off the Merch and the rest of it all from your attention and the people buying for it.

No surprises. Don't want to rock the boat, too profitable right now.

 

[andora]

I thjnk it was reported that the 4 came away from the phone calls a little more relaxed that they were staying together but nothing in stone... ne gm could change that

Also this could be a nice setup by shanahan about staying together if you guys take better contracts.. oh you wont,? Ok

 

[Buds17]

If he just said "It's a results-oriented business so we decided to go another direction" the media would have moved on quicker.

I'm not so sure about that as I'd have found it rather interesting if they had chosen to go in another direction with the GM purely for that reason after now having finally won a playoff round.

 

[ShaneFalco]

You've got to be freaking kidding me....

The specific reason I wanted Dubas out is because I thought he was too committed to the freaking core 4.

If the core is back....
I don't even know what to say
Can't happen

 

[Fogelhund]

If the core is back....
I don't even know what to say
Can't happen

You'll be pissed as $%*$, you'll bitch about it like the rest of us, you'll vow you won't support the team... and then, just like the rest of us, you will watch anyway.

 

[myleafs]

4 days post Dubas being let go, and still no trace of a Shanaplan 2.0. Not even a whisper. I love having no direction heading into one of the busiest off-season's in recent history.

Patience petal

 

[Mess]

Mirtle on Fan now again mentioning all these moves blocked, when pressed to give examples, just gives a generic answer. Lame.

Mirtle and Chris Johnston are both pro Dubas and now their meal ticket has dried up so now their posting and claiming all inside knowledge of Shanny blocked trades and Shanny promises to players and when pressed for more details they have none etc.

Sounds like they need to drive traffic to their pod and sites as reporters, and tossing some monkey wrenches to create more chaos for Leafs post Dubas.

 

[myleafs]

#7 overpayments (Matty, Tavares, Marner, Nylander, AJ, Kappy)
#8 letting Hyman walk
#9 first (Jarvis) to dump Marleau to overpay Marner
#10 Brown to Ottawa as a sacrificial lamb to dump Z
#11 Simmonds over Perry
#12 Sparks over McBackup
#13 Ritchie
#14 traded for Soup and Cliffy who both turned into duds
#15 Rittich for a 3rd

#16 Created a team philosophy where players dont stick up for themselves or each other

 

[Coatsy79]

If the reports of Dubas having decision-making power lessened are true, and I have no reason to believe they aren’t, that should raise alarm bells. I say this because it mirrors the current landscape at Toronto FC in that ownership has become more involved in decision-making there as well. The MLSE board and Shanahan had reason to have reservations when Dubas’ agent came back with a significantly different financial package. Anyone would. If that was the reason the parties decided to go their separate ways, MLSE has lost a bright young executive, and Dubas should fire his agent. However, if the crux of the issue was that Dubas wanted control of hockey operations, the department he oversaw, he should have been afforded that. Not a single Leafs fan would say they’d prefer the telecom executive making hockey decisions over Dubas and they’d be correct.

Something Leiweke said when I worked at MLSE has stuck with me years later: “If you’re going to get rid of someone, you better have someone better in mind.” I’ve seen quite a few names in the rumor mill, and I’m not sure any of them are better than Dubas. From a hockey standpoint, there will be arguments.

From a human standpoint, Kyle Dubas led a forward-thinking, positive culture. It is rare in hockey that not a single person within an organization has a bad thing to say about someone. When Jason Spezza resigns and Auston Matthews might no longer be sure about signing an extension, it speaks to how well-respected Dubas is. He’s earned that loyalty.

If the decision to show Dubas the door ends with Matthews following, the blame should lie squarely with MLSE’s board, who will have cost themselves millions of dollars by allowing the most talented player in franchise history to walk because they wouldn’t allow his boss to make the decisions he was hired to make. One thing is for sure, the money MLSE will cost themselves if Matthews leaves is far greater than the money Dubas asked for. No doubt about that. In the end, last week may go down as the one that plunged the Toronto Maple Leafs back into chaos over what seems to be a couple million bucks and boardroom drama. That seems quite ridiculous when the ownership group is worth nearly 100 billion dollars, but I guess this is what real-life Succession is.

All seems an awful lot life typical modern corporate bull plop

These guys at the top really have no idea

Pretty fed up of the constant recycling of the same few guys, all of whom are generally terrible

 

[myleafs]

Lol. Of course he did what he wanted. I hate this ownership narrative that they are running hockey ops. That's false and I know this for a fact. This is Dubas' camp trying to paint a negative picture so he can save face.

Which ironically is making Kyle look even more like a douchebag....IMHO

 

[Ulysses31]

obviously cuck dangle took sides with dubas

 

[Throw More Waffles]

You'll be pissed as $%*$, you'll bitch about it like the rest of us, you'll vow you won't support the team... and then, just like the rest of us, you will watch anyway.

Maybe...

This past season is the first time I didn't pretty much clear my schedule for leaf games. If something else came up, I'd do that instead. And when I did "watch", it was often on in the background while I did other things.

This is after 30+ years of being glued to the screen during every leaf game.

I'm willing to bet my experience was a pretty common story last season...

 

[DarkKnight]

Matthews at a 5 year deal was honestly idiotic, as was all the NTC kicking in at the same time. Shame Dubas had to learn all these lessons with a stacked core in the biggest market on the planet.

Especially getting absolute top dollar and up front money. It was, is, a horrible deal.

 

[myleafs]

Mirtle on the Fan outlining the potential chaos that looms, so many critical questions for the team. Bunkis points out Dubas brought us here. What to do with Matthews? Maybe not let him become a UFA at 26 freaking years old lol.

My buddy had an interesting take....says Dubas pushed all his chips in with his vision and it didnt work so he figures he alienated his relationship with Shanny so he wouldnt get the job and wouldnt have to deal with the mess that he created because he has no idea how to fix it. Plausible?

 

[BHD]

Wonder who the next GM will put behind the bench.

 

[thewave]

My buddy had an interesting take....says Dubas pushed all his chips in with his vision and it didnt work so he figures he alienated his relationship with Shanny so he wouldnt get the job and wouldnt have to deal with the mess that he created because he has no idea how to fix it. Plausible?

Yes, I said the same thing days ago. Very plausible, can you imagine him going into negotiations and asking them to return the favor and they say, what have you done for me lately though?

Absolutely plausible.

 

[Larcos_Unal]

Especially getting absolute top dollar and up front money. It was, is, a horrible deal.

Not only that, but he wants to sign another 5 year deal now so he can do it all over again down the line lol.