Confirmed with Link: Kyle Dubas Not Returning

[ToneDog]

its simmons so not sure how to take this but hey... its something i guess

Dubas and spin seem to go hand in hand.

 

[notbias]

its simmons so not sure how to take this but hey... its something i guess

Seems weird that Freidman would say this.

If the board doesn't say much (I believe Tanenbaum would be hands-off, not sure about the others), this should be a non-issue.

• The structure was Dubas > Shanahan > The Board > The Board thinks about it > back to Shanahan > Back to Dubas
• Friedman says that he initially heard that Dubas wanted to cut Shanahan out and report directly to the board, but after additional digging doesn't think that's true.
• Dubas wanted to "streamline" the process because he felt like things couldn't get done with the big decisions they had ahead this offseason
• Dubas was worried about things getting out and decisions not being made quick enough.
• Friedman says "In addition to everything Shanahan spelled out publically, people told me that that particular request was not well received, and after, when they heard that Dubas had kind of proposed this, they were not surprised things ended up the way they did"

I honestly just want to know more about this and have both sides to get a better idea, I feel like this is such a mess.

 

[thewave]

I know your agenda is to get marner traded but unfortunately for you its not happening

It's impossible for me to get anyone traded. He needs to go because his cap is 11m for a freaking playmaker that falls to shambles in the playoffs every single time.

Time to move on from that crap, we'll never be able to bring in or afford a real 1D going forward which means no winning a cup ever.

 

[The Masters]

 

[thewave]

Seems weird that Freidman would say this.

If the board doesn't say much (I believe Tanenbaum would be hands-off, not sure about the others), this should be a non-issue.




I honestly just want to know more about this and have both sides to get a better idea, I feel like this is such a mess.

LarryT is very hands on. He has always been hands on and that goes all the way back the JFJ. Everyone knows it, in the recent article posted here from The Hockey News (Rachel Doerrie) she even goes into it about how LarryT is always in the dressing room and here and there.

Dubas is just dumb for saying, hey bosses I know it's your money but I don't want to ask you to spend it, and give me the private jet and 3m on top of what you offered. So stupid.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

I could believe that he needed board approval on big stuff like the Tavares signing and Babcock firing (like most GMs do) but if Dubas wants me to believe that he didnt have full autonomy when he brought in the following Soo alum;

Rasmus Sandin
Mac Hollowell
Jake Muzzin
Jack Campbell
Robin Lehner
Wayne Simmonds
Joe Thornton
Jared McCann
Michael Bunting
Nick Ritchie
Matt Murray
Connor Timmins

When by my count, Lou, Nonis and Burke only brought in 1 combine; David Broll.

Not to mention coaching staff and front office;

Sheldon Keefe
Chris Roque
Victor Carneiro
Richard Rotenberg
Wes Clark
A.J. MacLean
Jon Elkin

Also include former Soo players signed for the AHL/ECHL;

Ray Emery
Ryan Sproul
Andrew Campbell
Jack Kopacka

Also players that Dubas acquired/signed or re-signed players from the agency he used to work at (Raze/Uptown Sports);

-Byron Froese
-Calvin Pickard
-Joe Blandisi
-Kyle Clifford
-Mike Giordano
-Sam Carrick
-Zach Hyman
-Calle Jarnkrok

If this is supposed to be a case against him using nepotism to acquire players or coaches, I am not really sure this is effective. Some of these names are major stretches in the first place. Including Lehner alone takes that entire argument down a notch. Then, for the most part, it seems like his intimate knowledge of these players has helped us far more than it has hurt us. In fact, the moves that are arguably the biggest stretches in terms of a Soo connection to Dubas (Simmonds, Thornton, etc.) were his worst moves. The guys he actually acquired and knew while he was there were all major successes, except for Ritchie.

He's drafted 1 Soo guy in the 5 years he has been in charge: Hollowell, because calling Sandin a Soo pick when he was an import selected 4 years after Dubas left the organization and when Thommie Bergman had probably already scouted him intimately the year before he went to the Soo is an absolute joke. And Dubas had plenty of opportunities to draft more without it looking suspicious.

 

[BallardEra]

McGuire: Leafs were fortunate to beat Tampa

Hockey analyst Pierre McGuire on the departure of Kyle Dubas from the Toronto Maple Leafs, how he thinks Dallas will open their series against the Vegas Golden Knights and the importance of game two in the East Final

www.tsn.ca

 

[The Masters]

As i said earlier mlse doesnt get involved in personnel decisions. Simmons is right. Why friedman made it seem that way was wrong on his part. If you dont believe it go watch that amazon thing

 

[Amadeus]

Frank is definitely not the biggest Dubas fan.

 

[notbias]

I guess time will tell, and we will see what happened, but Friedman said the opposite and I trust him more.

 

[Apex Predator]

Where does Pierre Lebrun stand on this? I feel like Dubas isn’t leaking stuff to him and he would be pretty neutral on what actually happened.

 

[notbias]

I could believe that he needed board approval on big stuff like the Tavares signing and Babcock firing (like most GMs do) but if Dubas wants me to believe that he didnt have full autonomy when he brought in the following Soo alum;

Rasmus Sandin
Mac Hollowell
Jake Muzzin
Jack Campbell
Robin Lehner
Wayne Simmonds
Joe Thornton
Jared McCann
Michael Bunting
Nick Ritchie
Matt Murray
Connor Timmins

When by my count, Lou, Nonis and Burke only brought in 1 combine; David Broll.

Not to mention coaching staff and front office;

Sheldon Keefe
Chris Roque
Victor Carneiro
Richard Rotenberg
Wes Clark
A.J. MacLean
Jon Elkin

Also include former Soo players signed for the AHL/ECHL;

Ray Emery
Ryan Sproul
Andrew Campbell
Jack Kopacka

Also players that Dubas acquired/signed or re-signed players from the agency he used to work at (Raze/Uptown Sports);

-Byron Froese
-Calvin Pickard
-Joe Blandisi
-Kyle Clifford
-Mike Giordano
-Sam Carrick
-Zach Hyman
-Calle Jarnkrok

Most of these seem like good moves... what's the issue?

 

[CaptainCrunch17]

All GMs make mistakes especially if you’re a rookie but all in all imo Dubas is a good GM and I think both him and Shanahan handled this situation poorly.

Dubas just straight up messed up for himself by saying what he said in the press conference and I think his intentions were negotiation based (lousy strategy) and Shanahan might have over analyzed this whole situation and in the end fired someone he actually wanted to keep.

After what Dubas said in his presser, mainly, calling into question his interest and commitment to the job, I think it made pretty hard to proceed forward on an extension after that.

If they had of renewed Dubas it would’ve been an ongoing concern and discussion point in the media for years.

 

[TorMapleJays]

They'll be great again, until they aren't ... about 83/85 games into next season.

Remember how badly the fan base wanted to make deals after that west coast swing and they went on a heater.

They’ve shown us time and time again who they are, why don’t believe believe them?

 

[Stephen]

We literally saw him negotiate a trade on camera

Dude added another pick on the spot

He might have had to run stuff by Shanny maybe but it's hilarious to think he had to call up a dude at Rodgers to make trades

He also had one of the biggest trade deadlines of all time which Shanahan cited as a reason why he was extended and squeezed every last Penny of cap to get through the season so unless the board demanded all those guys it would seem like no one’s telling Dubas he can’t do a lot of things.

 

[Martin Skoula]

its simmons so not sure how to take this but hey... its something i guess

He doesn’t own it though, Bell and Rogers don’t need his votes to do anything.

 

[PromisedLand]

And things get even more interesting

P.S. I wanted Dubas away from the Leafs so I don't care if he left or fired. I am just happy. Wanted to put this disclaimer lol

 

[capfit9]

At this point Dubas has to come out with his side of the story. I can say with relative certainty Dubas will not be getting any recommendation from Shanahan within hockey circles if this is true.

 

[Stephen]

Having autonomy is a dangerous thing, since retiring I hold the power to every decision I make, I only do what I want to do which makes me a difficult to live with (just ask my wife) everyone should answer to someone if you want to maintain balance and harmony imo……….

Yeah agreed. We always look at the Leafs like they have a lot of big heads hashing it out by committee anyway. Keefe had someone call down for him to play a U of T goalie. That doesn’t look like unfettered autonomy. So what if there’s presidential input and a rubber stamp on decisions? You cited your wife, even Dubas intimated he needed wife approval to stay on. So yeah. Some oversight and input seems like a normal condition…

 

[CaptainCrunch17]

Look at the author someone who keeps getting fired from all her jobs.

Is this the same person?

Q&A: Rachel Doerrie on filing a human rights complaint against the Canucks – Sportsnet.ca

www.sportsnet.ca

 

[rumman]

https://thehockeynews.com/news/opinion-maple-leafs-parting-with-kyle-dubas-rings-alarm-bells

I stopped reading at “most talented player in franchise history“ 34 isn’t in the top 10 let alone top 20 greatest Maple Leafs, whoever wrote this doesn’t know shit about hockey let alone the history of the Blue and White. Pathetic………….

 

[capfit9]

Frank is definitely not the biggest Dubas fan.

some can see the grifting some can't, dude hasn't accomplished squat and now wants to be president of hockey ops. #entitled

 

[PromisedLand]

At this point Dubas has to come out with his side of the story. I can say with certainty Dubas will not be getting any recommendation from Shanahan within hockey circles if this is true.

he unfollowed the leafs and shanahan on twitter apparently based on a couple posts earlier in the thread of course he won't be getting any "recommendation"

 

[capfit9]

Where does Pierre Lebrun stand on this? I feel like Dubas isn’t leaking stuff to him and he would be pretty neutral on what actually happened.

Leaking stuff to Mirtle/Siegel/Athletic & CJ for sure, although CJ & LeBrun are close pals, I think Lebrun would be wise to stay as neutral as possible & I think he will.

 

[rumman]

Dubas and spin seem to go hand in hand.

Guess Simmons isn’t on the Dubas payroll……..