Tribute Kyle Dubas discussion

[sxvnert]

Dubas will end up becoming the Sens GM this summer. He grew up a fan of the team and its the perfect way to stick it to leafs ownership.

 

[All Mod Cons]

This has to be the end.

 

[Havoc]

Been too many days in a row without me saying this guy is trash.

Dubas is trash.

I feel good now. Bye.

 

[Polaris1010]

If the next few games are like this, that would be an organizational failure.

We have seen this movie far too many times.

 

[Leaf Fans]

This has to be the end.

The end of game one. Leafs lost 7-3.

 

[ponder]

Dubas will end up becoming the Sens GM this summer. He grew up a fan of the team and its the perfect way to stick it to leafs ownership.

As a Leafs fan and Sens hater, I strongly approve of this idea. He inherited then deeply f***ed up an amazing young Leafs core, I’m confident he could do the same with Stutzle, Tkachuk, Norris, Pinto, Chabot, Sanderson, etc.

 

[binop7]

Kevin Mcgran is doing an AMA on reddit and had some interesting answers re Dubas


Highlights:

Q: Hi Kevin, thanks for doing this! Is there any truth to the rumours that Matthews willingness to re-sign in the city is tied to playoff success this year? Seems kind of wild he would want to leave a team that’s going to pay him big money and a city where he gets to be a top celebrity.

A: I think if the Leafs play their cards right, Matthews is a Leaf for Life. Part of the card-playing is keeping Dubas. If they fire Dubas, the next GM may as well trade Matthews before his NMC kicks in July 1.



Q: Does Shanahan and Dubas have a bit of a rift as Frank Seravalli alluded to?
A: Funny, but yesterday after that podcast came out, Shanahan and Dubas put on a show of some sort during practice, standing beside each other, joking, laughing. I don't doubt they have their differences. I don't think that's terribly surprising. I also don't think that's the reason Dubas doesn't have an extension. That has more to do with Tanenbaum. Though if the Leafs go on a run, Dubas will be in the cat-bird seat. Lots of teams looking for smart GMs all of a sudden.


Q: Has ownership potentially made a big error in not extending Dubas?
A: Yes. Imagine a world in which the Leafs get to the conference finals. Then MLSE decides to offer an extension. And Dubas says, wait a minute, Pittsburgh seems nice. Calgary. There are lots of opportunities for him. And these players love him. So does the management staff. I think it's crazy he's not re-signed. I believe ownership forgot the 2006-2016 era. One playoff series.

---
My opinion:
Leafs can't help themselves but make errors and screwing with the best GM we've maybe ever had might result in him walking and taking Matthews with him. And the worst part is half our fans don't realize what we have. No reason to not extend Dubas and then fire him if you didn't like the result, we have money. Instead they've left themselves in a shitty spot

Our media are honestly pathetic

 

[JKG33]

Dubas will end up becoming the Sens GM this summer. He grew up a fan of the team and its the perfect way to stick it to leafs ownership.

Stick it to Leafs ownership?

So he's no longer the GM of the Leafs, AND he goes to a division rival? Sign me up

 

[Dave92]

He's 3 losses away from going his entire contract without winning a playoff series. When He started with a 105 point team + Tavares. Not all his fault but it would be historic ineptitude.

 

[hullsy47]

This has to be the end.

this team wasnt ready .had 4 months to prepare.had 4 years of the same core .
pittsburgh get ready for the dubas smoke and mirrors show

 

[hullsy47]

He's 3 losses away from going his entire contract without winning a playoff series. When He started with a 105 point team + Tavares. Not all his fault but it would be historic ineptitude.

he knows hes going to pittsburgh lol .he ll sell the fan base crosby malkin and letang are no holl mathews and reilly

 

[acrobaticgoalie]

Not terribly surprising - the idea of a rift between Shanny and Dubas' always seemed a bit questionable - the two have been tight and linked to one another since the Shanny era began back in '14.....

It also shouldn't surprise anyone that Matthews likely wants to work with the guy he knows and has a longer relationship with than any sort of question mark GM. I'd imagine Nylander and Marner likely are the same

I didn't hear the context but I'm assuming Seravalli is talking out his ass to generate clicks like Simmons. We've never seen anything between them before or had any other media members in Toronto suggest there is a rift between the two. Same with in the Amazon doc, they appear to work well together.

As for the contract extension bit in the off season. It's not surprising. I wouldn't expect Shanny or the board to sign off on an extension before the season since it's a results based business and up til this point his team hasn't delivered.

 

[acrobaticgoalie]

he knows hes going to pittsburgh lol .he ll sell the fan base crosby malkin and letang are no holl mathews and reilly

Why would he go there? Their Time is done, they have no prospects to come in and support their aging core and won't be competitive unless they rebuild. To which you'd be looking at probably 4 yrs before they might be competitive again

 

[kevsh]

So he's no longer the GM of the Leafs, AND he goes to a division rival? Sign me up

If Leafs' history has shown us anything, this scenario pretty much guarantees an Ottawa Stanley Cup under Dubas next year. To make it even more cruel, they'll knock off Toronto in the first round after going 0-3 to start the series and in the process extend the Leafs first round misery to 8 consecutive seasons.

(Oh, did I mention next trade deadline the new Toronto GM will trade another first round pick on a goalie who is in net for the Leafs epic collapse. And that pick ends up being the next McDavid.)

tlrd; Please, don't tempt fate.

 

[HockeyVirus]

Look at our roster and explain to me how it is on the GM. Dubas came into a situation with 3 stars who had produced on their ELC's (which is different than every other team) and had to sign them as a rookie. Even if you say those signings were poor, he rebuilt the entire roster under a flat cap from a soft run and gun team to a team that was one of the best defensive teams in the league with depth that played the right way to win.

The roster coming onto the ice and looking as if they have never played hockey together is not the GM's fault. You guys cry hard about the Kadri trade, how would you like to see Nylander be that but even worse because no one is paying the value for him we have due to the same reasons boomers hate him.

So you are basically saying you want to trade a under 24/25 franchise C who is breaking franchise records left and right after not having one of them forever or Marner who we all know how good he is and how important he is to the team. Those moves were what made us not a first round laughing stock, but a regular season one years before.

All to say, his biggest "mistake" was being loyal to an under 25 group of superstars hoping they would figure it out. I don't want to hear about Tavares signing either because it's hindsight bs, every fan was hyped about that signing and thought it meant a cup was coming home.

Like usual, Dubas will move on and lift the cup elsewhere, along with likely Matthews/marner/Nylander/whoever else we scapegoat out of town. And we'll have the same folks crying today sitting there 5 years from now calling whoever a clown for trading these guys.

But I do think if this loss happens, even Dubas recognizes the time for change to the core. I am of the opinion he should be given 2 more years to retool the core of the roster instead of hiring a shitty GM like treliving or whoever other dinosaur who will sign Gudbranson to 4x4 in UFA

 

[hullsy47]

Look at our roster and explain to me how it is on the GM. Dubas came into a situation with 3 stars who had produced on their ELC's (which is different than every other team) and had to sign them as a rookie. Even if you say those signings were poor, he rebuilt the entire roster under a flat cap from a soft run and gun team to a team that was one of the best defensive teams in the league with depth that played the right way to win.

The roster coming onto the ice and looking as if they have never played hockey together is not the GM's fault. You guys cry hard about the Kadri trade, how would you like to see Nylander be that but even worse because no one is paying the value for him we have due to the same reasons boomers hate him.

So you are basically saying you want to trade a under 24/25 franchise C who is breaking franchise records left and right after not having one of them forever or Marner who we all know how good he is and how important he is to the team. Those moves were what made us not a first round laughing stock, but a regular season one years before.

All to say, his biggest "mistake" was being loyal to an under 25 group of superstars hoping they would figure it out. I don't want to hear about Tavares signing either because it's hindsight bs, every fan was hyped about that signing and thought it meant a cup was coming home.

Like usual, Dubas will move on and lift the cup elsewhere, along with likely Matthews/marner/Nylander/whoever else we scapegoat out of town. And we'll have the same folks crying today sitting there 5 years from now calling whoever a clown for trading these guys.

But I do think if this loss happens, even Dubas recognizes the time for change to the core. I am of the opinion he should be given 2 more years to retool the core of the roster instead of hiring a shitty GM like treliving or whoever other dinosaur who will sign Gudbranson to 4x4 in UFA

it all depends what u get back if these above mentioned leave
12 teams in this years playoffs got over 100 points
im sure there are some very good hockey people who could do very well the extra money MSLE pour into the leafs front office
the bruins and tampa bay seem to find ways to get better
the leadership on this team is lacking
saying dubas will hoist the cup elsewhere is premature
i

 

[HamiltonNHL]

We have 3 shooters (Matthews, Nylander, Tavares) and 1 passer (Marner).

At least Nylander can carry the puck. Matthews and Tavares are making 11 and can't effectively carry the puck.

Comedy level cap management.

Dubas got his guy Keefe and they both need to go.

 

[seventieslord]

If Leafs' history has shown us anything, this scenario pretty much guarantees an Ottawa Stanley Cup under Dubas next year. To make it even more cruel, they'll knock off Toronto in the first round after going 0-3 to start the series and in the process extend the Leafs first round misery to 8 consecutive seasons.

(Oh, did I mention next trade deadline the new Toronto GM will trade another first round pick on a goalie who is in net for the Leafs epic collapse. And that pick ends up being the next McDavid.)

tlrd; Please, don't tempt fate.

what first round pick? We will already be without one after spending it to unload Matt Murray.

 

[rocketman588]

Game one is exactly why you don't have a public feud and negotiating battle with your employers RIGHT BEFORE the biggest series of your life.

So f***ing dumb

Missing out on good talent or showing respect for talent when you have it is a classic sign on a dysfunctional organization. Basing your decisions on the fact Babcock is a psycho, is stupid.

They based their decision more on the fact that their staffing budget got f***ed because Dubas canned Babs then torched his career on the way out so they had to pay the entire 25 mil more then anything

 

[HamiltonNHL]

But I do think if this loss happens, even Dubas recognizes the time for change to the core. I am of the opinion he should be given 2 more years to retool the core of the roster instead of hiring a shitty GM like treliving or whoever other dinosaur who will sign Gudbranson to 4x4 in UFA

If the Leafs don't make it out of Round 1, then you just keep SDK long enough to sign Matthews. Shanny has to go first. And you can Dubas and Keefe together later.

 

[ITM]

We have 3 shooters (Matthews, Nylander, Tavares) and 1 passer (Marner).

At least Nylander can carry the puck. Matthews and Tavares are making 11 and can't effectively carry the puck.

Comedy level cap management.

Dubas got his guy Keefe and they both need to go.

At the very least Keefe is done. I think - and reasonably so, credit where its due - that Dubas believed Keefe was his Cooper.

There are times when our team looks great. In those instances, we're playing without so called core pieces. I'm looking at you Morgan Reilly.

I think the common denominator is loyalty past efficiency. Some piece or pieces in this gang will have to be removed on principal.

So if it's Dubas axing Keefe, trading Reilly, and creating Nylander as the contractual bar that isn't passed by ANYONE...Those are steps that draw the line in the sand that say: The club comes first. Or...We will then know our club is only a business and MLSE thinks the fans exist for their pleasure and profit.

I can see a staggering amount of fans announcing for themselves: "We have trade to announce..." while they put on the jersey of another club to support.

If this isn't a hockey club determined to win the Stanley Cup and we're just a business strategy to support the NHL and MLSE owners, then this is The Toronto Maple Leafs in name only.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

At the very least Keefe is done. I think - and reasonably so, credit where its due - that Dubas believed Keefe was his Cooper.

Keefe and Dubas get canned together.

So if it's Dubas axing Keefe

Will never happen. Dubas would rather go down as well.

trading Reilly

hard to hockey trade him. He's going to Robidas Island sooner than expected. His body is kinda done anyway.

Or...We will then know our club is only a business and MLSE thinks the fans exist for their pleasure and profit.

it is. It's fan myth that the players care that much.

If this isn't a hockey club determined to win the Stanley Cup and we're just a business strategy to support the NHL and MLSE owners, then this is The Toronto Maple Leafs in name only.

LINO.

It's just business for MLSE. And the hostage contracts of Matthews and Marner are indications they dont care about winning either. Boston and Tampa created a culture leave money on the table for teammates.

Dubas got blind sided when Nylander didn't take the "Let's create a winning team" discount. And Matthews and Marner were either greedy or unhappy or both and they maxxed out their contracts.

It's very hard to construct a winning NHL hockey team in the cap era. The odds were stacked against us. This team isnt it. Even if they win a round, it's time to change the plan. But only if it's about winning. Which it isnt.

 

[All Mod Cons]

Look at our roster and explain to me how it is on the GM. Dubas came into a situation with 3 stars who had produced on their ELC's (which is different than every other team) and had to sign them as a rookie. Even if you say those signings were poor, he rebuilt the entire roster under a flat cap from a soft run and gun team to a team that was one of the best defensive teams in the league with depth that played the right way to win.

The roster coming onto the ice and looking as if they have never played hockey together is not the GM's fault. You guys cry hard about the Kadri trade, how would you like to see Nylander be that but even worse because no one is paying the value for him we have due to the same reasons boomers hate him.

So you are basically saying you want to trade a under 24/25 franchise C who is breaking franchise records left and right after not having one of them forever or Marner who we all know how good he is and how important he is to the team. Those moves were what made us not a first round laughing stock, but a regular season one years before.

All to say, his biggest "mistake" was being loyal to an under 25 group of superstars hoping they would figure it out. I don't want to hear about Tavares signing either because it's hindsight bs, every fan was hyped about that signing and thought it meant a cup was coming home.

Like usual, Dubas will move on and lift the cup elsewhere, along with likely Matthews/marner/Nylander/whoever else we scapegoat out of town. And we'll have the same folks crying today sitting there 5 years from now calling whoever a clown for trading these guys.

But I do think if this loss happens, even Dubas recognizes the time for change to the core. I am of the opinion he should be given 2 more years to retool the core of the roster instead of hiring a shitty GM like treliving or whoever other dinosaur who will sign Gudbranson to 4x4 in UFA

How many GMs gave signed Gudbranson?

 

[Stephen]

I do feel bad that the Leafs played like that in Game 1 after Dubas put together that roster.

 

[fahad203]

Look at our roster and explain to me how it is on the GM. Dubas came into a situation with 3 stars who had produced on their ELC's (which is different than every other team) and had to sign them as a rookie. Even if you say those signings were poor, he rebuilt the entire roster under a flat cap from a soft run and gun team to a team that was one of the best defensive teams in the league with depth that played the right way to win.

The roster coming onto the ice and looking as if they have never played hockey together is not the GM's fault. You guys cry hard about the Kadri trade, how would you like to see Nylander be that but even worse because no one is paying the value for him we have due to the same reasons boomers hate him.

So you are basically saying you want to trade a under 24/25 franchise C who is breaking franchise records left and right after not having one of them forever or Marner who we all know how good he is and how important he is to the team. Those moves were what made us not a first round laughing stock, but a regular season one years before.

All to say, his biggest "mistake" was being loyal to an under 25 group of superstars hoping they would figure it out. I don't want to hear about Tavares signing either because it's hindsight bs, every fan was hyped about that signing and thought it meant a cup was coming home.

Like usual, Dubas will move on and lift the cup elsewhere, along with likely Matthews/marner/Nylander/whoever else we scapegoat out of town. And we'll have the same folks crying today sitting there 5 years from now calling whoever a clown for trading these guys.

But I do think if this loss happens, even Dubas recognizes the time for change to the core. I am of the opinion he should be given 2 more years to retool the core of the roster instead of hiring a shitty GM like treliving or whoever other dinosaur who will sign Gudbranson to 4x4 in UFA

He gave his best buddy a job in Keefe. Then kept him along after all the disasters that he produced so far

Keefe tenure as a coach
The Zamboni saga
Losing to Montreal being up 3-1. Having 3 opportunities to close it out
Losing to Tampa being up 3-2 having 2 opportunities to close it out

Despite all that Keefe hasn't been fired. His indecision about Keefe is we are where we are.

Keep changing the cooks in the kitchen but keeping the captain of the ship in titanic won't change much about it's fate

He's too attached to Keefe. He should have been fired about Montreal. Gallant was available taht year. He should have been fired Tampa last year. Cassidy was available

Keefe will be gone. Dubas will fire him. Just like everything else with Kyle, 2 years too late.


At this point, frankly speaking I don't care who stays who goes. If he can go to Ottawa and win a Stanly cup, good for him. Why hasn't he done that here yet?

We going cry about him in 5 years? that's a chance most of us willing to take. He has had 5 years now to prove something and hasn't done jack

At some point, results matter