Toggle sidebar

Kyle Dubas Discussion (continued) the 2021 edition

  • Xenforo Cloud has upgraded us to version 2.3.6. Please report any issues you experience.
Status
Not open for further replies.
LeafsNation75 said:
Maybe if Lamoriello got Nylander to sign a contract extension before the 2017-18 season had started since could have done that starting on July 1, 2017 until the day he was no longer the GM, maybe it would have made things easier when Dubas worked on the contract extensions for Matthews and Marner.
Click to expand...

You can’t force the other party to sign a contract. Sure, you can negotiate and try to convince them, but at the end of the day, if their demands are unreasonable, there isn’t much you can do. Either sign a bad contract or keep trying to negotiate.
 
Pookie said:
Well, Grundstrom was taken in the 2nd round. He was part of the package that went to LA for Jake Muzzin. So, is that not worth something?
Click to expand...
True but that’s about it.

Draft even first rounder is a crap shoot and I think if 2 of the 7 draft picks each year can become NHLers, that’s average. Ofcourse if 1 or both picks regardless of where they were picked become Superstars, that’s a huge win for the team.
I don’t think Lou and Hunter left the cupboard empty, the cupboard might not had top talents but I think that had more to do with draft position more than anything.
Could Lou traded one or more of Bozak, JVR and even Leo for more picks and not trade away 2nd rounders to get Boyle and Turtleneck, that’s another question. Or Hunter should have a drafted him or him instead of him, that’s just too many what if.
 
Dreakmur said:
You can’t force the other party to sign a contract. Sure, you can negotiate and try to convince them, but at the end of the day, if their demands are unreasonable, there isn’t much you can do. Either sign a bad contract or keep trying to negotiate.
Click to expand...

Lou's public policy and advice to Dubas was to use all the time you have on contracts, there's nothing in his body of work that would suggest he would have made a serious effort to sign Nylander until his ELC was up.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Menzinger, stopclickbait, LeafsNation75 and 1 other person
Pookie said:
Let's not play this silly game of twist.

The original quote I responded to was this:



To which I wondered how Hunter and Lou left the Cupboard empty.

Under them we were given 21 picks by the League. They went to the draft table 27 times, having made moves to acquire more assets. So that's a net gain.

They acquired more picks than those 27 though and parlayed them into assets to bring talent in such as Andersen and Kapanen. They were astute on the waiver wire picking up McElhinney.

On the draft front, they landed Marner, Matthews, Dermott and Liljgren who have all made positive contributions to the team.

From a Cupboard perspective... it was far from empty when Dubas got it. Most GMs would salivate over what they had.

Cupboard empty? No. Myth busted.

You then added a nuance to this:



So ignoring the drafted mega stars and talented D men and the picks they turned into a starting goalie and solid player... did they draft well?

Impossible to say. It's too early.

And way too early to compare draft records of the current GM to Lou's.

That's where we are.
Click to expand...

Dubas traded for Kapanen
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dekes For Days, Jimmy Firecracker, stopclickbait and 3 others
zeke said:
Lou completely wasted having the best collection of ELC talent in the league. Getting lucky with a 35yr old backup goalie made him look much better than he was.

That's what happened.
Click to expand...


Yes, the two years after Babcock told us to "prepare for pain" because we're in rebuild mode, the leafs should have been playoff warriors. Insane. The revisionist history here is simply outrageous.

Can you imagine if Dubas completed a flat out miraculous rebuild, and then won 3 playoff rounds and 1 play in round in two years. Can you IMAGINE if people wrote that off as "lucky" and that he should have "won more playoff rounds during the rebuilding years".

I guarantee that once (if ever... lol) Dubas's team starts seeing success on the ice, the results will stand for themselves and questioning them in any way will be labeled as "trolling", "stubbornness", and "hate".
 
  • Like
Reactions: Bomber0104
Menzinger said:
If you'd like to focus on tangible things like like results, you could look at the amount of Leafs prospects (or lack there of) who have graduated from those draft classes outside of the top 5 selections into impact NHLers. So far we have a #5 D man, and that's it.
Click to expand...

So..... we haven't had many players graduate from our development system to the NHL from 2015-2017 eh?

who was in charge of that development system?

images
 
  • Like
Reactions: rumman
Throw More Waffles said:
Yes, the two years after Babcock told us to "prepare for pain" because we're in rebuild mode, the leafs should have been playoff warriors. Insane. The revisionist history here is simply outrageous.

Can you imagine if Dubas completed a flat out miraculous rebuild, and then won 3 playoff rounds and 1 play in round in two years. Can you IMAGINE if people wrote that off as "lucky" and that he should have "won more playoff rounds during the rebuilding years".

I guarantee that once (if ever... lol) Dubas's team starts seeing success on the ice, the results will stand for themselves and questioning them in any way will be labeled as "trolling", "stubbornness", and "hate".
Click to expand...

List the key pieces Lou left us with after his great rebuild.
 
  • Like
Reactions: LeafsNation75
Assistant general manager Dubas likes stockpiling picks but said that Kapanen, a smooth-skating 18-year-old winger who was a 2014 first-rounder, was the key.

“If Kapanen wasn’t in the deal, I don’t think we’d be standing here,” Dubas said “He’s a highly-skilled guy with excellent feet. … He’s a player with a lot of potential.”

Seems Dubas did all the homework and scouting and then let Lou pull the trigger. Such a nice boy. Gramma Dubie must have raised him right.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Antropovsky, LeafsNation75, The Podium and 1 other person
Pookie said:
So..... we haven't had many players graduate from our development system to the NHL from 2015-2017 eh?

who was in charge of that development system?

images
Click to expand...
just players like Holl, Johnsson, Kapanen, Hyman, Nylander, Moore, Brown, Engvall. Unfortunately that list doesn't really include players drafted by Hunter/Lou, since they were bad at it
 
  • Like
Reactions: Oscar Peterson, Heritage, Jimmy Firecracker and 3 others
Pookie said:
So..... we haven't had many players graduate from our development system to the NHL from 2015-2017 eh?

who was in charge of that development system?

images
Click to expand...

Players drafted from 2015-2017 didn’t play in the AHL from 2015-2017 with the exception of Grundstrom*


Players that did play on the Marlies between 2015-2017 and have seen time in the NHL:
Nylander
Hyman
Connor Brown
Kapanen
Leivo
Sam Carrick
Soshnikov
Holl
Gauthier
Panik
Leipsic
Andreas Johnsson
Byron Froese
Trevor Moore
Timashov
Dermott
Engvall
Rosen
Brooks
Borgman
Grundstrom*
Garrett Sparks
Bibeau
Kaskisuo
 
  • Like
Reactions: deprw, Heritage, Jimmy Firecracker and 2 others
MattySnipes said:
Assistant general manager Dubas likes stockpiling picks but said that Kapanen, a smooth-skating 18-year-old winger who was a 2014 first-rounder, was the key.

“If Kapanen wasn’t in the deal, I don’t think we’d be standing here,” Dubas said “He’s a highly-skilled guy with excellent feet. … He’s a player with a lot of potential.”

Seems Dubas did all the homework and scouting and then let Lou pull the trigger. Such a nice boy. Gramma Dubie must have raised him right.
Click to expand...

Lou wasn’t part of the organization yet when that deal was made
 
  • Like
Reactions: LeafsNation75
Gabriel426 said:
True but that’s about it.

Draft even first rounder is a crap shoot and I think if 2 of the 7 draft picks each year can become NHLers, that’s average. Ofcourse if 1 or both picks regardless of where they were picked become Superstars, that’s a huge win for the team.
I don’t think Lou and Hunter left the cupboard empty, the cupboard might not had top talents but I think that had more to do with draft position more than anything.
Could Lou traded one or more of Bozak, JVR and even Leo for more picks and not trade away 2nd rounders to get Boyle and Turtleneck, that’s another question. Or Hunter should have a drafted him or him instead of him, that’s just too many what if.
Click to expand...

It would have been interesting to see another Hunter NHL draft away from Lou, either with the Leafs or another team. Because its hard for outsiders to figure out how much GM influence there was on those draft selections.

Hunter joined the organization to much fanfare but I think things looked less impressive as time went on. Now how much of that is poor decision making vs bad luck vs taking orders from above is up for debate
 
  • Like
Reactions: Beleafer34, Jimmy Firecracker, Gabriel426 and 2 others
MattySnipes said:
Yes he wasn't but Kyle is such a nice guy he got him a nice welcome present like Kapanen upon joining team. Now fans have forgotten and give credit to Hunter and Lamoriello. Pft.
Click to expand...
Right.
Cause Kap is sooo good.
Barely an NHL guy.
Pft.
 
The Podium said:
Players drafted from 2015-2017 didn’t play in the AHL from 2015-2017 with the exception of Grundstrom*


Players that did play on the Marlies between 2015-2017 and have seen time in the NHL:
Nylander
Hyman
Connor Brown
Kapanen
Leivo
Sam Carrick
Soshnikov
Holl
Gauthier
Panik
Leipsic
Andreas Johnsson
Byron Froese
Trevor Moore
Timashov
Dermott
Engvall
Rosen
Brooks
Borgman
Grundstrom*
Garrett Sparks
Bibeau
Kaskisuo
Click to expand...

So the bolded all came here with Lou and/or Hunter involved.

17 of the 24 on your list.

Can you Duba-fans have a huddle and let us know if we'd had success in promoting players or if it has been an empty cupboard experience?

Seems like you are walking both sides of the line on this one.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest posts

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Top Bottom