Kitchener Rangers 2023-24 Off-Season Thread (Part 2)

[Ward Cornell]

deleted due to repetition

 

[dirty12]

I can’t imagine a better offer for Rehkopf at any point; 10 picks including ‘25-2,3,3,4 picks was a great haul imo. The PBO picks could be the first in rounds 2 & 3.

 

[bobber]

deleted due to repetition

Ward I think you spelled reputation wrong!

 

[Krangers08]

Gaitens had a goal and assist in his first preseason game. Was on the top pairing and quarterbacking the PP.

Listed as 6 ft 183 lbs on the game sheet but listed at 6ft 150 lbs on the rangers site.

*Komoka only had 8 wins last year so he should get plenty of opportunity to develop.

 

[EvenSteven]

I can’t imagine a better offer for Rehkopf at any point; 10 picks including ‘25-2,3,3,4 picks was a great haul imo. The PBO picks could be the first in rounds 2 & 3.

Initially, I criticized the deal a little for not getting two 2nds in ‘25. I gave the deal a B+ I think.

But when you spell it out the way you did, picks in the ‘25 draft (2nd, 3rd, 3rd), two of those picks being Peterboro’s, they will be in the front of those rounds. Add in the ‘25 4th and in one trade, that only did we fill out most of the cupboard’s vacant slots in the 2nd, 3rd, 4th rounds, we gave ourselves some more than decent picks for the 25 draft.

All that in one trade, with Andonovski and Swick still to move.

I’d like to switch my grade on the trade to an A.

As I said in my B+ ranking post, if there is another shoe to drop, and there’s a Valentinii coming our way, in the not too distant future, I’ll change that ranking to an A++!!

 

[Gondrex]

Initially, I criticized the deal a little for not getting two 2nds in ‘25. I gave the deal a B+ I think.

But when you spell it out the way you did, picks in the ‘25 draft (2nd, 3rd, 3rd), two of those picks being Peterboro’s, they will be in the front of those rounds. Add in the ‘25 4th and in one trade, that only did we fill out most of the cupboard’s vacant slots in the 2nd, 3rd, 4th rounds, we gave ourselves some more than decent picks for the 25 draft.

All that in one trade, with Andonovski and Swick still to move.

I’d like to switch my grade on the trade to an A.

As I said in my B+ ranking post, if there is another shoe to drop, and there’s a Valentinii coming our way, in the not too distant future, I’ll change that ranking to an A++!!

ES, I admit that originally I had thought the Valentini possibility was really “out there”. I have no idea what the actual odds are, but I’m now warming up to the thought. We of course don’t know for sure, but we’ve seen less likely outcomes occur.

Let’s say for the heck of it now that it does occur. So you would then theoretically have a pretty good group of 07’s an 08’s - awesome. However, then aside from the great add (the assumed acquisition of Valentini), the team is then presumably back to square one again regarding the draft cupboard. It seems like a “great but….” situation. An Andonovski trade would help replenish somewhat, but two years from now I think you’d want a surplus of picks for buying power at the trade deadline down the road IMO.

I still think MM went in way too deep in the recent past, and here we are now. Having said that MM does seem to have something up his sleeve every once in awhile. Just hope it’s multiple Aces. At this point in time I think he is going to need them.

 

[Jives]

Those picks can’t go back in a Valentini trade so unless we go after a different 2008 those picks are ours until traded in the future or we use them as draft picks. I can see an Ando for Valentini trade which would be pretty close to straight up imo. So we would have a lot our picks back in Rehkopf trade and then add one of the best 2008 in a Ando trade. We could further our picks by trading Swick, Parsons and Misa. The added ice time may help the trade value of Mercer. I think he will be a solid 3rd line vet shut down center on a team going for it. For the most part we are all leaving out Sale too who gives us the chance to add a 2007 or 2008 import switch in a trade and / or added picks. I’d say Sale chances of returning are higher than 80%. As bad as the trades the last 2 years hurt us I still like the look of the mem cup year team.

 

[EvenSteven]

ES, I admit that originally I had thought the Valentini possibility was really “out there”. I have no idea what the actual odds are, but I’m now warming up to the thought. We of course don’t know for sure, but we’ve seen less likely outcomes occur.

Let’s say for the heck of it now that it does occur. So you would then theoretically have a pretty good group of 07’s an 08’s - awesome. However, then aside from the great add (the assumed acquisition of Valentini), the team is then presumably back to square one again regarding the draft cupboard. It seems like a “great but….” situation. An Andonovski trade would help replenish somewhat, but two years from now I think you’d want a surplus of picks for buying power at the trade deadline down the road IMO.

I still think MM went in way too deep in the recent past, and here we are now. Having said that MM does seem to have something up his sleeve every once in awhile. Just hope it’s multiple Aces. At this point in time I think he is going to need them.

For a Valentini to Kitchener trade to happen as a defected player, none of the draft picks that we got from Brampton in the Rehkopf deal who can be used to acquire Valentini. That’s due to the “no two-way trades” rule.

So the only real assets that we have to send to Brampton in a Valentini deal would be our 2nd, 3rd, 4th in ‘28.

If you were to look at that as a stand alone deal, the return for Valentini would be a little light. But, the return we got from Sudbury for Micheal Hage was very light as well considering the calibre player. What is the same about both Valentini and Hage is that both have committed elsewhere already and are “not “coming to the OHL. Under those circumstances, a Valentini trade for those picks wouldn’t be a real stretch.

But if this trade were to be expanded to be a part of a two-part deal that saw Andonovski included, then we may have something here that would make more sense from the Brampton end. I know I posted something close to this earlier on, but:

Recognizing that the value of Andonovski should be in the ballpark of the Jorian Donovan return, and the value of a high end, high ranked 16 year-old defected player, who will report is the standard 3 x 2nds and 3 x 3rds, the following would make sense in the grand scheme of things:

To Brampton :
2nd, 3rd, 4th all in ‘28 (Kit)
To Kitchener:
Valentini.

Then, afterwards:

To Brampton:
Andonovski
To Kitchener:
2nd, 3rd, 4th all in ‘28 (Bram)

At the end of the day, the entire transaction between Brampton and Kitchener, including the Rehkopf deal even though on the surface, it “didn’t” have anything to do with the Valentini and Andonovski deals, is part of one big negotiation:

To Brampton:
Rehkopf
Andonovski
2nd, 3rd, 4th in ‘28 (Kit)
Comp 1st in ‘26

To Kitchener:
Valentini
3 x 2nds, 3 x 3rds, 3 x 4ths, 7th
2nd, 3rd, 4th, in ‘28 (Bram)

This transaction sets Brampton up very well for this season’s run. They get an elite forward and arguably the top D made available in trade this year, for the whole season. They also get that comp 1st pick ‘25 to go with their own first round pick next year to kick off their rebuild.

This transaction sets Kitchener up very well for the future. They get the pick return that they needed to refill the draft cupboard, and they get an ‘08 player who should be a major contributor in 26–27.

Once you recognize that Andonovski’s value is that of Jorian Donovan, (2 x 2nds, 4 x 3rds, 2 x 4ths), Brampton does get close to the standard return for a defected player that will report. The ‘28 picks are a wash.

Those picks can’t go back in a Valentini trade so unless we go after a different 2008 those picks are ours until traded in the future or we use them as draft picks. I can see an Ando for Valentini trade which would be pretty close to straight up imo. So we would have a lot our picks back in Rehkopf trade and then add one of the best 2008 in a Ando trade. We could further our picks by trading Swick, Parsons and Misa. The added ice time may help the trade value of Mercer. I think he will be a solid 3rd line vet shut down center on a team going for it. For the most part we are all leaving out Sale too who gives us the chance to add a 2007 or 2008 import switch in a trade and / or added picks. I’d say Sale chances of returning are higher than 80%. As bad as the trades the last 2 years hurt us I still like the look of the mem cup year team.

Sort of the short form of what I just posted!

 

[Gondrex]

If the team manages to find a trading partner for Parsons and / or Miseljevic it is going to have to be that right team with a specific need in order to get anything significant in return IMO. Parsons I think has somewhat proven himself, I think one could argue, however I believe there is a goalie glut. Miseljevic had a very good first-half last season but tailed off after that. I think he has the potential, if there are any believers out there. He lacks physicality and size if that is any concern though.

Swick likely has more trade value, but as mentioned previously, is there an excess of LW OA’s ? But - he does have size, great wingspan that seems effective on the PK, and parks himself nicely in front of the net on the PP. So some good attributes.

If you’re looking to replace a traded player by another older player on the cheap, then IMO presently you would be trading Mercer for another Mercer. If an older player is not a goal scorer he needs to have some other attribute(s). I think Mercer is decent on the PK, but how you get ahead net positive in a trade is hard for me to see at this point.

 

[ScoutLife4]

I'm hearing Kitchener is very interested in Frasca from Kingston and they are trying to work a deal to move Andonovsi there.
Be interesting if Brampton is actually in the mix now.

 

[EvenSteven]

If the team manages to find a trading partner for Parsons and / or Miseljevic it is going to have to be that right team with a specific need in order to get anything significant in return IMO. Parsons I think has somewhat proven himself, I think one could argue, however I believe there is a goalie glut. Miseljevic had a very good first-half last season but tailed off after that. I think he has the potential, if there are any believers out there. He lacks physicality and size if that is any concern though.

Swick likely has more trade value, but as mentioned previously, is there an excess of LW OA’s ? But - he does have size, great wingspan that seems effective on the PK, and parks himself nicely in front of the net on the PP. So some good attributes.

If you’re looking to replace a traded player by another older player on the cheap, then IMO presently you would be trading Mercer for another Mercer. If an older player is not a goal scorer he needs to have some other attribute(s). I think Mercer is decent on the PK, but how you get ahead net positive in a trade is hard for me to see at this point.

As far as our OA’s go, I see us going with Parsons and Edwards for now. I don’t think there’s much of a trade market for Parsons for any value at this point because there are not likely teams looking for goalies and those that are, would lowball us on Parsons. OA goalies are hard to get value for, especially preseason.

I think the best opportunity for decent return on Parsons is into the season. If there is a team who already has their goaltending in place, has their starter suffer a season ending injury, Parsons would be a good get for that team.

I’d be looking to move Swick sooner than later. But as you say, if there is a glut of LW OA’s, it might be tough getting value for him. He may have to come out of the gate having a better than average season putting points on the board and dominating physically. That would significantly raise interest.

I think it’s likely that Miseljevic will have to prove himself in the first half of this season. Should he have a first half like he did last year, there being a shortage of OA RW’s, he could bring decent value at the deadline.

Guys like Pugliese and Mercer, who don’t have much trade value, we keep here as “good soldiers” to provide veteran presence on the team. If we are successful in moving out the above OA forwards, we may bring another veteran “good soldier” type player or two, on the cheap, to help provide veteran presence on the team.

 

[EvenSteven]

I'm hearing Kitchener is very interested in Frasca from Kingston and they are trying to work a deal to move Andonovsi there.
Be interesting if Brampton is actually in the mix now.

No disrespect to Frasca, but him being an 06, I’m not in favour of moving a big chip like Andonovski, where Frasca is the main piece coming back.

 

[dirty12]

No disrespect to Frasca, but him being an 06, I’m not in favour of moving a big chip like Andonovski, where Frasca is the main piece coming back.

He should be a very good OA when the Kitchener window of opportunity opens.

Gibson or an OA D might make more sense for Kingston, but can’t always get what you want.

 

[EvenSteven]

He should be a very good OA when the Kitchener window of opportunity opens.

Gibson or an OA D might make more sense for Kingston, but can’t always get what you want.

Frasca being undrafted, I suppose could be considered to be in the same category as Reid Valade : A 1st round pick who’ll play five years of this league.

Hopefully, if this does come to fruition, there’s a decent pick package coming along with Frasca.

Is there any reason a team looking to contend this year is looking to trade their 06 first rounder? Does the player want out or has the team deemed him expendable?

 

[ScoutLife4]

Frasca being undrafted, I suppose could be considered to be in the same category as Reid Valade : A 1st round pick who’ll play five years of this league.

Hopefully, if this does come to fruition, there’s a decent pick package coming along with Frasca.

Is there any reason a team looking to contend this year is looking to trade their 06 first rounder? Does the player want out or has the team deemed him expendable?

Frasca wants out of Kingston and is refusing to report

 

[dirty12]

Frasca being undrafted, I suppose could be considered to be in the same category as Reid Valade : A 1st round pick who’ll play five years of this league.

Hopefully, if this does come to fruition, there’s a decent pick package coming along with Frasca.

Is there any reason a team looking to contend this year is looking to trade their 06 first rounder? Does the player want out or has the team deemed him expendable?

Good pick and decent pick probably returns

 

[EvenSteven]

Frasca wants out of Kingston and is refusing to report

That should affect his value a little I would think.

 

[ScoutLife4]

That should affect his value a little I would think.

It can for sure.

 

[OnlyUpFromHere]

He should be a very good OA when the Kitchener window of opportunity opens.

Gibson or an OA D might make more sense for Kingston, but can’t always get what you want.

One thing to keep in mind too if the situation presented itself where Frasca gets drafted in 2025 and there's a strong possibility of no OA season, he becomes a potential 2026 deadline asset the Rangers could flip to stack up on more assets for the planned 2027 Mem Cup run/hosting bid.

 

[Gondrex]

Those picks can’t go back in a Valentini trade so unless we go after a different 2008 those picks are ours until traded in the future or we use them as draft picks. I can see an Ando for Valentini trade which would be pretty close to straight up imo. So we would have a lot our picks back in Rehkopf trade and then add one of the best 2008 in a Ando trade. We could further our picks by trading Swick, Parsons and Misa. The added ice time may help the trade value of Mercer. I think he will be a solid 3rd line vet shut down center on a team going for it. For the most part we are all leaving out Sale too who gives us the chance to add a 2007 or 2008 import switch in a trade and / or added picks. I’d say Sale chances of returning are higher than 80%. As bad as the trades the last 2 years hurt us I still like the look of the mem cup year team.

As far as our OA’s go, I see us going with Parsons and Edwards for now. I don’t think there’s much of a trade market for Parsons for any value at this point because there are not likely teams looking for goalies and those that are, would lowball us on Parsons. OA goalies are hard to get value for, especially preseason.

I think the best opportunity for decent return on Parsons is into the season. If there is a team who already has their goaltending in place, has their starter suffer a season ending injury, Parsons would be a good get for that team.

I’d be looking to move Swick sooner than later. But as you say, if there is a glut of LW OA’s, it might be tough getting value for him. He may have to come out of the gate having a better than average season putting points on the board and dominating physically. That would significantly raise interest.

I think it’s likely that Miseljevic will have to prove himself in the first half of this season. Should he have a first half like he did last year, there being a shortage of OA RW’s, he could bring decent value at the deadline.

Guys like Pugliese and Mercer, who don’t have much trade value, we keep here as “good soldiers” to provide veteran presence on the team. If we are successful in moving out the above OA forwards, we may bring another veteran “good soldier” type player or two, on the cheap, to help provide veteran presence on the team.

I guess my point is it seems to create a perpetual kicking of the “draft debt can” down the road. I see another sell-off yet again in the future if this were to happen. I guess I admit I have a bit of a bias since I don’t live my personal life that way. I’d personally like to see a surplus within a couple years because there will likely be other teams that will have that advantage. Kitchener is not the only team with a good crop of 07’s. Guelph and Peterborough come to mind. The Soo too, but seems to have into 08 issues unfortunately.

At the end of the day I’m only a keyboard GM. So I will only point this out as a present concern and realize that it is a process, and we need to see how it plays out. Like I said MM has his ways of figuring things out. Picking up Diraccola was one example.

 

[frontsfan67]

One thing to keep in mind too if the situation presented itself where Frasca gets drafted in 2025 and there's a strong possibility of no OA season, he becomes a potential 2026 deadline asset the Rangers could flip to stack up on more assets for the planned 2027 Mem Cup run/hosting bid.

Exactly my thinking- trade him next year for picks and push those picks into 2027 or 2028 as bargaining pieces for when they inevitably win the m cup bid and use those picks in their go for it year.

Kitchener gm is playing chess not checkers

 

[Petes1987]

That should affect his value a little I would think.

I am thinking the return will likely be at most two, 2nds and two, 3rds.

 

[Rangers True Blue]

Worked out for Hage and Celebrini.........why not Valentini?

The Hockey News August 12th.....

Chicago Steel
Adam Valentini, F (2026)

The Chicago Steel will feature a relatively young nucleus of players in the upcoming 2024–25 season, and tender signing Adam Valentini figures to be at the center of it.

The 16-year-old forward, listed at 5-foot-11 and 183 pounds, was named the Greater Toronto Hockey League (GTHL) Player of the Year after recording 67 points in 32 games with the Toronto Marlboros U16 AAA squad last year.

Valentini, who recently committed to the University of Michigan, brings a high level of intelligence to the USHL and features an accurate and heavy shot that makes him a dangerous scorer anywhere within the offensive zone.

 

[Jives]

Frasca I have very little interest in. If we are spending picks a 2007 / 2008 is what we should be looking for. It’s always a gamble on projecting a player to be an OA. At the beginning of last season I’d say forsure Ellinas would be an OA option and not a very strong one. He was the most improved player last year and I don’t see how he is back as an OA. Max when signed I thought would be a decent OA. He has 2 years to improve and he got better last year for sure. If he improves his first couple of strides then I really like what he can be at 19 risking him not being back as an OA. Campbell, Bott and Hlacar are our other 2006 players and I think will be back as OAs.

I’d rather see what what we have mem cup year with OAs and trade for some if needed that season then blow picks right now and hope that player is playing his OA year.

 

[OnlyUpFromHere]

Frasca I have very little interest in. If we are spending picks a 2007 / 2008 is what we should be looking for. It’s always a gamble on projecting a player to be an OA. At the beginning of last season I’d say forsure Ellinas would be an OA option and not a very strong one. He was the most improved player last year and I don’t see how he is back as an OA. Max when signed I thought would be a decent OA. He has 2 years to improve and he got better last year for sure. If he improves his first couple of strides then I really like what he can be at 19 risking him not being back as an OA. Campbell, Bott and Hlacar are our other 2006 players we I all think will be back as OAs.

I’d rather see what what we have mem cup year with OAs and trade for some if needed that season then blow picks right now and hope that player is playing his OA year.

Kitchener doesn’t need to worry about acquiring Frasca anymore I don’t think