Player Discussion Kirby Dach: Welcome to Montreal

[Wats]

It's also on the player to develop himself. You can't polish a turd. He's not playing any better on a much stronger team in Carolina so i guess they failed at developing him too?

Teams can offer guidance but coaches can't hold the players sticks when they play. The guy still looks the exact same way he did on his rookie year... 4 years later. I won't believe for a second nobody ever pointed out his glaring weaknesses on the ice and never tried fixing them with him.

KK plateaued early, and it's nobody's fault but his own.

I feel like some of you just like to blame the organization because you lack the humility to admit having been wrong about a player.

Actually if all the kids they acquired/drafted are that weak / unwilling to accept guidance, it is the organization's fault for not being able to identify this trait.

You can't just blame the player each time when the organization keeps getting these players. Why can't they draft low maintenance players like other teams where player develops themselves? What's next, blame the city fans media? Anyone but management...

 

[MoneyManny]

Actually if all the kids they acquired/drafted are that weak / unwilling to accept guidance, it is the organization's fault for not being able to identify this trait.

You can't just blame the player each time when the organization keeps getting these players. Why can't they draft low maintenance players like other teams where player develops themselves? What's next, blame the city fans media? Anyone but management...

He's not playing any better in Carolina, yet they "developped" their players very well. Are you going to blame the Hurricanes management for that?

Is it so hard for some of you to believe that some players just suck no matter where they were drafted? KK was by no means a 3rd OA, and was a massive reach by our geniuses in scouting.

in Detroit, do you blame the management team for failing to develop Zadina? Then how about Seider and Raymond, who's responsible?

 

[SlafySZN]

He's not playing any better in Carolina, yet they "developped" their players very well. Are you going to blame the Hurricanes management for that?

Is it so hard for some of you to believe that some players just suck no matter where they were drafted? KK was by no means a 3rd OA, and was a massive reach by our geniuses in scouting.

in Detroit, do you blame the management team for failing to develop Zadina? Then how about Seider and Raymond, who's responsible?

KK scored 29 points in 66 games last year playing around 9–10 minutes on the 4th line, i think he did good. They gave him stability and then will likely give him progressively a bigger role. Sure he doesn’t perform like a 3rd overall but they’re taking their time with him, something the old management never did.

 

[CHwest]

He's not playing any better in Carolina, yet they "developped" their players very well. Are you going to blame the Hurricanes management for that?

Is it so hard for some of you to believe that some players just suck no matter where they were drafted? KK was by no means a 3rd OA, and was a massive reach by our geniuses in scouting.

in Detroit, do you blame the management team for failing to develop Zadina? Then how about Seider and Raymond, who's responsible?

Dude you are running a fast food franchise, sink or swim. Big companies invest in the development of their employees, so should the Habs. KK was brought up at least 2 yrs and probably 3 yrs to soon. Bargain Bin just had to be able to show off the youngest player in the league. A few years in the minors would have probably taken out some of that cockiness and made him take a closer look at what he had to do to get to the show. When you are managing a fast food place you don't think about stuff like that.

 

[MoneyManny]

Dude you are running a fast food franchise, sink or swim. Big companies invest in the development of their employees, so should the Habs. KK was brought up at least 2 yrs and probably 3 yrs to soon. Bargain Bin just had to be able to show off the youngest player in the league. A few years in the minors would have probably taken out some of that cockiness and made him take a closer look at what he had to do to get to the show. When you are managing a fast food place you don't think about stuff like that.

I never said player development was not important. But saying that KK turned out the way he is because of X or X members of habs management is based on absolutely nothing but opinions and HFboards rumors.

His dad was fighting cancer, maybe it made him feel that job performance wasn't the most important thing in life and maybe he focused on his family instead? Maybe the love of his life left him for some dude that made his kids call him daddy and his career took a backseat?
Maybe he's just not as obsessed with his job as fans think every player is? Guy's making 4 millions a year, it's enough for some of us.

These guys are humans, not characters. Have you all reached your true peak potential? Have you sustained it? If not, are your bosses, parents and teachers to take 100% of the blame?

If you were paid 4 million $ a year to do a job, would you be willing to take a little responsability for your own success?

 

[BLONG7]

Scorched earth approach by trading away a 21 year old?

I’d get it if they were getting rid of say 26 year olds and older but the new players they’re looking to rise from their ashes with, won’t be that much younger than Dach.

I have to believe the reason they jettisoned Dach was cause they soured on the player not because he’d be incompatible with a rebuild.

Good point.............they seem to have a very strange approach right now.
Dach and Debrincat are hardly older players...........

 

[salbutera]

Dude you are running a fast food franchise, sink or swim. Big companies invest in the development of their employees, so should the Habs. KK was brought up at least 2 yrs and probably 3 yrs to soon. Bargain Bin just had to be able to show off the youngest player in the league. A few years in the minors would have probably taken out some of that cockiness and made him take a closer look at what he had to do to get to the show. When you are managing a fast food place you don't think about stuff like that.

I wouldn’t generalize - Google, Apple, Microsoft, Tesla etc. all spend little to $0 in development. As Bill Gates once said “our testing & criteria to hire people is filled w such rigor to only employ those ready to go on day 1 hour 1, the only thing needing developing is our software, if new hires need developing they shouldn’t be working for us”

I’ve spent my career working in investment banking, with top end as well as boutique firms, there’s zero development $ spent - it’s assumed the reason you exclusively recruit from top business schools & pay top $ is to get talent ready to contribute to the bottom line from the get go

 

[Tyson]

Good point.............they seem to have a very strange approach right now.
Dach and Debrincat are hardly older players...........

Having this conversation right now over texts with a die hard Hawks fiend!
He says the Hawks current roster is AHL level and that in his lifetime he has never seen a more inept management team. In one breath you sign Seth Jones to a huge contract then shortly thereafter you blow up the team.

 

[26Mats]

Having this conversation right now over texts with a die hard Hawks fiend!
He says the Hawks current roster is AHL level and that in his lifetime he has never seen a more inept management team. In one breath you sign Seth Jones to a huge contract then shortly thereafter you blow up the team.

I think Stan Bownan traded for Jones, no? And now Davidson is in charge and has seized trying to be good now in favor of a full rebuild. The rebuild is more extreme than any I can remember. But one can't accuse Davidson of not picking a direction, haha. But it sounds like ome of the reasons Highes thought Dach has untapped potential is because he was mis-managed by Chicago management.

 

[CHfan1]

Having this conversation right now over texts with a die hard Hawks fiend!
He says the Hawks current roster is AHL level and that in his lifetime he has never seen a more inept management team. In one breath you sign Seth Jones to a huge contract then shortly thereafter you blow up the team.

Not only did they sign Jones to a big contract they traded Boqvist, their 2021 12th overall, 2021 44th, and their 1st overall in 2022 for Jones and the 32nd pick in 2021 (plus some late picks).

Columbus ended up getting Boqvist, Sillinger, and Jiricek out of the deal. Chicago really could have used those players to help their rebuild.

 

[Runner77]

Having this conversation right now over texts with a die hard Hawks fiend!
He says the Hawks current roster is AHL level and that in his lifetime he has never seen a more inept management team. In one breath you sign Seth Jones to a huge contract then shortly thereafter you blow up the team.

I’m guessing your friend’s lifetime did not include any memory of Bill Wirtz’s ownership:

« But following the departures of Jeremy Roenick, Ed Belfour, and later Chris Chelios (traded to Detroit), the Blackhawks descended into a dark age of mediocrity and waning fan interest - all while under the control of "Dollar" Bill Wirtz. He refused to spend money to improve the team, even going so far as to forbid his general manager from trading for better talent because it would cost too much. This, combined with the refusal to broadcast home games on television, earned the scorn and hatred of Chicago sports fans everywhere. According to Wirtz, he believed that broadcasting home games on television for free was an insult to season ticket holders who paid to watch live in person. »

How much hatred did Hawks fans have for Wirtz?

« Following Wirtz's death in 2007, the Blackhawks held a pre-game ceremony before their home opener to honor their late owner and held a moment of silence in his memory - the entire crowd booed loudly, with Wirtz's family members front and center. »

Flashback: Chicago Blackhawks fans boo the late Bill Wirtz during a pre-game memorial

Safe to say, fans let their feelings of the late Hawks owner known.

www.hockeyfeed.com

Yeah, there’s been worse. Your friend must have been born yesterday.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

Boo Hoo cry me a river lol. I don't have an ounce of pity for the hawks org or fans.

Yeah im petty!!!!

 

[Captain Mountain]

Having this conversation right now over texts with a die hard Hawks fiend!
He says the Hawks current roster is AHL level and that in his lifetime he has never seen a more inept management team. In one breath you sign Seth Jones to a huge contract then shortly thereafter you blow up the team.

I'm assuming your friend is 20 or younger. Most of the Bill Wirtz/Pulford era was embarrassing.

 

[Runner77]

Boo Hoo cry me a river lol. I don't have an ounce of pity for the hawks org or fans.

Yeah im petty!!!!

Give me those 3 Cups in 13 years that they won not too long ago (2010-13-15) and I’d settle for a delapidated roster after the fact.

 

[Tyson]

I’m guessing your friend’s lifetime did not include any memory of Bill Wirtz’s ownership:

« But following the departures of Jeremy Roenick, Ed Belfour, and later Chris Chelios (traded to Detroit), the Blackhawks descended into a dark age of mediocrity and waning fan interest - all while under the control of "Dollar" Bill Wirtz. He refused to spend money to improve the team, even going so far as to forbid his general manager from trading for better talent because it would cost too much. This, combined with the refusal to broadcast home games on television, earned the scorn and hatred of Chicago sports fans everywhere. According to Wirtz, he believed that broadcasting home games on television for free was an insult to season ticket holders who paid to watch live in person. »

How much hatred did Hawks fans have for Wirtz?

« Following Wirtz's death in 2007, the Blackhawks held a pre-game ceremony before their home opener to honor their late owner and held a moment of silence in his memory - the entire crowd booed loudly, with Wirtz's family members front and center. »

Flashback: Chicago Blackhawks fans boo the late Bill Wirtz during a pre-game memorial

Safe to say, fans let their feelings of the late Hawks owner known.

www.hockeyfeed.com

Yeah, there’s been worse. Your friend must have been born yesterday.

Yeah he has a short memory but really only started becoming a fanatic in the past 10 years.

I'm assuming your friend is 20 or younger. Most of the Bill Wirtz/Pulford era was embarrassing.

An old timer like me. Kind weird because we served together in the military and he was from Buffalo and out of the blue around 10-12 years ago he was all about the Blackhawks.

 

[Captain Mountain]

Yeah he has a short memory but really only started becoming a fanatic in the past 10 years.


An old timer like me. Kind weird because we served together in the military and he was from Buffalo and out of the blue around 10-12 years ago he was all about the Blackhawks.

12 years ago was The Hawks first of 3 cups in the cap era. That's not out of the blue, that's bandwagoning.

 

[MarioLeMoose]

KK scored 29 points in 66 games last year playing around 9–10 minutes on the 4th line, i think he did good. They gave him stability and then will likely give him progressively a bigger role. Sure he doesn’t perform like a 3rd overall but they’re taking their time with him, something the old management never did.

To be fair, he averaged 12:01 minutes a night last year. The previous 3 seasons he averaged 13:56
He found himself on the 4th line because he wasn't good enough for the top 9

 

[SlafySZN]

To be fair, he averaged 12:01 minutes a night last year. The previous 3 seasons he averaged 13:56
He found himself on the 4th line because he wasn't good enough for the top 9

I don’t watch him or the canes enough to be honest but with Trocheck gone i’m pretty sure he’ll have his chance

 

[MarioLeMoose]

I don’t watch him or the canes enough to be honest but with Trocheck gone i’m pretty sure he’ll have his chance

He will most definitely have a chance.

Just like Dach will have a chance this year with us.
Really want him to just hurry up and sign so we have something new to talk about haha

 

[Tyson]

12 years ago was The Hawks first of 3 cups in the cap era. That's not out of the blue, that's bandwagoning.

Yeah I don't disagree but today he is a hard-core Hawks fan.

 

[SlafySZN]

He will most definitely have a chance.

Just like Dach will have a chance this year with us.
Really want him to just hurry up and sign so we have something new to talk about haha

I’d say he’s signed in a week!

 

[Wats]

He's not playing any better in Carolina, yet they "developped" their players very well. Are you going to blame the Hurricanes management for that?

Is it so hard for some of you to believe that some players just suck no matter where they were drafted? KK was by no means a 3rd OA, and was a massive reach by our geniuses in scouting.

in Detroit, do you blame the management team for failing to develop Zadina? Then how about Seider and Raymond, who's responsible?

No management has 100% success. Hitting on Seider/Raymond is better than what Montreal did on entire Bergevin era. So yes, Detroit management is responsible for them getting good players from the draft and turning them into good NHLers. Bergevin would have probably rushed all 3 into NHL.

You act like KK is a bust in Carolina but they re-signed him long-term so we'll see if they can reverse the Montreal damage. He did produce at a career high rate in every category with lowest career icetime.

We'll see how this management does with Slafkovsky.

 

[Mister Hab]

Even if Dach fails, it will have been a worthwhile move. We traded from a position of depth.

Exactly. It was a very smart gamble/move (Dach for Romanov+picks).
Our Habs have lots of LEFTIE D-depth...and our CENTER depth improved with the addition of Dach.

 

[ReHabs]

Just saw a Drouin quote I had missed, stating that his wrist will never be the same and he will need to adjust his game.

Meanwhile the Habs trade a high first round pick for Kirby Dach with wrist injury history. Makes me wonder how confident they are that Dach is over his troubles and at close to 100%…

The Habs organization’s pro scouts somehow missed Alzner’s horrific post-injury problems…

 

[MarioLeMoose]

No management has 100% success. Hitting on Seider/Raymond is better than what Montreal did on entire Bergevin era. So yes, Detroit management is responsible for them getting good players from the draft and turning them into good NHLers. Bergevin would have probably rushed all 3 into NHL.

You act like KK is a bust in Carolina but they re-signed him long-term so we'll see if they can reverse the Montreal damage. He did produce at a career high rate in every category with lowest career icetime.

We'll see how this management does with Slafkovsky.

Give me a break. KK has not improved at all since his rookie year. This career high rate he supposedly produced at last year was nearly identical to his rookie season. He averaged 1 less minute ATOI and he played on a far superior team. The only thing he improved on last year was his shooting % jumped from 8 to 14%
Aside from that and his slight improvement in the faceoff circle, he was the same player in Carolina as he was in Montreal. You can have your beliefs he will suddenly improve, but let’s not pretend it’s already happened.