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Player Discussion Kirby Dach: Welcome to Montreal

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417 said:
Of course it's a gamble...just like drafting someone 13th is also a gamble.

You're not getting any more guaranteed return on your investment if you draft someone at 13 either.
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Most would argue the 13 pick is more of a gamble. With the basic tools Dach has and where he is, the downside is higher then the potential downside of a 13Oa. Further, with the tools he has (size being something that cannot be developed), he has a higher upside than most 13OAs. Don't get me wrong, a huge fan of Frankie, but, really, taking Dach for a 13th is a low risk, potentially high reward gamble.
 
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smcgreg said:
Most would argue the 13 pick is more of a gamble. With the basic tools Dach has and where he is, the downside is higher then the potential downside of a 13Oa. Further, with the tools he has (size being something that cannot be developed), he has a higher upside than most 13OAs. Don't get me wrong, a huge fan of Frankie, but, really, taking Dach for a 13th is a low risk, potentially high reward gamble.
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I would...but this is also a hockey prospect site, so the idea of the untarnished 13th overall will always be more appealing than the recently drafted player whose blemishes have now been exposed.
 
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417 said:
I would...but this is also a hockey prospect site, so the idea of the untarnished 13th overall will always be more appealing than the recently drafted player whose blemishes have now been exposed.
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Oh wait,.... I thought this was a Habs b*&ch and moan site. Apologies. I'll keep that in mind going forward.

To your point though, all prospects will have blemishes exposed once they spend some time in the NHL. So, another aspect of the risk/reward equation here is that the blemishes relative to the strengths/potential strengths are known quantities against NHL competition. Known vs unknown reduces the risk to some extent, but the extent of the blemishes in conjunction with the tools (size, vision, hands) makes for very good potential upside. Since he's young enough and rough enough, he's really a glorified prospect where the development staff can potentially make an impact. Time will tell.
 
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Habs Halifax said:
Yeah, I agree. And the other part is thinking Nazar is a sure shot center to be better than Dach when there has been a clear trend of younger players taking time to develop. What makes Nazar a better prospect than Dach when Dach was rated higher at the same age. I just don't get it. Top 15 picks have lots of value but it's almost like some fans think none of them disappoint and they all develop faster than Dach.

Dach was highly rated in his draft year and D+1. He had a rough season at age 20 last year with the Blackhawks and that untapped potential is still there at age 21.
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It's simple, Dach hasn't lived up to his pedigree so far, while projections on Nazar are still wide open. A draft pedigree means a lot less when the player doesn't live up to it, even though there's still time.

What I don't understand is the obsession in always trying to build a narrative that boils down to "habs made the right move" no matter what happens.
 
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Ozymandias said:
It's simple, Dach hasn't lived up to his pedigree so far, while projections on Nazar are still wide open. A draft pedigree means a lot less when the player doesn't live up to it, even though there's still time.

What I don't understand is the obsession in always trying to build a narrative that boils down to "habs made the right move" no matter what happens.
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And there’s always people to b*tch about every move, when they didn’t even see the said player play or doesn’t know what will happen in their development.
 
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Ozymandias said:
It's simple, Dach hasn't lived up to his pedigree so far, while projections on Nazar are still wide open. A draft pedigree means a lot less when the player doesn't live up to it, even though there's still time.

What I don't understand is the obsession in always trying to build a narrative that boils down to "habs made the right move" no matter what happens.
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We traded for a guy lining up to be a 3rd line center. We need a 2nd line center. It’s a win if they can get him there AND Romanov has topped out offensively.
 
SuzukiSZN said:
And there’s always people to b*tch about every move, when they didn’t even see the said player play or doesn’t know what will happen in their development.
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Which doesn't apply to me, as I've said I like Dash, although i think we overpaid. I've also stated I'm confident in MSL working his magic.

You forgot the 3rd option which is objectivity...
 
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Kennerback said:
We traded for a guy lining up to be a 3rd line center. We need a 2nd line center. It’s a win if they can get him there AND Romanov has topped out offensively.
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No we traded a 13th overall + 66th for Dash, which is not a great return considering the risk.

Romanov + 4thr pick was traded for the 13th overall, which is great value.
 
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Ozymandias said:
No we traded a 13th overall + 66th for Dash, which is not a great return considering the risk.

Romanov + 4thr pick was traded for the 13th overall, which is great value.
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In other words, Romanov, 66 + 4th round for Dach. In this deal where the most important assets are players, the rule of thumb is the team that ends up with the best player win.
 
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Ozymandias said:
Which doesn't apply to me, as I've said I like Dash, although i think we overpaid. I've also stated I'm confident in MSL working his magic.

You forgot the 3rd option which is objectivity...
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Oh i wasn’t pointing at you, my bad! Just in general.

I don’t think giving Romanov is an overpaid, at all. If you don’t think getting a 21 years old top 6 C for Romanov is great value i have a hard time understanding what would be.
 
The fact is, most years, you have to draft top 5 to have a shot at someone with Dachs ability, profile and upside.

He's 21. It all comes down to whether the Habs can get him back on track developmentally. If they can, it will be a genius move. If they can't, they moved Romanov and a couple of late picks we don't really need for a Eller style 3C. Which is still fine value wise unless Romanov discovers the fountain of offensive potential.
 
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WeThreeKings said:
The fact is, most years, you have to draft top 5 to have a shot at someone with Dachs ability, profile and upside.

He's 21. It all comes down to whether the Habs can get him back on track developmentally. If they can, it will be a genius move. If they can't, they moved Romanov and a couple of late picks we don't really need for a Eller style 3C. Which is still fine value wise unless Romanov discovers the fountain of offensive potential.
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IMO, even if Romanov's offense doesn't develop, he could still become elite defensively, making his value higher than the 3C floor for Dach.

Romanov is a much better known quantity, has also room to grow, but comes with less risk.
 
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Every scouting report I read on Dach is similar to this:

SCOUTING REPORT
The third player taken in the 2019 draft was in the NHL as an 18-year-old and shows increasing flashes of why he was so highly regarded as he moves into his early 20s. He is big, skates well and is strong on the puck, a trait that should get even better as he matures. Is an excellent passer but must learn to take more shots in order to keep opponents from dropping off him in coverage. Has been plagued by injuries, including a broken wrist.

Long Range Potential: Talented, lanky forward with upside.
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Not sure where poor skater is coming from?
 
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Ozymandias said:
It's simple, Dach hasn't lived up to his pedigree so far, while projections on Nazar are still wide open. A draft pedigree means a lot less when the player doesn't live up to it, even though there's still time.

What I don't understand is the obsession in always trying to build a narrative that boils down to "habs made the right move" no matter what happens.
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Projections are the issue cause most prospects don't reach them and when they do, it takes time like Dach.
 
Who would you all took with 66th pick?

Ty Nelson for me. Built like a tank, plays heavy game, right shot, has a swagger about him. Former #1 pick overall in OHL.

Estimated_Prophet said:
Young centers are almost always poor on faceoffs and his skating is not awful as he is fairly agile and has decent edgework. His upside is as a huge, playmaking center in the Spezza, Getzlaf, Bobby Smith, Thornton mold. Obviously those are some big names and he is not likely to reach their level although Spezza or Smith might be attainable.
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They usually not that bad though. Probably play him on wing until Dvorak is traded.
 
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