Player Discussion Kirby Dach: Welcome to Montreal

[Andy]

Romanov was already a #3D and played all season as the teams top D.

That isn't really saying much though. The habs D was atrocious and they had an historically terrible record. Hockey fans really ascribe a lot of weight to physical play, and it really clouds their judgement, but Romanov still has a lot to work on and has shown little in the way of offense.

 

[Justsayin]

I'm excited by this trade. The guy was picked/ranked 3rd his draft year. He made the Hawks out of training camp. He was captain of the World Junior team. He was the Hawks' most used center at age 20. That's all pretty nuts. He did not have a good year last year but did I mention that he was the Hawks' most used C? There is a lot to be optimistic about in this player. We might end up having added the best center available at this draft.

 

[morhilane]

I'm excited by this trade. The guy was picked/ranked 3rd his draft year. He made the Hawks out of training camp. He was captain of the World Junior team. He was the Hawks' most used center at age 20. That's all pretty nuts. He did not have a good year last year but did I mention that he was the Hawks' most used C? There is a lot to be optimistic about in this player. We might end up having added the best center available at this draft.

That one is super weird to me. If he was as bad as people claim and the Hawks decided to get ride of him because of it, why was he playing more than Toews and Strome?

Was the coach trying to shelter Toews and Strome and sacrificed Dach to do it? Or did the coach prefer Dach?

 

[bleuetbio]

Chicago had an offer of 11th OA for Dach. So you're wrong on his value.

Where can we read about that information / rumor?

 

[FourQuarters]

That one is super weird to me. If he was as bad as people claim and the Hawks decided to get ride of him because of it, why was he playing more than Toews and Strome?

Was the coach trying to shelter Toews and Strome and sacrificed Dach to do it? Or did the coach prefer Dach?

Strome never had any PK time, and Colliton didn't like him. Toews come back from health issue, needs someone to share his responsibilities. Dach worked on PP and PK, took on a important defensive responsibility. That's why his TOI is very high.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

The goal is to develop him into a 2C.

Yes, he's played a QB role on the PP, mainly in juniors. I think he's more of a half-wall or a down-low guy, he's a puck distributor but he's got good hands to deflect and score quickly around the net as well.

Dvorak isn't here long term and will be the match-up center. I would expect season 1 with the Habs will be all about growing his offensive game, which means he will be the 3rd center, get an exploitation role with offensive players (think Dadonov and someone else) and be given a lot of powerplay time.

This would be the right strategy. I’d also look at giving him some early shifts with Caufield to gain some confidence. If he gets some quick points it would help him settle in.

 

[DAChampion]

Chicago is tanking in the most aggressive meaning of the term. I'd be pissed if I was a fan.

 

[Wats]

Chicago is tanking in the most aggressive meaning of the term. I'd be pissed if I was a fan.

I wouldn't to be honest, they had a modern day dynasty not too long ago. Enough success to give time to start over.

 

[Mrb1p]

That one is super weird to me. If he was as bad as people claim and the Hawks decided to get ride of him because of it, why was he playing more than Toews and Strome?

Was the coach trying to shelter Toews and Strome and sacrificed Dach to do it? Or did the coach prefer Dach?

Because theyre trying to get rid of the other two, too? Strome isnt getting qualified for his RFA contract and Toews is as good as gone the second they can move him.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

That's a straight fact

The thing is that in 3 years he hasn't progessed . While Romanov did. Yes he's only 21 but I don't see how he involve with our team. If he doesn't make it to the second line , the trade will be a bust.

His usage and the injuries explain this though.

There’s no doubt the Hawks stunted his development- just like we did with KK. And he’s probably never going to reach his potential. But we might be able to make him into a decent 2nd line center. Failing that we could move him to the wing.

I’m cautiously optimistic about this trade. It could turn out to be a great move.

 

[Mrb1p]

Chicago is tanking in the most aggressive meaning of the term. I'd be pissed if I was a fan.

Why? This draft 2023 is amazing and they have a lot of prospects coming up. If they can get Bedard, their contending window starts in 2024.

His usage and the injuries explain this though.

There’s no doubt the Hawks stunted his development- just like we did with KK. And he’s probably never going to reach his potential. But we might be able to make him into a decent 2nd line center. Failing that we could move him to the wing.

I’m cautiously optimistic about this trade. It could turn out to be a great move.

Thats fair but would you have traded Romanov for KK last year? Its a bit of a ridiculous move when you think of it. Dach and KK are 6 months apart in age... Im 100% positive no one on this board, not even me, wouldve given Alex Romanov let alone Frank Nazar for KK 6 months ago.

 

[Natey]

Why? This draft 2023 is amazing and they have a lot of prospects coming up. If they can get Bedard, their contending window starts in 2024.


Thats fair but would you have traded Romanov for KK last year? Its a bit of a ridiculous move when you think of it. Dach and KK are 6 months apart in age... Im 100% positive no one on this board, not even me, wouldve given Alex Romanov let alone Frank Nazar for KK 6 months ago.

If their contending window was going to start in 2024, they shouldn't have traded DeBrincat.

We've spent how many years and draft picks trying to get a player that good. The chances are slim that someone you draft makes an impact like him.

 

[Mrb1p]

If their contending window was going to start in 2024, they shouldn't have traded DeBrincat.

Debrincat is good and might win them games, they got a top 7 pick and picked a high upside kid, cant blame them for that. I didnt like the move much and didnt like who they picked but no fan should ever be mad at a team picking a direction, especially Habs fans whove seen directionless team building for a decade.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Who's the better center in 3 years? Does your answer change in 5 years due to Dach being 3 years older than the other two and you feel you need more time cause they will be 21 like Dach is today?

Dach, Wright, or Cooley?

 

[WeThreeKings]

Who's the better center in 3 years? Does your answer change in 5 years due to Dach being 3 years older than the other two and you feel you need more time cause they will be 21 like Dach is today?

Dach, Wright, or Cooley?

In terms of upside its:
Dach
Cooley
Wright

 

[Mrb1p]

In terms of upside its:
Dach
Cooley
Wright

Yikes thats a toxic relationship if Ive ever seen one

 

[morhilane]

Because theyre trying to get rid of the other two, too? Strome isnt getting qualified for his RFA contract and Toews is as good as gone the second they can move him.

I'm not sure they played last season with the idea of going scorched earth in the off-season following it.

 

[Habs Halifax]

His usage and the injuries explain this though.

There’s no doubt the Hawks stunted his development- just like we did with KK. And he’s probably never going to reach his potential. But we might be able to make him into a decent 2nd line center. Failing that we could move him to the wing.

I’m cautiously optimistic about this trade. It could turn out to be a great move.

It's not too late for Dach's development. Look at how the Bruins developed Sequin and how he took off with the Stars after? I believe he was 21 ish when traded right?

Dach needs talent around him. Blackhawks didn't have deep talent to ice 2 or 3 solid lines and that affects a young player like Dach and KK. When Dach played with Kane or Debrincat (and on their PP), he showed his potential but when he didn't he struggled. He's not going to lead any team but he can be a force if we surround him with the right pieces.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Yikes thats a toxic relationship if Ive ever seen one

I'm sure Wright and Brook will team up and take the league by storm

 

[Habs Halifax]

In terms of upside its:
Dach
Cooley
Wright

It's an interesting question for me. We all know the Dach value pre-draft and in his D+1. The kid can skate, has size and toughness, and requires maturity with surrounding talent in a stable spot.

If MSL can't get the max value out of him by allowing him to learn on the job and not dwelling on his mistakes that affect his confidence, not sure anybody can.

 

[WeThreeKings]

It's an interesting question for me. We all know the Dach value pre-draft and in his D+1. The kid can skate, has size and toughness, and only requires maturity and surrounding talent in a stable spot.

If MSL can't get the max value out of him by allowing him to learn on the job and not dwelling on his mistakes that affect his confidence, not sure anybody can.

This is Dach's chance to meet his upside. You generally don't overcome bad development after a certain point. He's still young at 21 so he's still developing, just remains to see what's recoverable and what isn't from what the Hawks did to him.

But its why I said upside, because if you go by floors its
Wright
Dach
Cooley

 

[Mrb1p]

It's not too late for Dach's development. Look at how the Bruins developed Sequin and how he took off with the Stars after? I believe he was 21 ish when traded right?

Dach needs talent around him. Blackhawks didn't have deep talent to ice 2 or 3 solid lines and that affects a young player like Dach and KK. When Dach played with Kane or Debrincat (and on their PP), he showed his potential but when he didn't he struggled. He's not going to lead any team but he can be a force if we surround him with the right pieces.

Seguin had a 70 points season at 19... he then followed it up with a .67 ppg season at 20.

Daxh had 7 points without Kane/Cat (in less ice time) and 8 with at least one of those... He didnt prove shit.

I'm sure Wright and Brook will team up and take the league by storm

See, Brook was the ex I really loved at the time and I realized along the way she wasnt the one.

Dach is the ex that you found a few times kissing dudes in the greasy dive bar toilets and youre still giving her chances.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Seguin had a 70 points season at 19... he then followed it up with a .67 ppg season at 20.

Daxh had 7 points without Kane/Cat (in less ice time) and 8 with at least one of those... He didnt prove shit.


See, Brook was the ex I really loved at the time and I realized along the way she wasnt the one.

Dach is the ex that you found a few times kissing dudes in the greasy dive bar toilets and youre still giving her chances.

When she's as hot as Dach is, you're damn right I'm giving her another chance. Girls like that don't come around often. Especially when you look like the Habs.

 

[Habs Halifax]

This is Dach's chance to meet his upside. You generally don't overcome bad development after a certain point. He's still young at 21 so he's still developing, just remains to see what's recoverable and what isn't from what the Hawks did to him.

But its why I said upside, because if you go by floors its
Wright
Dach
Cooley

I'm not sure on the floors cause Wright and Cooley might take years like Dach and Lafreniere. I have seen some sample of Wright being outmuscled and falling down in OHL puck battles. Team Canada only played 2 games but they did move Wright to wing in game 2 to "try to get him going" more. I avoided dwelling on that pre-draft but it's context we can't ignore.

Personally, I don't know who is the better value center in 3 years when we look at Dach, Wright, and Cooley. All I can say is Dach has the better frame to deal with NHL physicality game after game.

Wright don't appear to like contact from the sample I have seen. And in the NHL, his time and space will be reduced and he will have to battle more than he has in the OHL cause his skating creates time for him in that league. That might be an area of struggle for him in the NHL.... time and space and ability to overcome the physicality when his time and space is reduced.

Disagree? I am curious to see some video that shows Wright's ability to outmuscle players. Not saying it don't exist but if it does, I'd like to see it. From what I have seen, he is focused on the 200' game but he not diving into the physical areas coming out with the puck.

 

[Mrb1p]

When she's as hot as Dach is, you're damn right I'm giving her another chance. Girls like that don't come around often. Especially when you look like the Habs.

Lmao thats fair