Player Discussion Kirby Dach: Welcome to Montreal part 2

[Naslundforever]

Eller was always a gritty player. Even when he was a 170 pounds wet hed go in the corners and battle it out and then come out and drive towards the net.

Dach is floating most of the time and plays a very junior game, I can't blame him as it worked for him and he could never really develop any other part of his game because he was rushed. Not sure him being a 2C for the Habs is too encouraging for the future though, I want Suzuki at 2C.

Love the Avatar but I miss the pitt (was an american bulldog owner for a decade). Hoping Dach has it in him then. He has years to get stronger for sure.

I keep hoping for Pitlick to channel his inner Mike Keane but I tend to set myself up to be disappointed.

 

[SlafySZN]

Heh, was he? Last year he mostly played with Kane, this year he has similar ice time and were whining that he doesnt have good wingers.

Im all for blaming the coach or the context as most of you know, but this aint it.

He didn’t.

His wingers were mostly Kubalik, Hagel, Kurashev and Debrincat.

 

[Mrb1p]

He didn’t.

His wingers were mostly Kubalik, Hagel, Kurashev and Debrincat.

He spent 237.4 minutes with Kane at ES, thats like 25-30 games... then add that he also played with Cat...

 

[SlafySZN]

Dach is a genuine 3rd line Center right now. He can provide a bit of secondary offence. He covers lots of ice quickly and is responsible defensively. He’s great at playing the Center despite the comments of misinformed personalities.

He has two aspects to develop, strength and offence. He needs to hit the weight room big time. He’ll also develop size and confidence at using the beginning of sandpaper he already has.

Then the offence will come from spending hours of shooting pucks and replace half his passes in the offensive zone with shots. And skip low percentage dekes of the last D for a shot. He fiddles too much with the puck and doesn’t put the puck on net.

His shot on goal for a rebound gave a good chance to Caufield yesterday.

 

[SlafySZN]

He spent 237.4 minutes with Kane at ES, thats like 25-30 games... then add that he also played with Cat...

He played with Kane 15 games last season.

10 games with the Kane/Debrincat duo.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

All this says is that you don’t know what a good developmental coach is vs a bad developmental coach. You use hindsight to form your opinion,

Well... yeah. That's what open minded people do man. You evaluate and then as things change you revise your opinions. That's how it works. If you dig your heels in no matter what then you're just stubborn. Scientists for example will start with a hypothesis. If it doesn't pan out they revise along the way...

I was happy that DD showed some confidence in KK at the beginning. And he seemed to respond. But that quickly changed. So... I quickly changed my opinion on him. Why would you think it would work any other way? It's not indicative of not knowing what a good coach is. If anything, it a reflection that you're paying attention to what is happening.

Anyone who says we developed KK properly just flat out doesn't know what he's talking about. Now, does that mean we drafted well? Does it mean that he might not have reached our hopes/expectations anyway? Not necessarily. But we made sure that he wouldn't. Just like we did with almost every prospect we had under the MB era.

You don't get to f*** around with prospects, do a shit job developing them and then blame the players for not becoming what you hoped. That is ON YOU - management - for not doing what you're supposed to do. And our development was a f***ing train wreck for a decade, right up to and including Caufield. I have zero doubt that he'd still be struggling if DD were coach.

Now back to the actual topic: how the f*** can anyone say with a straight face that Dach was developed properly? Do you seriously believe this?

 

[Mrb1p]

He played with Kane 15 games last season.

10 games with the Kane/Debrincat duo.

237 means he played 18 mins at ES, he played around 12-14.

 

[Kaiden Ghoul]

Slaf Dach Caufield

Could you imagine it could be our second line if we win the Bedard/Mitchkov battle

Or just switch Caufield and Yager if we draft him, either way Dach could have a 40 goal scorer on his line

 

[26Mats]

Slaf Dach Caufield

Could you imagine it could be our second line if we win the Bedard/Mitchkov battle

Or just switch Caufield and Yager if we draft him, either way Dach could have a 40 goal scorer on his line

It's very, very important to finish as low as we. An in the standings this year.

 

[Rob Sense]

I think that it is still way to early to render judgment. Some players have been playing better of late and offense will eventually spread out. This analysis is interesting. Top-5 Canadiens Players According To The Numbers
Sometimes effort is not always rewarded with points but the effort counts.

 

[BaseballCoach]

I think that it is still way to early to render judgment. Some players have been playing better of late and offense will eventually spread out. This analysis is interesting. Top-5 Canadiens Players According To The Numbers
Sometimes effort is not always rewarded with points but the effort counts.

The eye test, please!

Dach is playing well, generating chances, and doing his job backchecking and defending his own zone. He is one of the few forwards with a positive shot ratio and chances ratio on the team. He is the same age as Xhekaj and Caufield. Only Guhle and Slaf are younger.

Give it time and enjoy his progress.

It's very, very important to finish as low as we. An in the standings this year.

No, it is not. If we finish low, yes we get a decent consolation prize, but if we finish high due to great sustainable play from our youngsters, that is worth even more.

 

[Mrb1p]

Slaf Dach Caufield

Could you imagine it could be our second line if we win the Bedard/Mitchkov battle

Or just switch Caufield and Yager if we draft him, either way Dach could have a 40 goal scorer on his line

If we get Bedard/Carlsson/Fantili Dach is getting traded.

The eye test, please!

Dach is playing well, generating chances, and doing his job backchecking and defending his own zone. He is one of the few forwards with a positive shot ratio and chances ratio on the team. He is the same age as Xhekaj and Caufield. Only Guhle and Slaf are younger.

Give it time and enjoy his progress.


No, it is not. If we finish low, yes we get a decent consolation prize, but if we finish high due to great sustainable play from our youngsters, that is worth even more.

Right, who wants a generational talent.

 

[BaseballCoach]

If we get Bedard/Carlsson/Fantili Dach is getting traded.


Right, who wants a generational talent.

I'm not saying not to get that generational talent if we can. I'm saying keep Dach as the super 3C and trade Dvorak.

I'm also saying that we should keep practicing the PP and PK, keep trying to improve our youngsters.

When was the last player you would consider a generational talent drafted?

 

[Mrb1p]

I'm not saying not to get that generational talent if we can. I'm saying keep Dach as the super 3C and trade Dvorak.

I'm also saying that we should keep practicing the PP and PK, keep trying to improve our youngsters.

When was the last player you would consider a generational talent drafted?

Ovi crosby price Mcdavid => Bedard

 

[BaseballCoach]

Ovi crosby price Mcdavid => Bedard

The last time there were two consensus generational talents in a single year was 2004 = Ovechkin and Malkin

In 2005 Price was only picked 5th and some thought that was too high.

In 2015, there was a debate over Eichel's ceiling, but he has not made a positive impact in the NHL yet in terms of team results. Buffalo got better after trading him, and Vegas missed the playoffs after getting him, for the first time in their short history.

Yet some posters here act like there are so many generational talents in next year's draft that drafting top 5 gets you one for sure. I think it is shiny new toy syndrome.

In addition to this questionable evaluation, I think folks overestimate the impact one great player will have. Pittsburgh needed four. With just two, they finished at the bottom end in 2006.

Fantilli, Bedard or whoever is the best prospect in 2023 is unlikely to get the Habs to a championship run if Suzuki, Caufield, Guhle and Slaf are not that great.

 

[Kaiden Ghoul]

No, it is not. If we finish low, yes we get a decent consolation prize, but if we finish high due to great sustainable play from our youngsters, that is worth even more.

Theres a difference between wanting to finish dead last and hoping to be in the 5-6 spot pre lottery… we can have a winning culture by improvement over each season

 

[BaseballCoach]

Theres a difference between wanting to finish dead last and hoping to be in the 5-6 spot pre lottery… we can have a winning culture by improvement over each season

I hope to be in the top 5, but realistically I expect to be in the bottom 4-10.

 

[Kennerback]

The last time there were two consensus generational talents in a single year was 2004 = Ovechkin and Malkin

In 2005 Price was only picked 5th and some thought that was too high.

In 2015, there was a debate over Eichel's ceiling, but he has not made a positive impact in the NHL yet in terms of team results. Buffalo got better after trading him, and Vegas missed the playoffs after getting him, for the first time in their short history.

Yet some posters here act like there are so many generational talents in next year's draft that drafting top 5 gets you one for sure. I think it is shiny new toy syndrome.

In addition to this questionable evaluation, I think folks overestimate the impact one great player will have. Pittsburgh needed four. With just two, they finished at the bottom end in 2006.

Fantilli, Bedard or whoever is the best prospect in 2023 is unlikely to get the Habs to a championship run if Suzuki, Caufield, Guhle and Slaf are not that great.

Lemieux’s great rookie season bumped them up from worst to 2nd worst. To win you need a whole supporting cast. Gretzky’s fine, but with Messier, Kuri, Anderson, Coffee, Fuhr, etc…

Most hyped and greatest draft of all time in terms of depth is 2003. It had a bunch of all stars but no generational talent.

 

[Kaiden Ghoul]

I hope to be in the top 5, but realistically I expect to be in the bottom 4-10.

It will depend of the D especially, If Guhle Harris Sheriff start to struggle in 10 games…the season is still young, personally i dont think we draft past 6 pre lottery, and who know maybe its the year 1 team in that range win a top 2 spot

 

[Sorinth]

The last time there were two consensus generational talents in a single year was 2004 = Ovechkin and Malkin

In 2005 Price was only picked 5th and some thought that was too high.

In 2015, there was a debate over Eichel's ceiling, but he has not made a positive impact in the NHL yet in terms of team results. Buffalo got better after trading him, and Vegas missed the playoffs after getting him, for the first time in their short history.

Yet some posters here act like there are so many generational talents in next year's draft that drafting top 5 gets you one for sure. I think it is shiny new toy syndrome.

In addition to this questionable evaluation, I think folks overestimate the impact one great player will have. Pittsburgh needed four. With just two, they finished at the bottom end in 2006.

Fantilli, Bedard or whoever is the best prospect in 2023 is unlikely to get the Habs to a championship run if Suzuki, Caufield, Guhle and Slaf are not that great.

Also consider that 13-14 months ago Shane Wright was considered the next generational player.

 

[BaseballCoach]

Also consider that 13-14 months ago Shane Wright was considered the next generational player.

That's part of the reason that some fans want Slafkovsky banished to Laval, Finland, Slovakia or Kitchener (OHL).

They can't handle that they prayed for a tank, got their wish with the 1st overall pick so that we can land a saviour, and now got hit by reality between the eyes.;

 

[Toene]

The last time there were two consensus generational talents in a single year was 2004 = Ovechkin and Malkin

In 2005 Price was only picked 5th and some thought that was too high.

In 2015, there was a debate over Eichel's ceiling, but he has not made a positive impact in the NHL yet in terms of team results. Buffalo got better after trading him, and Vegas missed the playoffs after getting him, for the first time in their short history.

Yet some posters here act like there are so many generational talents in next year's draft that drafting top 5 gets you one for sure. I think it is shiny new toy syndrome.

In addition to this questionable evaluation, I think folks overestimate the impact one great player will have. Pittsburgh needed four. With just two, they finished at the bottom end in 2006.

Fantilli, Bedard or whoever is the best prospect in 2023 is unlikely to get the Habs to a championship run if Suzuki, Caufield, Guhle and Slaf are not that great.

But we already have a great young core and young supporting players. Caufield, Suzuki, Guhle, Slaf, Dach, and then Evans, Xhekaj, Harris. Plus we have a deep prospect pool.

Adding a franchise talent would take us to the next level. We can be a pretty good team with what we have, but we need to be great.

The biggest hole we have is in the net. It's weird because for it has historically been our strongest position. Let's see how Dobes develops.

 

[BaseballCoach]

But we already have a great young core and young supporting players. Caufield, Suzuki, Guhle, Slaf, Dach, and then Evans, Xhekaj, Harris. Plus we have a deep prospect pool.

Adding a franchise talent would take us to the next level. We can be a pretty good team with what we have, but we need to be great.

The odds of drafting first if we finish 3rd from bottom are 11.5%.

The chances that whoever we draft at 1st overall is actually a franchise talent à la McDavid are about 9%. So we have a 1% chance of getting this saviour next year. If we don't, do we tank another year?

 

[Toene]

The odds of drafting first if we finish 3rd from bottom are 11.5%.

The chances that whoever we draft at 1st overall is actually a franchise talent à la McDavid are about 9%. So we have a 1% chance of getting this saviour next year. If we don't, do we tank another year?

I'm not talking about a savior, I'm talking about incrementally adding talented players to the core by astute drafting and development. Our core is grest but it could be better. You can always get better. I'm not advocating drafting high ad vitam eternaem, but I think we still need to add at least one bluechipper to be comfortably contenders. We want a cup and we've waited so long that I'm willing to endure a few subpar season if it makes us build a cup-winning roster.

 

[BaseballCoach]

I'm not talking about a savior, I'm talking about incrementally adding talented players to the core by astute drafting and development. Our core is grest but it could be better. You can always get better. I'm not advocating drafting high ad vitam eternaem, but I think we still need to add at least one bluechipper to be comfortably contenders. We want a cup and we've waited so long that I'm willing to endure a few subpar season if it makes us build a cup-winning roster.

Before Slafkovsky, the last three blue chippers we added were drafted 13th, 15th and 16th.