Kingston Frontenacs 2024-25 Season Thread, Part I

[frontsfan67]

I think because the city has a hand in the management (even more starting this year) it may be harder than before to get more Fronts themes in the rink. I think it would be great, even if it is just the middle sections.

I agree. When I look at other arenas and go to other arenas- despite not being as big or new as the fronts they all look like real hockey rinks and have the flames and sparkes and tunnels and all of this for the players to walk out of.

Kingston has none of that lol and they don’t even dim the lights and shine the spotlight on the player when they score. They used to do that and I’m not sure why they took it away.

They used to try that sort of stuff and even when they had the band for a bit. And oddly enough what do you know.. that was when they were doing their best in attendance I believe.

All was orchestrated by Justin Chénier I believe and then they fire the guy for asking for some time off like every other normal human being during Covid with the exception of the front line workers. There wasn’t even hockey being played in the OHL and they wouldn’t give it to him. My conspiracy about that is maybe all this extra stuff he was doing was costing a bit of money for Springer and we know how cheap he can be- cutting off Chénier and bringing in some less experienced guy with less of a budget is less of a headache for good ol dougie

 

[ScoutLife4]

I agree. When I look at other arenas and go to other arenas- despite not being as big or new as the fronts they all look like real hockey rinks and have the flames and sparkes and tunnels and all of this for the players to walk out of.

Kingston has none of that lol and they don’t even dim the lights and shine the spotlight on the player when they score. They used to do that and I’m not sure why they took it away.

They used to try that sort of stuff and even when they had the band for a bit. And oddly enough what do you know.. that was when they were doing their best in attendance I believe.

All was orchestrated by Justin Chénier I believe and then they fire the guy for asking for some time off like every other normal human being during Covid with the exception of the front line workers. There wasn’t even hockey being played in the OHL and they wouldn’t give it to him. My conspiracy about that is maybe all this extra stuff he was doing was costing a bit of money for Springer and we know how cheap he can be- cutting off Chénier and bringing in some less experienced guy with less of a budget is less of a headache for good ol dougie

One of the nicer arenas in the league cosmetically but it lacks character big time.
The grey interior kind of makes it feel like a prison or something.
They are likely pretty limited to what they are allowed to do to the venue I'm guessing.

I feel like their video board is very outdated too.

 

[frontsfan67]

One of the nicer arenas in the league cosmetically but it lacks character big time.
The grey interior kind of makes it feel like a prison or something.
They are likely pretty limited to what they are allowed to do to the venue I'm guessing.

I feel like their video board is very outdated too.

I agree on all points.

Such a nice arena but definitely one of the more boring ones and if they’re not even going to get a couple of spray cans of paint and make it look like a hockey arena I don’t know why they probably expect hockey fans to come.

Definitely need a new video board.

 

[OMG67]

One of the nicer arenas in the league cosmetically but it lacks character big time.
The grey interior kind of makes it feel like a prison or something.
They are likely pretty limited to what they are allowed to do to the venue I'm guessing.

I feel like their video board is very outdated too.

The arena’s with exposed concourses always look more cavernous. The ones that have concourses behind the stands always seem to be a lot more aesthetically pleasing.

 

[Handcuffhockey]

I think I’ve been to over half the OHL rinks now and I try to make as many Kingston games as I can. So much has been written on here about the reasons why Kingston doesn’t draw a crowd and many blame the ownership. I just don’t buy it, I think Kingston works hard trying to bring in the crowds, they have different theme nights, military appreciation, Cancer Awareness, Humane Society, etc. In game hosts, bouncy castles, face painting, team invites, 7th skater, promotional give always, player signing’s, community involvement including school visits…. The list goes on.

This is a beautiful city, it has a great downtown, more restaurants per capita than just about anywhere. The rink is a pretty good layout, sound system sucked for years but that’s on the City.

As mentioned before, they had an exceptional drafted player being Wright and they still couldn’t draw a crowd. What it comes down to is that this City just doesn’t support Jr hockey. Wish they did because this building could draw some exceptional talent if it was rocking like Oshawa, or Kitchener. Blame isn’t on the ownership, or the management or players- at this point it’s the community.

 

[OMG67]

I think I’ve been to over half the OHL rinks now and I try to make as many Kingston games as I can. So much has been written on here about the reasons why Kingston doesn’t draw a crowd and many blame the ownership. I just don’t buy it, I think Kingston works hard trying to bring in the crowds, they have different theme nights, military appreciation, Cancer Awareness, Humane Society, etc. In game hosts, bouncy castles, face painting, team invites, 7th skater, promotional give always, player signing’s, community involvement including school visits…. The list goes on.

This is a beautiful city, it has a great downtown, more restaurants per capita than just about anywhere. The rink is a pretty good layout, sound system sucked for years but that’s on the City.

As mentioned before, they had an exceptional drafted player being Wright and they still couldn’t draw a crowd. What it comes down to is that this City just doesn’t support Jr hockey. Wish they did because this building could draw some exceptional talent if it was rocking like Oshawa, or Kitchener. Blame isn’t on the ownership, or the management or players- at this point it’s the community.

You are looking at it backwards. It is not a build it and they will come situation.

The Frontenacs need to be the forefront of the community. The Frontenacs need represent a sense of pride for the community. When no one or relatively no one cares about the Frontenacs, it is clear the ownership has not managed to find ways to be the flagship organization that represents their City.

There is competition for that but locals don’t visit the tourist locations and Queens University. They are ignoring the frontenacs and are doing other things for entertainment. Is it because there are no hockey fans in Kingston? No. That is not the situation. There are tons of hockey fans in Kingston. There is no NHL team there. No AHL team. No ECHL team. The only competition is Queens. That is it.

So, if there are tons of hockey fans int he city, relatively little to no live hockey competition, and the city has a population that spends a good amount of disposable income on entertainment, then who’s problem is it? The hockey fans that don’t come or the ownership that hasn’t found a way to attract them?

 

[dirty12]

You are looking at it backwards. It is not a build it and they will come situation.

The Frontenacs need to be the forefront of the community. The Frontenacs need represent a sense of pride for the community. When no one or relatively no one cares about the Frontenacs, it is clear the ownership has not managed to find ways to be the flagship organization that represents their City.

There is competition for that but locals don’t visit the tourist locations and Queens University. They are ignoring the frontenacs and are doing other things for entertainment. Is it because there are no hockey fans in Kingston? No. That is not the situation. There are tons of hockey fans in Kingston. There is no NHL team there. No AHL team. No ECHL team. The only competition is Queens. That is it.

So, if there are tons of hockey fans int he city, relatively little to no live hockey competition, and the city has a population that spends a good amount of disposable income on entertainment, then who’s problem is it? The hockey fans that don’t come or the ownership that hasn’t found a way to attract them?

‘sports fans’ did not know who Villardi is. They were oblivious to the acquisitions of Villardi, Day, Pu, Jones; and no idea there was an OHL contender in town.
But they broke fire codes for the Queens-RMC game I’m sure. Kingston is not an OHL city.

 

[OMG67]

‘sports fans’ did not know who Villardi is. They were oblivious to the acquisitions of Villardi, Day, Pu, Jones; and no idea there was an OHL contender in town.
But they broke fire codes for the Queens-RMC game I’m sure. Kingston is not an OHL city.

But, is that the fault of the fans or the organization for not building a relationship with the fans? The poster I replied to blamed the City. Blaming the City is blaming the population, of which there are a ton of hockey fans. Untapped potential.

Queens has a transient population that supports them. Fine. How many full time Kingston citizens go to Queens games?

 

[leafs4life94]

But, is that the fault of the fans or the organization for not building a relationship with the fans? The poster I replied to blamed the City. Blaming the City is blaming the population, of which there are a ton of hockey fans. Untapped potential.

Queens has a transient population that supports them. Fine. How many full time Kingston citizens go to Queens games?

The issue is how do you make people care about something they haven't cared about for the last 20 years? Of course winning is the main answer, but from a strictly marketing perspective, how do you create a consistent fanbase that regularly attends?

Partnering with some downtown restaurants would be a start, but then unless you keep that partnership forever, you have to do something to get that person hooked on the game itself, rather than just seeing it as something that comes with a dinner deal.

I don't know the answer but selfishly it makes it a lot easier to buy tickets when it's not busy because I can buy them an hour before the game lol

 

[dirty12]

But, is that the fault of the fans or the organization for not building a relationship with the fans? The poster I replied to blamed the City. Blaming the City is blaming the population, of which there are a ton of hockey fans. Untapped potential.

Queens has a transient population that supports them. Fine. How many full time Kingston citizens go to Queens games?

When you figure out how to overcome the apathy towards OHL hockey in Kingston, buy the Steelheads.
I think you would be surprised by the amount of residents that observe the tradition of that annual Queens-RMC game. It’s a bit like the Labour Day Ti-Cats game, I guess.

 

[frontsfan67]

I think I’ve been to over half the OHL rinks now and I try to make as many Kingston games as I can. So much has been written on here about the reasons why Kingston doesn’t draw a crowd and many blame the ownership. I just don’t buy it, I think Kingston works hard trying to bring in the crowds, they have different theme nights, military appreciation, Cancer Awareness, Humane Society, etc. In game hosts, bouncy castles, face painting, team invites, 7th skater, promotional give always, player signing’s, community involvement including school visits…. The list goes on.

This is a beautiful city, it has a great downtown, more restaurants per capita than just about anywhere. The rink is a pretty good layout, sound system sucked for years but that’s on the City.

As mentioned before, they had an exceptional drafted player being Wright and they still couldn’t draw a crowd. What it comes down to is that this City just doesn’t support Jr hockey. Wish they did because this building could draw some exceptional talent if it was rocking like Oshawa, or Kitchener. Blame isn’t on the ownership, or the management or players- at this point it’s the community.

I’ve mentioned this about wright before but I’ll mention it again.

Springer wanted the team to be marketed not a big name player like wright.

For instance the last time they sold out from a non school day game is actually when Connor David came to town for his draft year. Why?? Everyone knows McDavid and they marketed him. Everyone wants to see that special, exceptional talent.

If they marketed the “highly touted projected 2022 first overall pick” every game I have a hard time believing they wouldn’t atleast have attracted 4000+ and especially in his draft year. Who knows- those guys that would pay to watch wright might’ve gotten out to some games and enjoyed not only Shane wright but OHL level hockey- and could’ve told their buddies, and their buddies told their buddies etc.

they could’ve had a bunch of new season ticket holders/fans because of it. Instead what do they market? A team that went out second round in other words, nothing special.

Look at Erie. Sure they were the top team in the chl for around 3 seasons but they also had McDavid and marketed it and attendance went up from 2855 in 2011-12 (without McDavid) to 3115 in 2012-13 with McDavid and then the following year in 2013-14 another big jump- 4429. And guess what? It still kept going up. 2014-15 his draft year 4947 as an AVERAGE.

+2192 fans on average in 3 years

Now Wright was never McDavid level but let’s say instead of almost 2200 he brought an extra 1000-1500 fans. Avg attendance in 2021-22 his draft year was 2698. Let’s say they add 1500 fans that is on average 4,198 fans. Literally the highest average in Kingstons history surpassing 2015-16s total of 4130

Rant over but massive missed opportunity.

 

[OMG67]

The issue is how do you make people care about something they haven't cared about for the last 20 years? Of course winning is the main answer, but from a strictly marketing perspective, how do you create a consistent fanbase that regularly attends?

Partnering with some downtown restaurants would be a start, but then unless you keep that partnership forever, you have to do something to get that person hooked on the game itself, rather than just seeing it as something that comes with a dinner deal.

I don't know the answer but selfishly it makes it a lot easier to buy tickets when it's not busy because I can buy them an hour before the game lol

Everyone is missing the point. Either Kingston is a viable OHL location or it isn’t. IMO, Kingston is a viable location:
1 - suitable arena
2- suitable population
3- population has a large volume of hockey fans
4- the average household income is satisfactory
5- the only live hockey competition is Queens

If there is apathy for the Frontenac’s, it is not the population of Kingston that is the problem. It is ownership that is the problem. The ownership is apathetic. Therefore, their fan base is apathetic.

And @dirty12 don’t be silly. Mississauga is not a comparable. The demographics isn’t comparable, there is other sports entertainment available in direct competition, and the lifestyle in Mississauga is vastly different. You can make an argument that Mississauga is not a viable OHL location whereas I don’t think you can make the same argument for Kingston. Kingston is relatively comparable to Flint, Saginaw, SSM, Windsor, London, Kitchener, Guelph, Niagara, Barrie, Sudbury, Oshawa, and Peterborough.

The only reason why the Frontenacs aren’t a staple of the Kingston community is because their ownership is disinterested in making them part of the fabric of the community for their own reasons that are not known by me.

 

[frontsfan67]

Everyone is missing the point. Either Kingston is a viable OHL location or it isn’t. IMO, Kingston is a viable location:
1 - suitable arena
2- suitable population
3- population has a large volume of hockey fans
4- the average household income is satisfactory
5- the only live hockey competition is Queens

If there is apathy for the Frontenac’s, it is not the population of Kingston that is the problem. It is ownership that is the problem. The ownership is apathetic. Therefore, their fan base is apathetic.

And @dirty12 don’t be silly. Mississauga is not a comparable. The demographics isn’t comparable, there is other sports entertainment available in direct competition, and the lifestyle in Mississauga is vastly different. You can make an argument that Mississauga is not a viable OHL location whereas I don’t think you can make the same argument for Kingston. Kingston is relatively comparable to Flint, Saginaw, SSM, Windsor, London, Kitchener, Guelph, Niagara, Barrie, Sudbury, Oshawa, and Peterborough.

The only reason why the Frontenacs aren’t a staple of the Kingston community is because there ownership is disinterested in making them part of the fabric of the community for their own reasons that are not known by me.

I agree I see other teams like Windsor they do outdoor practices and fans can attend, Kitcheners gm is usually very vocal about what is going on, Owen sound despite being the smallest town in the OHL has the most passionate fans and they go on their bus to thank every single one of the fans personally for their support when they travel for road trips- always have thought that Is the coolest thing and I wish the fronts were engaged like that. When we go on bus trips we’re lucky to get a salute of sticks by the team. We usually have the market square thing once a year but I haven’t heard of that yet.

 

[OMG67]

I agree I see other teams like Windsor they do outdoor practices and fans can attend, Kitcheners gm is usually very vocal about what is going on, Owen sound despite being the smallest town in the OHL has the most passionate fans and they go on their bus to thank every single one of the fans personally for their support when they travel for road trips- always have thought that Is the coolest thing and I wish the fronts were engaged like that. When we go on bus trips we’re lucky to get a salute of sticks by the team. We usually have the market square thing once a year but I haven’t heard of that yet.

I don’t know what the answer is. Every community is different. The citizens have different wants and needs. What works for one community may not work for the other. But, there is more than enough information available from every other teams marketing teams for the Fronts to potentially access and implement to create a game day experience that resonates with its fans.

Ultimately, the long term futility is likely the most impactful issue. But, the Fronts have performed better overall lately. They’ve had flashes of good teams., just not sustained. That is what concerned me in the offseason when some were advocating for throwing everything at this years team. That would leave then somewhat naked starting over next year. I’m not sure that is a positive or a negative. Of course, starting over next year is a negative but having a highly competitive playoff team may be what is needed regardless of the ensuing rebuild.