Kingston Frontenacs 2024-25 Season Thread, Part I

[frontsfan67]

I think because the city has a hand in the management (even more starting this year) it may be harder than before to get more Fronts themes in the rink. I think it would be great, even if it is just the middle sections.

I agree. When I look at other arenas and go to other arenas- despite not being as big or new as the fronts they all look like real hockey rinks and have the flames and sparkes and tunnels and all of this for the players to walk out of.

Kingston has none of that lol and they don’t even dim the lights and shine the spotlight on the player when they score. They used to do that and I’m not sure why they took it away.

They used to try that sort of stuff and even when they had the band for a bit. And oddly enough what do you know.. that was when they were doing their best in attendance I believe.

All was orchestrated by Justin Chénier I believe and then they fire the guy for asking for some time off like every other normal human being during Covid with the exception of the front line workers. There wasn’t even hockey being played in the OHL and they wouldn’t give it to him. My conspiracy about that is maybe all this extra stuff he was doing was costing a bit of money for Springer and we know how cheap he can be- cutting off Chénier and bringing in some less experienced guy with less of a budget is less of a headache for good ol dougie

 

[ScoutLife4]

I agree. When I look at other arenas and go to other arenas- despite not being as big or new as the fronts they all look like real hockey rinks and have the flames and sparkes and tunnels and all of this for the players to walk out of.

Kingston has none of that lol and they don’t even dim the lights and shine the spotlight on the player when they score. They used to do that and I’m not sure why they took it away.

They used to try that sort of stuff and even when they had the band for a bit. And oddly enough what do you know.. that was when they were doing their best in attendance I believe.

All was orchestrated by Justin Chénier I believe and then they fire the guy for asking for some time off like every other normal human being during Covid with the exception of the front line workers. There wasn’t even hockey being played in the OHL and they wouldn’t give it to him. My conspiracy about that is maybe all this extra stuff he was doing was costing a bit of money for Springer and we know how cheap he can be- cutting off Chénier and bringing in some less experienced guy with less of a budget is less of a headache for good ol dougie

One of the nicer arenas in the league cosmetically but it lacks character big time.
The grey interior kind of makes it feel like a prison or something.
They are likely pretty limited to what they are allowed to do to the venue I'm guessing.

I feel like their video board is very outdated too.

 

[frontsfan67]

One of the nicer arenas in the league cosmetically but it lacks character big time.
The grey interior kind of makes it feel like a prison or something.
They are likely pretty limited to what they are allowed to do to the venue I'm guessing.

I feel like their video board is very outdated too.

I agree on all points.

Such a nice arena but definitely one of the more boring ones and if they’re not even going to get a couple of spray cans of paint and make it look like a hockey arena I don’t know why they probably expect hockey fans to come.

Definitely need a new video board.

 

[OMG67]

One of the nicer arenas in the league cosmetically but it lacks character big time.
The grey interior kind of makes it feel like a prison or something.
They are likely pretty limited to what they are allowed to do to the venue I'm guessing.

I feel like their video board is very outdated too.

The arena’s with exposed concourses always look more cavernous. The ones that have concourses behind the stands always seem to be a lot more aesthetically pleasing.

 

[Handcuffhockey]

I think I’ve been to over half the OHL rinks now and I try to make as many Kingston games as I can. So much has been written on here about the reasons why Kingston doesn’t draw a crowd and many blame the ownership. I just don’t buy it, I think Kingston works hard trying to bring in the crowds, they have different theme nights, military appreciation, Cancer Awareness, Humane Society, etc. In game hosts, bouncy castles, face painting, team invites, 7th skater, promotional give always, player signing’s, community involvement including school visits…. The list goes on.

This is a beautiful city, it has a great downtown, more restaurants per capita than just about anywhere. The rink is a pretty good layout, sound system sucked for years but that’s on the City.

As mentioned before, they had an exceptional drafted player being Wright and they still couldn’t draw a crowd. What it comes down to is that this City just doesn’t support Jr hockey. Wish they did because this building could draw some exceptional talent if it was rocking like Oshawa, or Kitchener. Blame isn’t on the ownership, or the management or players- at this point it’s the community.

 

[OMG67]

I think I’ve been to over half the OHL rinks now and I try to make as many Kingston games as I can. So much has been written on here about the reasons why Kingston doesn’t draw a crowd and many blame the ownership. I just don’t buy it, I think Kingston works hard trying to bring in the crowds, they have different theme nights, military appreciation, Cancer Awareness, Humane Society, etc. In game hosts, bouncy castles, face painting, team invites, 7th skater, promotional give always, player signing’s, community involvement including school visits…. The list goes on.

This is a beautiful city, it has a great downtown, more restaurants per capita than just about anywhere. The rink is a pretty good layout, sound system sucked for years but that’s on the City.

As mentioned before, they had an exceptional drafted player being Wright and they still couldn’t draw a crowd. What it comes down to is that this City just doesn’t support Jr hockey. Wish they did because this building could draw some exceptional talent if it was rocking like Oshawa, or Kitchener. Blame isn’t on the ownership, or the management or players- at this point it’s the community.

You are looking at it backwards. It is not a build it and they will come situation.

The Frontenacs need to be the forefront of the community. The Frontenacs need represent a sense of pride for the community. When no one or relatively no one cares about the Frontenacs, it is clear the ownership has not managed to find ways to be the flagship organization that represents their City.

There is competition for that but locals don’t visit the tourist locations and Queens University. They are ignoring the frontenacs and are doing other things for entertainment. Is it because there are no hockey fans in Kingston? No. That is not the situation. There are tons of hockey fans in Kingston. There is no NHL team there. No AHL team. No ECHL team. The only competition is Queens. That is it.

So, if there are tons of hockey fans int he city, relatively little to no live hockey competition, and the city has a population that spends a good amount of disposable income on entertainment, then who’s problem is it? The hockey fans that don’t come or the ownership that hasn’t found a way to attract them?

 

[dirty12]

You are looking at it backwards. It is not a build it and they will come situation.

The Frontenacs need to be the forefront of the community. The Frontenacs need represent a sense of pride for the community. When no one or relatively no one cares about the Frontenacs, it is clear the ownership has not managed to find ways to be the flagship organization that represents their City.

There is competition for that but locals don’t visit the tourist locations and Queens University. They are ignoring the frontenacs and are doing other things for entertainment. Is it because there are no hockey fans in Kingston? No. That is not the situation. There are tons of hockey fans in Kingston. There is no NHL team there. No AHL team. No ECHL team. The only competition is Queens. That is it.

So, if there are tons of hockey fans int he city, relatively little to no live hockey competition, and the city has a population that spends a good amount of disposable income on entertainment, then who’s problem is it? The hockey fans that don’t come or the ownership that hasn’t found a way to attract them?

‘sports fans’ did not know who Villardi is. They were oblivious to the acquisitions of Villardi, Day, Pu, Jones; and no idea there was an OHL contender in town.
But they broke fire codes for the Queens-RMC game I’m sure. Kingston is not an OHL city.

 

[OMG67]

‘sports fans’ did not know who Villardi is. They were oblivious to the acquisitions of Villardi, Day, Pu, Jones; and no idea there was an OHL contender in town.
But they broke fire codes for the Queens-RMC game I’m sure. Kingston is not an OHL city.

But, is that the fault of the fans or the organization for not building a relationship with the fans? The poster I replied to blamed the City. Blaming the City is blaming the population, of which there are a ton of hockey fans. Untapped potential.

Queens has a transient population that supports them. Fine. How many full time Kingston citizens go to Queens games?

 

[leafs4life94]

But, is that the fault of the fans or the organization for not building a relationship with the fans? The poster I replied to blamed the City. Blaming the City is blaming the population, of which there are a ton of hockey fans. Untapped potential.

Queens has a transient population that supports them. Fine. How many full time Kingston citizens go to Queens games?

The issue is how do you make people care about something they haven't cared about for the last 20 years? Of course winning is the main answer, but from a strictly marketing perspective, how do you create a consistent fanbase that regularly attends?

Partnering with some downtown restaurants would be a start, but then unless you keep that partnership forever, you have to do something to get that person hooked on the game itself, rather than just seeing it as something that comes with a dinner deal.

I don't know the answer but selfishly it makes it a lot easier to buy tickets when it's not busy because I can buy them an hour before the game lol

 

[dirty12]

But, is that the fault of the fans or the organization for not building a relationship with the fans? The poster I replied to blamed the City. Blaming the City is blaming the population, of which there are a ton of hockey fans. Untapped potential.

Queens has a transient population that supports them. Fine. How many full time Kingston citizens go to Queens games?

When you figure out how to overcome the apathy towards OHL hockey in Kingston, buy the Steelheads.
I think you would be surprised by the amount of residents that observe the tradition of that annual Queens-RMC game. It’s a bit like the Labour Day Ti-Cats game, I guess.

 

[frontsfan67]

I think I’ve been to over half the OHL rinks now and I try to make as many Kingston games as I can. So much has been written on here about the reasons why Kingston doesn’t draw a crowd and many blame the ownership. I just don’t buy it, I think Kingston works hard trying to bring in the crowds, they have different theme nights, military appreciation, Cancer Awareness, Humane Society, etc. In game hosts, bouncy castles, face painting, team invites, 7th skater, promotional give always, player signing’s, community involvement including school visits…. The list goes on.

This is a beautiful city, it has a great downtown, more restaurants per capita than just about anywhere. The rink is a pretty good layout, sound system sucked for years but that’s on the City.

As mentioned before, they had an exceptional drafted player being Wright and they still couldn’t draw a crowd. What it comes down to is that this City just doesn’t support Jr hockey. Wish they did because this building could draw some exceptional talent if it was rocking like Oshawa, or Kitchener. Blame isn’t on the ownership, or the management or players- at this point it’s the community.

I’ve mentioned this about wright before but I’ll mention it again.

Springer wanted the team to be marketed not a big name player like wright.

For instance the last time they sold out from a non school day game is actually when Connor David came to town for his draft year. Why?? Everyone knows McDavid and they marketed him. Everyone wants to see that special, exceptional talent.

If they marketed the “highly touted projected 2022 first overall pick” every game I have a hard time believing they wouldn’t atleast have attracted 4000+ and especially in his draft year. Who knows- those guys that would pay to watch wright might’ve gotten out to some games and enjoyed not only Shane wright but OHL level hockey- and could’ve told their buddies, and their buddies told their buddies etc.

they could’ve had a bunch of new season ticket holders/fans because of it. Instead what do they market? A team that went out second round in other words, nothing special.

Look at Erie. Sure they were the top team in the chl for around 3 seasons but they also had McDavid and marketed it and attendance went up from 2855 in 2011-12 (without McDavid) to 3115 in 2012-13 with McDavid and then the following year in 2013-14 another big jump- 4429. And guess what? It still kept going up. 2014-15 his draft year 4947 as an AVERAGE.

+2192 fans on average in 3 years

Now Wright was never McDavid level but let’s say instead of almost 2200 he brought an extra 1000-1500 fans. Avg attendance in 2021-22 his draft year was 2698. Let’s say they add 1500 fans that is on average 4,198 fans. Literally the highest average in Kingstons history surpassing 2015-16s total of 4130

Rant over but massive missed opportunity.

 

[OMG67]

The issue is how do you make people care about something they haven't cared about for the last 20 years? Of course winning is the main answer, but from a strictly marketing perspective, how do you create a consistent fanbase that regularly attends?

Partnering with some downtown restaurants would be a start, but then unless you keep that partnership forever, you have to do something to get that person hooked on the game itself, rather than just seeing it as something that comes with a dinner deal.

I don't know the answer but selfishly it makes it a lot easier to buy tickets when it's not busy because I can buy them an hour before the game lol

Everyone is missing the point. Either Kingston is a viable OHL location or it isn’t. IMO, Kingston is a viable location:
1 - suitable arena
2- suitable population
3- population has a large volume of hockey fans
4- the average household income is satisfactory
5- the only live hockey competition is Queens

If there is apathy for the Frontenac’s, it is not the population of Kingston that is the problem. It is ownership that is the problem. The ownership is apathetic. Therefore, their fan base is apathetic.

And @dirty12 don’t be silly. Mississauga is not a comparable. The demographics isn’t comparable, there is other sports entertainment available in direct competition, and the lifestyle in Mississauga is vastly different. You can make an argument that Mississauga is not a viable OHL location whereas I don’t think you can make the same argument for Kingston. Kingston is relatively comparable to Flint, Saginaw, SSM, Windsor, London, Kitchener, Guelph, Niagara, Barrie, Sudbury, Oshawa, and Peterborough.

The only reason why the Frontenacs aren’t a staple of the Kingston community is because their ownership is disinterested in making them part of the fabric of the community for their own reasons that are not known by me.

 

[frontsfan67]

Everyone is missing the point. Either Kingston is a viable OHL location or it isn’t. IMO, Kingston is a viable location:
1 - suitable arena
2- suitable population
3- population has a large volume of hockey fans
4- the average household income is satisfactory
5- the only live hockey competition is Queens

If there is apathy for the Frontenac’s, it is not the population of Kingston that is the problem. It is ownership that is the problem. The ownership is apathetic. Therefore, their fan base is apathetic.

And @dirty12 don’t be silly. Mississauga is not a comparable. The demographics isn’t comparable, there is other sports entertainment available in direct competition, and the lifestyle in Mississauga is vastly different. You can make an argument that Mississauga is not a viable OHL location whereas I don’t think you can make the same argument for Kingston. Kingston is relatively comparable to Flint, Saginaw, SSM, Windsor, London, Kitchener, Guelph, Niagara, Barrie, Sudbury, Oshawa, and Peterborough.

The only reason why the Frontenacs aren’t a staple of the Kingston community is because there ownership is disinterested in making them part of the fabric of the community for their own reasons that are not known by me.

I agree I see other teams like Windsor they do outdoor practices and fans can attend, Kitcheners gm is usually very vocal about what is going on, Owen sound despite being the smallest town in the OHL has the most passionate fans and they go on their bus to thank every single one of the fans personally for their support when they travel for road trips- always have thought that Is the coolest thing and I wish the fronts were engaged like that. When we go on bus trips we’re lucky to get a salute of sticks by the team. We usually have the market square thing once a year but I haven’t heard of that yet.

 

[OMG67]

I agree I see other teams like Windsor they do outdoor practices and fans can attend, Kitcheners gm is usually very vocal about what is going on, Owen sound despite being the smallest town in the OHL has the most passionate fans and they go on their bus to thank every single one of the fans personally for their support when they travel for road trips- always have thought that Is the coolest thing and I wish the fronts were engaged like that. When we go on bus trips we’re lucky to get a salute of sticks by the team. We usually have the market square thing once a year but I haven’t heard of that yet.

I don’t know what the answer is. Every community is different. The citizens have different wants and needs. What works for one community may not work for the other. But, there is more than enough information available from every other teams marketing teams for the Fronts to potentially access and implement to create a game day experience that resonates with its fans.

Ultimately, the long term futility is likely the most impactful issue. But, the Fronts have performed better overall lately. They’ve had flashes of good teams., just not sustained. That is what concerned me in the offseason when some were advocating for throwing everything at this years team. That would leave then somewhat naked starting over next year. I’m not sure that is a positive or a negative. Of course, starting over next year is a negative but having a highly competitive playoff team may be what is needed regardless of the ensuing rebuild.

 

[leafs4life94]

No idea how legit this account since it's only a couple days old but it's confirming what I had hoped in that Hopkins is off the table.

 

[dirty12]

Everyone is missing the point. Either Kingston is a viable OHL location or it isn’t. IMO, Kingston is a viable location:
1 - suitable arena
2- suitable population
3- population has a large volume of hockey fans
4- the average household income is satisfactory
5- the only live hockey competition is Queens

If there is apathy for the Frontenac’s, it is not the population of Kingston that is the problem. It is ownership that is the problem. The ownership is apathetic. Therefore, their fan base is apathetic.

And @dirty12 don’t be silly. Mississauga is not a comparable. The demographics isn’t comparable, there is other sports entertainment available in direct competition, and the lifestyle in Mississauga is vastly different. You can make an argument that Mississauga is not a viable OHL location whereas I don’t think you can make the same argument for Kingston. Kingston is relatively comparable to Flint, Saginaw, SSM, Windsor, London, Kitchener, Guelph, Niagara, Barrie, Sudbury, Oshawa, and Peterborough.

The only reason why the Frontenacs aren’t a staple of the Kingston community is because their ownership is disinterested in making them part of the fabric of the community for their own reasons that are not known by me.

OHL in Kingston. Is viable, no question. I just don’t think there will be any lasting real care about the team.
I was in Kingston January through April when there was a legit contender and a booming economy. There was plenty of advertisement in print and posters and ad boards and radio. The people there are apathetic towards OHL hockey. The same could be said of jr A and midget as well. I went to a few games thinking there might be some bad blood between Kingston and Belleville, Quinte. The jr games were true blood sport met with indifference.

Maybe sports have become too easy and free to access to create or re-create a desire to see major junior hockey.

 

[OMG67]

OHL in Kingston. Is viable, no question. I just don’t think there will be any lasting real care about the team.
I was in Kingston January through April when there was a legit contender and a booming economy. There was plenty of advertisement in print and posters and ad boards and radio. The people there are apathetic towards OHL hockey. The same could be said of jr A and midget as well. I went to a few games thinking there might be some bad blood between Kingston and Belleville, Quinte. The jr games were true blood sport met with indifference.

Maybe sports have become too easy and free to access to create or re-create a desire to see major junior hockey.

I’m not trying to be a A-Hole with this question but I know it will come off that way in text so disclaimer!…

Are people in Kingston different than people in Oshawa or Windsor or Kitchener etc? And by that I mean, are they culturally different or something like that?

My point is, other VERY similar communities with similar population bases and seemingly similar cultural backgrounds have developed solid fan bases. I refuse to believe that a new owner with a new approach cannot develop a sound fanbase of dedicated fans like other relatively similar towns have in Ontario. Virtually every town around the same size as Kingston that has a suitable arena for the OHL has a team that has more steady fan support than Kingston. Almost every single one.

If you were to say “under this ownership…followed by next negative thing,” I would 100% agree. No doubt about that. To suggest or intimate this isn’t an owner apathy driven issue is, IMO, not realistic. To simply say they are apathetic and call it a day and writing the franchise off (effectively blaming apathetic people that cannot be turned around) when there are so many other similar communities that have embraced their franchise seems lazy.

London had bad ownership. The Hunters came in and turned that organization around. Ottawa had bad ownership, Hunt came in a turned that franchise around. Flint changed ownership and they built a strong fanbase. So many examples of ownership changing breathing life into the organization and building the fanbase up.

This is a simple issue. For whatever issue, Springer has a level of apathy about the Frontenacs. I’m not close enough to the situation to quite understand what the issue is. But, the City has walked away from the Fronts. They need a new owner to breath some fresh air into the lungs of the Fronts and fans will come back. There is no shortage of hockey fans and families in Kingston. Loads of minor hockey teams/families. There is no reason why that cannot happen. Maybe it cannot happen with Springer at the helm because of X Y and Z. Possible. Who knows what damage he has done overt the decades.

 

[leafs4life94]

I’m not trying to be a A-Hole with this question but I know it will come off that way in text so disclaimer!…

Are people in Kingston different than people in Oshawa or Windsor or Kitchener etc? And by that I mean, are they culturally different or something like that?

My point is, other VERY similar communities with similar population bases and seemingly similar cultural backgrounds have developed solid fan bases. I refuse to believe that a new owner with a new approach cannot develop a sound fanbase of dedicated fans like other relatively similar towns have in Ontario. Virtually every town around the same size as Kingston that has a suitable arena for the OHL has a team that has more steady fan support than Kingston. Almost every single one.

If you were to say “under this ownership…followed by next negative thing,” I would 100% agree. No doubt about that. To suggest or intimate this isn’t an owner apathy driven issue is, IMO, not realistic. To simply say they are apathetic and call it a day and writing the franchise off (effectively blaming apathetic people that cannot be turned around) when there are so many other similar communities that have embraced their franchise seems lazy.

London had bad ownership. The Hunters came in and turned that organization around. Ottawa had bad ownership, Hunt came in a turned that franchise around. Flint changed ownership and they built a strong fanbase. So many examples of ownership changing breathing life into the organization and building the fanbase up.

This is a simple issue. For whatever issue, Springer has a level of apathy about the Frontenacs. I’m not close enough to the situation to quite understand what the issue is. But, the City has walked away from the Fronts. They need a new owner to breath some fresh air into the lungs of the Fronts and fans will come back. There is no shortage of hockey fans and families in Kingston. Loads of minor hockey teams/families. There is no reason why that cannot happen. Maybe it cannot happen with Springer at the helm because of X Y and Z. Possible. Who knows what damage he has done overt the decades.

I think it all comes back to the lack of success. The demographics aren't too different from the other cities you listed and maybe a new owner could spark some life, but at the end of the day it's hard to get fans to give a shit when the team has only won 6 playoff series in the last 25+ years, including a 17 year drought between 1998-2015 with a 3-0 comeback against them.

 

[OMG67]

I think it all comes back to the lack of success. The demographics aren't too different from the other cities you listed and maybe a new owner could spark some life, but at the end of the day it's hard to get fans to give a shit when the team has only won 6 playoff series in the last 25+ years, including a 17 year drought between 1998-2015 with a 3-0 comeback against them.

If you honestly think the average hockey fan in Kingston knows that, I think you’d be mistaken. The ones that “used to” go to games that haven’t aged out may know that but I’m not sure people can rhyme off that stat.

I would agree that there is a loser tag on the team though. That is why that fresh air can build energy regardless of their lack of success.

 

[ScoutLife4]

No idea how legit this account since it's only a couple days old but it's confirming what I had hoped in that Hopkins is off the table.

That account seems to just retweet things other people have already said a month ago

 

[leafs4life94]

If you honestly think the average hockey fan in Kingston knows that, I think you’d be mistaken. The ones that “used to” go to games that haven’t aged out may know that but I’m not sure people can rhyme off that stat.

I would agree that there is a loser tag on the team though. That is why that fresh air can build energy regardless of their lack of success.

Oh yeah for sure I don't expect everyone to know that, but the loser tag is quite strong - I have a few friends that don't follow OHL hockey at all and instead of asking "how is Kingston doing this year", they ask "does Kingston suck this year" which kind of puts the teams rep into perspective.

Don't get me wrong, there's a lot outside of the on ice product that needs to be fixed, but I'm not going to pretend to be knowledgeable enough to pitch any real ideas other than make some deals with downtown bars/restaurants. (With the new Chuck's opening downtown soon I think thhat should be a prime opportunity

The other issue is that if Kingston makes a deep run and gets to the conference championships, maybe even make it to the OHL finals - I don't fully trust the new fans to understand the cyclical nature of junior, so when they inevitably are worse next year, those new fans will leave again.

I'd rather have fairweather fans than no fans, but right now they don't have many of those either lol

 

[ottsabrefan]

‘sports fans’ did not know who Villardi is. They were oblivious to the acquisitions of Villardi, Day, Pu, Jones; and no idea there was an OHL contender in town.
But they broke fire codes for the Queens-RMC game I’m sure. Kingston is not an OHL city.

It used to be. Until the owner chased all the fans away.

 

[ottsabrefan]

I think it all comes back to the lack of success. The demographics aren't too different from the other cities you listed and maybe a new owner could spark some life, but at the end of the day it's hard to get fans to give a shit when the team has only won 6 playoff series in the last 25+ years, including a 17 year drought between 1998-2015 with a 3-0 comeback against them.

All this is true. And the reason the team has sucked over the years so bad is because of that owner. OMG is bang on. It was/is an OHL town, but when you have decades of poor ownership (which leads to poor teams) the fans leave and don’t come back, unless something major changes - and it hasn’t.

 

[OMG67]

Oh yeah for sure I don't expect everyone to know that, but the loser tag is quite strong - I have a few friends that don't follow OHL hockey at all and instead of asking "how is Kingston doing this year", they ask "does Kingston suck this year" which kind of puts the teams rep into perspective.

Don't get me wrong, there's a lot outside of the on ice product that needs to be fixed, but I'm not going to pretend to be knowledgeable enough to pitch any real ideas other than make some deals with downtown bars/restaurants. (With the new Chuck's opening downtown soon I think thhat should be a prime opportunity

The other issue is that if Kingston makes a deep run and gets to the conference championships, maybe even make it to the OHL finals - I don't fully trust the new fans to understand the cyclical nature of junior, so when they inevitably are worse next year, those new fans will leave again.

I'd rather have fairweather fans than no fans, but right now they don't have many of those either lol

That is all understandable which is why I thought going for it this year was probably not the greatest idea. Maybe try to be consistently good for a few seasons. I like Mann and think he can be a strong stabilizer for the team on the ice.

If the issue is on ice then being stable is probably a good thing. If it is almost certainly ownership then it really doesn’t matter what you do. Good ont he ice? Doesn’t matter. Cross promotion marketing? Who cares? If ownership is the issue, there are only two things that can fix it. One, change the owner and hope for the best. Two, go get a face of the franchise to operate the team. Someone strong with his own reputable brand. Not just a person with name recognition like Doug Gilmour. Someone that will automatically stir up the fanbase to be the GM that can talk a good game and back it up. Someone that is going to cost a lot of $$$.

 

[dirty12]

I’m not trying to be a A-Hole with this question but I know it will come off that way in text so disclaimer!…

Are people in Kingston different than people in Oshawa or Windsor or Kitchener etc? And by that I mean, are they culturally different or something like that?

My point is, other VERY similar communities with similar population bases and seemingly similar cultural backgrounds have developed solid fan bases. I refuse to believe that a new owner with a new approach cannot develop a sound fanbase of dedicated fans like other relatively similar towns have in Ontario. Virtually every town around the same size as Kingston that has a suitable arena for the OHL has a team that has more steady fan support than Kingston. Almost every single one.

If you were to say “under this ownership…followed by next negative thing,” I would 100% agree. No doubt about that. To suggest or intimate this isn’t an owner apathy driven issue is, IMO, not realistic. To simply say they are apathetic and call it a day and writing the franchise off (effectively blaming apathetic people that cannot be turned around) when there are so many other similar communities that have embraced their franchise seems lazy.

London had bad ownership. The Hunters came in and turned that organization around. Ottawa had bad ownership, Hunt came in a turned that franchise around. Flint changed ownership and they built a strong fanbase. So many examples of ownership changing breathing life into the organization and building the fanbase up.

This is a simple issue. For whatever issue, Springer has a level of apathy about the Frontenacs. I’m not close enough to the situation to quite understand what the issue is. But, the City has walked away from the Fronts. They need a new owner to breath some fresh air into the lungs of the Fronts and fans will come back. There is no shortage of hockey fans and families in Kingston. Loads of minor hockey teams/families. There is no reason why that cannot happen. Maybe it cannot happen with Springer at the helm because of X Y and Z. Possible. Who knows what damage he has done overt the decades.

Short answer; yes, the people of Kingston seem to have no real attachment to the Frontenacs.
London is an anomaly. So is Flint I think. A far as I know the owner pretty much provided a blank cheque, but the team probably does not attract 3500 on average. I doubt Barrie is a whole lot different than Kingston. Are they averaging 4000 with a top contender? I’ll guess the (senior) Burkes were business savvy and cozied up to the casino to sell tickets as comps.

Longer term franchises like SBY, SSM, PBO, …had a market and a bond and history established before 20 NHL, NFL, NBA games each per week very cheap consumed all of the sports fan time.
In the ‘70s, if you offered a guy tickets to an OHA game he would drive 30 minutes in a blizzard without seatbelts and an open bottle of liquor to see the game. Now there are two generations that would not give up NFL Sunday to take their kids to a game if it was free and transportation provided. The only chance of infecting their kids with the bug is if they see ~10 games with minor hockey teams and school days for at least a few years. My girl sees a steelheads and/or a marlies game near weekly because she had a seat at wolves games from 4-17.

The wolves started when numerous NHL players, some future HOF came out of NE ON and played for the wolves. No matter how broken things have seemed, one tid bit of positive news sells 1000 tickets in a day because the wolves are already part of the fabric of the city.