Kingston Frontenacs 2023-24 Season Thread (Part 2)

[ScoutLife4]

Because that is a team we were 3-1 against on the season and isn’t one of the top teams in the league. It wasn’t just one game but a home and home and we lost both.

I think Oshawa is going to emerge as the best team in the East very soon - earlier in the season Oster was struggling and they were going down early and losing but he seems to have found his game and his defense is playing better in front of him as the season goes on.
Before the season started i had Oshawa and Sudbury as the 2 forces in the East.

 

[OMG67]

It might be tough to do player wise but I agree picks wise could also get it to work. My idea is to lessen the blow of Ludwinski leaving. Mathematically it’d be like having this years loss of him 75%, with next year’s player being almost equivalent in a years time. So, essentially you get 175% or so. What we did is kept the 100% for this year (0% next year). What trading picks for next year does is pushes that 100% for next year (and 0% this year).

So, to get up over that total 100%, you’d need a trade like Cliff Pu (19) for Nathan Dunkley (17). Where this time we acquire a Dunkley for this season but have him for next year. Taking the picks as you say, and trading for a 17 or 18 year or old THIS year also would have done the trick.

I know it is water under the bridge at this point.

It really depends on the player. If you acquire 8-9 picks like Saginaw did with Mintyukov, and then trade them for Donovan, you would essentially get Ludwinski as a 19 year old int he year you need him. It is a straight one for one. The names may be different but the impact is the same. At the end of the day, it is the impact you want.

If you acquire a young player and picks, you may get above replacement but you may also get well below replacement depending on how well the player develops. The one guarantee is with 8-9 high picks, you are going to get an elite player.

 

[ScoutLife4]

They NEED a win against OS on Friday - they're reeling a little bit too coming of a 10-0 drubbing so one of these teams is gonna snap out of it. If they play the way they've played these last three games they've got no shot at anything and it'll end up with another first round exit.

I had been a big Vaccari defender but I'm starting to change my tune a bit - I thought the athleticism could overcome the size issue but doubts are creeping in...

I masochistically like checking it out just to see the hot takes he's got - especially when a game devolves physically. By far the worst one was saying Hopkins jumped Delisle - then throwing a gutless chirp at him when Punnett rocked him by saying that's what happens when he goes at someone from the front - of course an 200lbs+ OA is gonna be able to outmuscle at 160lbs 16 year old.

That being said - I don't think Donnie is GU - I've seen Donnie fairly criticize the Gens, something our old friend would never do.

Gens Live isnt the sharpest knife in the drawer when it comes to hockey,.

 

[OMG67]

I think Oshawa is going to emerge as the best team in the East very soon - earlier in the season Oster was struggling and they were going down early and losing but he seems to have found his game and his defense is playing better in front of him as the season goes on.
Before the season started i had Oshawa and Sudbury as the 2 forces in the East.

Oster is a really good goalie. Oshawa limits chances against very well. That will always allow for success. Solid up and down the roster. They will be a really solid team next year. I was surprised a bit when they chose not to sell anything. Although they are good this year, they don’t seem to be tuned in quite good enough to make a real run. Still slightly young. The extra assets would have served them well next year.

 

[ScoutLife4]

Oster is a really good goalie. Oshawa limits chances against very well. That will always allow for success. Solid up and down the roster. They will be a really solid team next year. I was surprised a bit when they chose not to sell anything. Although they are good this year, they don’t seem to be tuned in quite good enough to make a real run. Still slightly young. The extra assets would have served them well next year.

Oshawa will be a scary team next season for sure.

Oster is a really good goalie. Oshawa limits chances against very well. That will always allow for success. Solid up and down the roster. They will be a really solid team next year. I was surprised a bit when they chose not to sell anything. Although they are good this year, they don’t seem to be tuned in quite good enough to make a real run. Still slightly young. The extra assets would have served them well next year.

P.S Have you heard any update on Kressler?

 

[dirty12]

It might be tough to do player wise but I agree picks wise could also get it to work. My idea is to lessen the blow of Ludwinski leaving. Mathematically it’d be like having this years loss of him 75%, with next year’s player being almost equivalent in a years time. So, essentially you get 175% or so. What we did is kept the 100% for this year (0% next year). What trading picks for next year does is pushes that 100% for next year (and 0% this year).

So, to get up over that total 100%, you’d need a trade like Cliff Pu (19) for Nathan Dunkley (17), where this time we acquire a Dunkley for this season but have him for next year. Taking the picks as you say, and trading for a 17 or 18 year or old THIS year also would have done the trick.

I know it is water under the bridge at this point.

That’s similar to how NB has managed to extend their competitive window imo. They acquired future good OAs to bolster their runs. This is the end of the run for NB though. I like that they really went all-in, while having assets to sell next season.

 

[OMG67]

Oshawa will be a scary team next season for sure.


P.S Have you heard any update on Kressler?

No update on Kressler. Didn’t look good, that’s for sure. Hopefully only out a week but who knows with head injuries. He was completely out of it.

 

[dirty12]

Oster is a really good goalie. Oshawa limits chances against very well. That will always allow for success. Solid up and down the roster. They will be a really solid team next year. I was surprised a bit when they chose not to sell anything. Although they are good this year, they don’t seem to be tuned in quite good enough to make a real run. Still slightly young. The extra assets would have served them well next year.

Built a big physical team around 2005-06 stars that can do some damage though.

 

[HockeyPops]

EDIT: .

 

[ScoutLife4]

Kingston now has the 3rd worst Goals Against in the league.

 

[dirty12]

I think Oshawa is going to emerge as the best team in the East very soon - earlier in the season Oster was struggling and they were going down early and losing but he seems to have found his game and his defense is playing better in front of him as the season goes on.
Before the season started i had Oshawa and Sudbury as the 2 forces in the East.

It was not going to start well for the Gens with Ritchie out for close to the first third of the season.

 

[Logosarejusttargets]

A couple years ago a bus or 2 full of Drunk Hamilton fans came to Kingston and were trying to fight anyone they could. -They were so drunk before the first period started that some of them could not even talk.
There was at least 5 that got taken out by the police the Security at the LC couldnt get them to leave.

Oshawa and Hamilton are the only 2 rinks I've been to where home fans were outwardly hostile/rude. I mean every team has their share of idiots in the stands - but usually no open hostility to a visiting fan. I know that Hamilton used to serve King Can's not just tall boys so that explained a lot to me. Being challenged to a fight by a group of guys because I happened to have a Fronts jersey on was a fun time - sure miss going to the Hammer...... And while Oshawa fans for the most part are good -there are quite a few that like to trash talk (even after Kingston eliminates them in a playoff game)

They NEED a win against OS on Friday - they're reeling a little bit too coming of a 10-0 drubbing so one of these teams is gonna snap out of it. If they play the way they've played these last three games they've got no shot at anything and it'll end up with another first round exit.

I had been a big Vaccari defender but I'm starting to change my tune a bit - I thought the athleticism could overcome the size issue but doubts are creeping in...

I masochistically like checking it out just to see the hot takes he's got - especially when a game devolves physically. By far the worst one was saying Hopkins jumped Delisle - then throwing a gutless chirp at him when Punnett rocked him by saying that's what happens when he goes at someone from the front - of course an 200lbs+ OA is gonna be able to outmuscle at 160lbs 16 year old.

That being said - I don't think Donnie is GU - I've seen Donnie fairly criticize the Gens, something our old friend would never do.

I find him like a car accident on the hwy....you know you probably should just keep on driving and not look, but you feel a draw to take a look.

 

[ktownfan]

Better get a win against Owen Sound Friday because saggy will be a loss most likely

 

[ottsabrefan]

It really depends on the player. If you acquire 8-9 picks like Saginaw did with Mintyukov, and then trade them for Donovan, you would essentially get Ludwinski as a 19 year old int he year you need him. It is a straight one for one. The names may be different but the impact is the same. At the end of the day, it is the impact you want.

If you acquire a young player and picks, you may get above replacement but you may also get well below replacement depending on how well the player develops. The one guarantee is with 8-9 high picks, you are going to get an elite player.

Agreed, but you only get that player next year. I’m trying to have my cake and eat it too. There is risk that said 17 or 18 year old doesn’t develop into Ludwinski at 19, but at least you would have them contributing this year. And then hope they become him next year as well.

 

[OMG67]

Agreed, but you only get that player next year. I’m trying to have my cake and eat it too. There is risk that said 17 or 18 year old doesn’t develop into Ludwinski at 19, but at least you would have them contributing this year. And then hope they become him next year as well.

Risk-Reward. The advantage of picks is you can always push them forward quite easily. Players require more effort.

 

[ottsabrefan]

Oshawa and Hamilton are the only 2 rinks I've been to where home fans were outwardly hostile/rude. I mean every team has their share of idiots in the stands - but usually no open hostility to a visiting fan. I know that Hamilton used to serve King Can's not just tall boys so that explained a lot to me. Being challenged to a fight by a group of guys because I happened to have a Fronts jersey on was a fun time - sure miss going to the Hammer...... And while Oshawa fans for the most part are good -there are quite a few that like to trash talk (even after Kingston eliminates them in a playoff game)


I find him like a car accident on the hwy....you know you probably should just keep on driving and not look, but you feel a draw to take a look.

It’s a throw back to the old days in Windsor (Windsor Arena) and London (London Ice House), and a few other former rinks (shout out to Guelph Memorial Gardens) where the fans would terrorize the opposing team. The West was definitely far worst than the East but Ottawa (as Beast mentioned) and Oshawa in the Aud had their sections that were brutal on the away team.

 

[OMG67]

It’s a throw back to the old days in Windsor (Windsor Arena) and London (London Ice House), and a few other former rinks (shout out to Guelph Memorial Gardens) where the fans would terrorize the opposing team. The West was definitely far worst than the East but Ottawa (as Beast mentioned) and Oshawa in the Aud had their sections that were brutal on the away team.

For a short period of time, the 67s had the “asylum” which was right behind the opposition bench. They weren’t mean though. They didn’t throw anything. They were more creative.

 

[ottsabrefan]

For a short period of time, the 67s had the “asylum” which was right behind the opposition bench. They weren’t mean though. They didn’t throw anything. They were more creative.

Yeah, I remember that. They had the guy that would bang the drum cymbal right over the opposition bench for the entire 30 seconds of their timeout so they couldn’t hear a thing. Hard to believe that was allowed! Haha. The good ol’ days.

 

[Logosarejusttargets]

For a short period of time, the 67s had the “asylum” which was right behind the opposition bench. They weren’t mean though. They didn’t throw anything. They were more creative.

Was that not the impetus behind moving the benches side by side on the other side of the rink ?

 

[HUSH10]

Oster is a really good goalie. Oshawa limits chances against very well. That will always allow for success. Solid up and down the roster. They will be a really solid team next year. I was surprised a bit when they chose not to sell anything. Although they are good this year, they don’t seem to be tuned in quite good enough to make a real run. Still slightly young. The extra assets would have served them well next year.

I think Oshawa's slight add this year was to just help teach this 05/06 core how to win and play as a team as well as get them some playoff experience. Oshawa is very likely a 2nd/3rd round team based on the competition in their division/conference being so close.

Oshawa could possibly win their division if they keep playing the way they are but I agree with most, they are 1 year shy of being a great team. I think we will see/are seeing a lot of growth from this team on the second of of this season and who knows, in the east, it's still anyones ball game to go to the finals though I do not thibk anyone in the east touches the big 4 in the west.

 

[OMG67]

I think Oshawa's slight add this year was to just help teach this 05/06 core how to win and play as a team as well as get them some playoff experience. Oshawa is very likely a 2nd/3rd round team based on the competition in their division/conference being so close.

Oshawa could possibly win their division if they keep playing the way they are but I agree with most, they are 1 year shy of being a great team. I think we will see/are seeing a lot of growth from this team on the second of of this season and who knows, in the east, it's still anyones ball game to go to the finals though I do not thibk anyone in the east touches the big 4 in the west.

I still question Kumpalainen returning next season. I still feel at his size and ability, the AHL should be at least a 50% chance. That would be a big loss.

 

[HUSH10]

I still question Kumpalainen returning next season. I still feel at his size and ability, the AHL should be at least a 50% chance. That would be a big loss.

Agreed. I think Oshawa is banking on both Kumpulainen and Roobroeck returning.

They have insurance if they lose Roobroeck by having four 04s next year including Roobroeck but losing either I'm sure will Sting them a little and require them to buy bigger than they wanted to compete next year.

I forsee Griffin, their 08 rookie and alot of their cupboard to be moved next year.

 

[dirty12]

I think Oshawa's slight add this year was to just help teach this 05/06 core how to win and play as a team as well as get them some playoff experience. Oshawa is very likely a 2nd/3rd round team based on the competition in their division/conference being so close.

Oshawa could possibly win their division if they keep playing the way they are but I agree with most, they are 1 year shy of being a great team. I think we will see/are seeing a lot of growth from this team on the second of of this season and who knows, in the east, it's still anyones ball game to go to the finals though I do not thibk anyone in the east touches the big 4 in the west.

Idk about a big four.
Kitchener has been great, but one injury on D it’s over.
The hounds might not be much different than the ‘67s; could beat any team, but not a good bet vs a big physical (and disciplined) team if there is one.
There is chance Sudbury and Oshawa have it together for a long enough stretch to run the hounds out of the rink.

 

[OMG67]

Idk about a big four.
Kitchener has been great, but one injury on D it’s over.
The hounds might not be much different than the ‘67s; could beat any team, but not a good bet vs a big physical (and disciplined) team if there is one.
There is chance Sudbury and Oshawa have it together for a long enough stretch to run the hounds out of the rink.

The Challenge of predicting the Eastern Conference now is that none of the teams went over the top. The ones that did solid buys only filled gaps. Where that becomes a challenge is determining how those gaps adversely affected those teams In the first half and how filling those gaps changes the dynamics within those teams.

Sudbury added some defence and a centre to help fill some gaps they had. Ottawa added two centres and a D-Man. NB added a couple forwards and a D-Man. these are three teams in particular that had decent foundations but glaring holes that were hampering the teams from finding any sustainable success. Kingston and Oshawa tinkered a bit and got better but tinkering isn’t ideal when other teams jsut as good do major changes. Brantford did very well taking advantage of some high valued graduating players and then filling their absences with viable replacements. So, they are likley slightly less than they were.

So, on the surface, only looking at the impact of changes, you have to consider NB, Sudbury and Ottawa as the ones most positively impacted. For teams like Kingston and Oshawa to push ahead of those three, they have ot obtain internal improvement that wasn’t there earlier or, in Oshawa’s case, return a significant player(Ritchie) from injury.

So, it is incumbent on Oshawa, Brantford and Kingston to prove they are in the same category as the three that filled their gaps fully. It is on NB, Sudbury and Ottawa to prove they cannot win. It is sort of the same scenario where the bigger player needs to prove he can’t play while the smaller player needs to prove he can play.

Weekend #1 was fruitful for NB And Ottawa. Both beat good teams on the road. Sudbury was a mixed bag. Oshawa proved they can be right there. Kingston looks to be struggling. Brantford is somewhere in the middle of all that floating around. I think we need a couple more weeks before we get a stronger sense of what the real landscape Is or should be.

 

[HUSH10]

The Challenge of predicting the Eastern Conference now is that none of the teams went over the top. The ones that did solid buys only filled gaps. Where that becomes a challenge is determining how those gaps adversely affected those teams In the first half and how filling those gaps changes the dynamics within those teams.

Sudbury added some defence and a centre to help fill some gaps they had. Ottawa added two centres and a D-Man. NB added a couple forwards and a D-Man. these are three teams in particular that had decent foundations but glaring holes that were hampering the teams from finding any sustainable success. Kingston and Oshawa tinkered a bit and got better but tinkering isn’t ideal when other teams jsut as good do major changes. Brantford did very well taking advantage of some high valued graduating players and then filling their absences with viable replacements. So, they are likley slightly less than they were.

So, on the surface, only looking at the impact of changes, you have to consider NB, Sudbury and Ottawa as the ones most positively impacted. For teams like Kingston and Oshawa to push ahead of those three, they have ot obtain internal improvement that wasn’t there earlier or, in Oshawa’s case, return a significant player(Ritchie) from injury.

So, it is incumbent on Oshawa, Brantford and Kingston to prove they are in the same category as the three that filled their gaps fully. It is on NB, Sudbury and Ottawa to prove they cannot win. It is sort of the same scenario where the bigger player needs to prove he can’t play while the smaller player needs to prove he can play.

Weekend #1 was fruitful for NB And Ottawa. Both beat good teams on the road. Sudbury was a mixed bag. Oshawa proved they can be right there. Kingston looks to be struggling. Brantford is somewhere in the middle of all that floating around. I think we need a couple more weeks before we get a stronger sense of what the real landscape Is or should be.

I agree with that. I don't think Oshawa has outright proven they belong at the top yet but they are on the right track. Let's see where they sit at the end of the month. 6 games left, 4 home, 2 away. 3 of them against Below .500 teams and only one of them (Brantford) has more pts than them so if Oshawa can stay consistent and come out 9/10 pts out of a possible 12 this month, they can really separate themselves.

Kingston (since it is their board) just looked lost this weekend to me against Oshawa, especially yesterday. It seems Kingston just imploded after 2 quick goals from Oshawa and decided they were gonna air out their frustrations last night. Maybe that is what they needed to reset going into this week. Work the anger out, get back on track and play some hockey. My biggest concern and has been all season is their goaltending as many have pointed out and I do not know if Vacarri can win them 4 games in a series.