Kingston Frontenacs 2023-24 Off-Season Thread (Part 4)

[dirty12]

I agree, but they are going to have to stay away from the FLU and injury bugs.

to finish 5-6, no

 

[frontsfan67]

Dervin is committed to Penn State, and I doubt that he will be looking at the NHL, so I think he is a not-on-your-life player. There really is no upside to him playing in the CHL. USHL or staying at St Andrew's is his best bet.

What’s he doing before penn state ol’ wise one? There’s 2 whole years before he would have to attend there. You don’t think he’d be thinking about the OHL which is a better league than the USHL with Troy Mann who has been an AHL head coach before? If he was going to university this coming season I’d say that would be the way to go but it’s in 2026/2027 when he is committed lol.

Manza is in the same boat as Devin, so you can forget about either one. Besides he was a 9th round pick and his numbers are good but not that good to be NHL quality so again there is no upside to playing here versus going NCAA and getting an education.

Ya you’re right! We’ve NEVER seen players de commit from universities before! What’s the point in coopers job? You should be doing it for him!

 

[beastintheeast]

What’s he doing before penn state ol’ wise one? There’s 2 whole years before he would have to attend there. You don’t think he’d be thinking about the OHL which is a better league than the USHL with Troy Mann who has been an AHL head coach before? If he was going to university this coming season I’d say that would be the way to go but it’s in 2026/2027 when he is committed lol.

No matter whether the USHL or OHL is better—and that these days is a toss-up—he CANNOT play in the OHLH. If he does, then he loses the scholarship via NCAA rules, remember?

If you look at the USHL lately, they have had a lot of kids drafted to the NHL and developed a lot of players.

Ya you’re right! We’ve NEVER seen players de commit from universities before! What’s the point in coopers job? You should be doing it for him!

IF either of these kids were NHL talent then maybe I could see it but ask yourself this. If our kid had a chance for a free ride to a top university as well as a chance to play hockey and keep the pro dream alone, would you take it?

Yew kids can decommit, but that is usually kids that are either A drafted to the NHL already or have enough ability to get drafted. Itis not usual.


The big difference these days is the Canadian kids have a whole lot more options than they did before to get to the NHL or Pro level.

Look at Malhorta this year BCHL
Look at Moldenhauer in Ottwa went USHL and now NCAA and got drafted.

Parents are looking at what is best for their child. For many kids the OHL is not the best.

 

[frontsfan67]

No matter whether the USHL or OHL is better—and that these days is a toss-up—he CANNOT play in the OHLH. If he does, then he loses the scholarship via NCAA rules, remember?

What if he wants to make the NHL and has a better shot of that with the fronts rather than some USHL team for 2 years that will play the real stars like croskery, Valentini over him? The CHL consistently has the most NHL draft picks in the nhl drafts every single year. Can’t say the same about the USHL.

If you look at the USHL lately, they have had a lot of kids drafted to the NHL and developed a lot of players.

What’s the numbers total between USHL and OHL? And USHL and the whole CHL?

IF either of these kids were NHL talent then maybe I could see it but ask yourself this. If our kid had a chance for a free ride to a top university as well as a chance to play hockey and keep the pro dream alone, would you take it?

I would let my kid decide and chances are that kid that has been playing hockey since he’s 3 would rather continue playing hockey and make the NHL becoming mega rich in fewer time doing the thing you love rather than being a doctor for 40 years.

Yew kids can decommit, but that is usually kids that are either A drafted to the NHL already or have enough ability to get drafted. Itis not usual.

You’re acting like he won’t be able to get drafted lol. In the NHL draft- some players from the OJHL got drafted. Manza just put up a PPG in the OJHL, lead his team, was 6th in goals in the whole league and was one of the youngest in the whole league. I think he has his sights set on this hockey thing.

The big difference these days is the Canadian kids have a whole lot more options than they did before to get to the NHL or Pro level.

You’re right. And he grew up in Canada, is still young, and would get a good shot in kingston here, could surprise a lot of people and earn a spot in the top 6 to end the season. Shit happens. Probably wouldn’t want to go to the US if he had a legit shot of making pro in Canada- which he does.

Look at Malhorta this year BCHL
Look at Moldenhauer in Ottwa went USHL and now NCAA and got drafted.

Malholtra is a completely different situation lol. His dad got an Abbotsford coaching job shortly after Caleb was drafted and Caleb was pushed by his dad even before getting selected by any team let alone Kingston to decide to go the BCHL and US route so a father and son aren’t on opposite sides of the second biggest country in the world.

Was a stupid pick by cooper but hindsight 20/20 he likely had no clue about his dad landing a job in Abbotsford. If pops there didn’t accept a job they probably felt they could sway Caleb to come.

Parents are looking at what is best for their child. For many kids the OHL is not the best.

Yes and women lie, men lie, numbers don’t. The CHL is not one of the best, it IS THE BEST junior development league in the world.

 

[frontsfan67]

2022-2023

www.ojhl.ca

This is OJHL alumni on NHL rosters for the 2022/2023 season.

Every year players who played or play Jr A which is an inferior league to the OHL make it to the NHL.

Currently London stars Easton Cowan, Oliver Bonk, Sam O’Rielly all played Jr A before the OHL.

Manza could definitely make the NHL. He has the skills for it clearly and is still very young. If he comes here for 2 years and lights it up are teams going to turn their heads just because he wasn’t in the OHL as a 16 year old?

 

[dirty12]

No matter whether the USHL or OHL is better—and that these days is a toss-up—he CANNOT play in the OHLH. If he does, then he loses the scholarship via NCAA rules, remember?

If you look at the USHL lately, they have had a lot of kids drafted to the NHL and developed a lot of players.

IF either of these kids were NHL talent then maybe I could see it but ask yourself this. If our kid had a chance for a free ride to a top university as well as a chance to play hockey and keep the pro dream alone, would you take it?

Yew kids can decommit, but that is usually kids that are either A drafted to the NHL already or have enough ability to get drafted. Itis not usual.


The big difference these days is the Canadian kids have a whole lot more options than they did before to get to the NHL or Pro level.

Look at Malhorta this year BCHL

Maholtra will be a pro hockey player.
The big attraction to us schools over the OHL for the top players is being elligible to play AHL at 18; or, being able to choose the NHL team they play for if patient enough to wait four years for a pay day. Unless something changed very recently, teams retain player rights for 1-3 months after the four years of school. At 22, the player does not go back into the draft; he becomes a FA

Look at Moldenhauer in Ottwa went USHL and now NCAA and got drafted.

Parents are looking at what is best for their child. For many kids the OHL is not the best.

The NHL has to try to re-negotiate retention rights of players for both us schools and CHL players

 

[beastintheeast]

What if he wants to make the NHL and has a better shot of that with the fronts rather than some USHL team for 2 years that will play the real stars like croskery, Valentini over him? The CHL consistently has the most NHL draft picks in the nhl drafts every single year. Can’t say the same about the USHL.

Do the names Fantiili and Celbrini mean anything? The bottom line is that, yes, you can shine in either league and if you are good, you will be drafted. The difference is the outside benefits off the rink. If you go to the USHL or stay at OJHL you can still play in the US If you are not drafted and it gives you options.

The universities they are commited to are not slouches.

Yes the CHL has more that the US BUT there are ore teams in the CHL than the USHL. A

What’s the numbers total between USHL and OHL? And USHL and the whole CHL?

Stay with apples and apples we are talking about playing in the OHL and the Fronts in particular.

10 USHL players went in the first round this year OHL had 9.

I would let my kid decide and chances are that kid that has been playing hockey since he’s 3 would rather continue playing hockey and make the NHL becoming mega rich in fewer time doing the thing you love rather than being a doctor for 40 years.

You are overlooking the fact that going the university route, he is still playing hockey, and if drafted, he has the option to sign whenever the NHL team wants him. What happens if he is not drafted? What does he get for a prize with the OHL?

You’re acting like he won’t be able to get drafted lol. In the NHL draft- some players from the OJHL got drafted. Manza just put up a PPG in the OJHL, lead his team, was 6th in goals in the whole league and was one of the youngest in the whole league. I think he has his sights set on this hockey thing.

You’re right. And he grew up in Canada, is still young, and would get a good shot in kingston here, could surprise a lot of people and earn a spot in the top 6 to end the season. Shit happens. Probably wouldn’t want to go to the US if he had a legit shot of making pro in Canada- which he does.

Going the USHL route or staying in Junior hockey, he still has the shot at making the NHL and being drafted.

Malholtra is a completely different situation lol. His dad got an Abbotsford coaching job shortly after Caleb was drafted and Caleb was pushed by his dad even before getting selected by any team let alone Kingston to decide to go the BCHL and US route so a father and son aren’t on opposite sides of the second biggest country in the world.

Was a stupid pick by cooper but hindsight 20/20 he likely had no clue about his dad landing a job in Abbotsford. If pops there didn’t accept a job they probably felt they could sway Caleb to come.

Malhorta told Cooper not to draft him he was signing with the BCHL. Teams got the hint with Nyman, but Kingston seemed to be sleeping.

Yes and women lie, men lie, numbers don’t. The CHL is not one of the best, it IS THE BEST junior development league in the world.

The OHL is a good league, but not everyone who plays in it makes it. All you have to remember is that players and parents have more options than being forced into the OHL. Ask the kids playing in the Q how they feel.

Kingston is not going to be a powerhouse this year. Ther are too many what if's

Maholtra will be a pro hockey player.
The big attraction to us schools over the OHL for the top players is being elligible to play AHL at 18; or, being able to choose the NHL team they play for if patient enough to wait four years for a pay day. Unless something changed very recently, teams retain player rights for 1-3 months after the four years of school. At 22, the player does not go back into the draft; he becomes a FA

Thank you for making my point also add in the ability to get a University scholarship if they are or are not drafted

The NHL has to try to re-negotiate retention rights of players for both us schools and CHL players

The 18-year-old rule has nothing to do with the NHL or NHLPA; it has to do with the CHL wanting to keep stars on their teams longer.

Imagine if Battaglia and Frasca made enough of a mark to play in the AHL.

 

[zaluty]

One thing I believe being overlooked is the fact if you draft a player from the CHL you pay a development fee. Not sure if that applies to the USHL or not. Now it doesn't mean much for a couple of rounds but when you get later in the draft that consideration may come into play.

The top end players will play where they want to play or try and manipulate where they play. There \are options out there\\\\

 

[dirty12]

Do the names Fantiili and Celbrini mean anything? The bottom line is that, yes, you can shine in either league and if you are good, you will be drafted. The difference is the outside benefits off the rink. If you go to the USHL or stay at OJHL you can still play in the US If you are not drafted and it gives you options.

The universities they are commited to are not slouches.



Stay with apples and apples we are talking about playing in the OHL and the Fronts in particular.

10 USHL players went in the first round this year OHL had 9.



You are overlooking the fact that going the university route, he is still playing hockey, and if drafted, he has the option to sign whenever the NHL team wants him. What happens if he is not drafted? What does he get for a prize with the OHL?


Going the USHL route or staying in Junior hockey, he still has the shot at making the NHL and being drafted.


Malhorta told Cooper not to draft him he was signing with the BCHL. Teams got the hint with Nyman, but Kingston seemed to be sleeping.

The OHL is a good league, but not everyone who plays in it makes it. All you have to remember is that players and parents have more options than being forced into the OHL. Ask the kids playing in the Q how they feel.

Kingston is not going to be a powerhouse this year. Ther are too many what if's


Thank you for making my point also add in the ability to get a University scholarship if they are or are not drafted

There are ON kids that have true hopes of going to Harvard that choose to play hockey at St. Andrews and other prep schools. There are really no ON kids that choose Chicago steel and other USHL teams over the OHL because they prefer a Michigan education over one at U of T or UBC.
Power, Fantili, Celebrini, Maholtra, Valentini chose a path to the NHL that includes the possibility of AHL at a younger age than the OHL. They did not choose that route for an education.
Any kid good enough to play 2-3 shifts per game at 18 for any of the top 12+ US hockey schools can get a ((guaranteed)) four year standard OHL package plus bursaries for room and board from UNB, Queens, McGill, TM, …

The 18-year-old rule has nothing to do with the NHL or NHLPA; it has to do with the CHL wanting to keep stars on their teams longer.

Imagine if Battaglia and Frasca made enough of a mark to play in the AHL.

 

[frontsfan67]

Do the names Fantiili and Celbrini mean anything? The bottom line is that, yes, you can shine in either league and if you are good, you will be drafted. The difference is the outside benefits off the rink. If you go to the USHL or stay at OJHL you can still play in the US If you are not drafted and it gives you options.

You can still get your schooling paid for in the OHL. Queens is one of the best universities in Canada and guess what? It’s in kingston.

10 USHL players went in the first round this year OHL had 9.

How many in the total draft? And how many CHL picks went in the draft compared to the USHL/NCAA route?

You are overlooking the fact that going the university route, he is still playing hockey, and if drafted, he has the option to sign whenever the NHL team wants him. What happens if he is not drafted? What does he get for a prize with the OHL?

He gets free schooling in the OHL if he comes I’m sure lol while putting hockey as his main focus as it probably has been his whole life

Malhorta told Cooper not to draft him he was signing with the BCHL. Teams got the hint with Nyman, but Kingston seemed to be sleeping.

Not arguing with this. Cooper screwed up somewhere along the line no doubt about that.

The OHL is a good league, but not everyone who plays in it makes it.

Can say the exact same about literally any other league in the world lol. If everyone made it teams would be made up of thousands of players

Kingston is not going to be a powerhouse this year. Ther are too many what if's

Don’t think they were ever going to be a power house over Brampton, Oshawa and Brantford. The conversation starts and ends with where they end up. And they could end up anywhere from 4-6 which is the difference between home ice and potentially making it on a round, and losing in the first round(again)

Thank you for making my point also add in the ability to get a University scholarship if they are or are not drafted

Not sure what you’re talking about as OHL players can graduate from universities too lol. Difference is they don’t usually graduate in 3 years so by the time they’re 21 they still have schooling left as they would for the NCAA as well. NCAA you can play when you're older than 21

Imagine if Battaglia and Frasca made enough of a mark to play in the AHL.

The only former front that this probably screwed with was Shane Wright but everyone thought until the last month before the draft that he was the sure fire #1 pick and wouldn’t have to worry about OHL or AHL ever and would jump straight into the NHL.

This year they made an exemption for him to play in the AHL as a 19 year old exceptional status player since he was exceptional status in the OHL.

 

[frontsfan67]

Penguins A to Z: Emil Pieniniemi is a long-term project

With the Pittsburgh Penguins’ 2023-24 season coming to an end without any postseason action, TribLive will offer Penguins A to Z, a player-by-player look at all 52 individuals signed to an NHL contract — including those whose deals do not begin until next season — with the organization, from...

triblive.com

Was bored. Started searching up crap. In the article it says he was assigned to Scranton at the end of the season for 2 games and he was scratched for both. Could mean something or could mean nothing for the fronts but with the rumour about Pieniniemi coming here I couldn’t help but point this out.

Also saw Gavin McCarthy apparently isn’t confirmed going back to the NCAA. He is also following the fronts and vaccari on Instagram.

So 4 players to watch this off season are Emil Pieniniemi, Gavin McCarthy, Kieran Dervin and Matthew Manza. May get 0 but may get 1 or more.

 

[ScoutLife4]

Penguins A to Z: Emil Pieniniemi is a long-term project

With the Pittsburgh Penguins’ 2023-24 season coming to an end without any postseason action, TribLive will offer Penguins A to Z, a player-by-player look at all 52 individuals signed to an NHL contract — including those whose deals do not begin until next season — with the organization, from...

triblive.com

Was bored. Started searching up crap. In the article it says he was assigned to Scranton at the end of the season for 2 games and he was scratched for both. Could mean something or could mean nothing for the fronts but with the rumour about Pieniniemi coming here I couldn’t help but point this out.

Also saw Gavin McCarthy apparently isn’t confirmed going back to the NCAA. He is also following the fronts and vaccari on Instagram.

So 4 players to watch this off season are Emil Pieniniemi, Gavin McCarthy, Kieran Dervin and Matthew Manza. May get 0 but may get 1 or more.

Pieniniemi is not ready for AHL and was not progressing in Finland as they hoped.
They have him on a strict progression plan and will have him in Kingston to monitor him closer.

 

[frontsfan67]

Pieniniemi is not ready for AHL and was not progressing in Finland as they hoped.
They have him on a strict progression plan and will have him in Kingston to monitor him closer.

Yes that was what I was hinting at.

Any idea when they may sign pieniniemi?

 

[ScoutLife4]

Yes that was what I was hinting at.

Any idea when they may sign pieniniemi?

I'm not aware of any timing.
Assuming Aug.

 

[OHL4Life]

I believe Kingston is shopping hard for higher end 04s.

 

[leafs4life94]

I believe Kingston is shopping hard for higher end 04s.

I'd have to imagine Wakely and McCoy are the two main targets.

I think you're the one that mentioned that Thibodeau wanted out - are there any others? I remember seeing rumblings that Miedema wasn't happy but I'm not sure how true that was.

 

[FrontalLobe]

I'd have to imagine Wakely and McCoy are the two main targets.

I think you're the one that mentioned that Thibodeau wanted out - are there any others? I remember seeing rumblings that Miedema wasn't happy but I'm not sure how true that was.

Definitely targeting 04's and I think a 1C is the first priority.

Miedema and Frasca.

 

[Sam14]

If Cooper is shopping hard for OAs to compliment a roster overly-saturated with 19 year olds (Ethan Miedema NHL RD 4; Luke McNamara; Matthew Soto; Tuomas Uronen NHL RD 6; Adam Cavillan; Quinton Burn NHL RD 3; Cal Uens; Jakub Chromiak; Maleek McGowan; possibly ? Emil Pieniniemi NHL RD 3; Mason Vaccari) along with some nice younger complimentary piece in Hopkins, Battaglia and Frasca, Kingston suddenly enters the Eastern conference conversation.

 

[dirty12]

Definitely targeting 04's and I think a 1C is the first priority.

Miedema and Frasca.

gotta believe for now it's a hard no on McCoy considering the wolves trade with Flint involved a RD among the two OAs moved out.

 

[frontsfan67]

gotta believe for now it's a hard no on McCoy considering the wolves trade with Flint involved a RD among the two OAs moved out.

Unless he wants to be closer to home I agree. Gotta remember though he’s from Belleville just 40 mins away from here.

If Cooper is shopping hard for OAs to compliment a roster overly-saturated with 19 year olds (Ethan Miedema NHL RD 4; Luke McNamara; Matthew Soto; Tuomas Uronen NHL RD 6; Adam Cavillan; Quinton Burn NHL RD 3; Cal Uens; Jakub Chromiak; Maleek McGowan; possibly ? Emil Pieniniemi NHL RD 3; Mason Vaccari) along with some nice younger complimentary piece in Hopkins, Battaglia and Frasca, Kingston suddenly enters the Eastern conference conversation.

Hopefully Pieniniemi comes because Chromiak and uens both on the backend again will be a disaster

 

[frontsfan67]

Based off the fronts needs I believe these would be the guys the fronts are going for.

not 100% sure about McCoy but rumour was on the Sudbury board a bit ago that he wanted out- if he wanted to go closer to home for his OA year this is the closest place I believe and oddly enough we need a RHD.

 

[dirty12]

Unless he wants to be closer to home I agree. Gotta remember though he’s from Belleville just 40 mins away from here.

It's been said McCoy did request to be moved, and Papineau denied that because he believes the wolves will be in contention. That was prior to the Flint trade that brought the wolves a couple of depth players, and now has the team with the third best collection of draft picks in the league at their disposal. Because the wolves had no choice but to move OAs, I think it might be the best over all trade Papineau has made; for roster purposes it is essentially Mania for Ewles, Klinkhammer, and 9 draft picks.

Hopefully Pieniniemi comes because Chromiak and uens both on the backend again will be a disaster

I think Uens pans out before he ages out

View attachment 893904
Based off the fronts needs I believe these would be the guys the fronts are going for.

not 100% sure about McCoy but rumour was on the Sudbury board a bit ago that he wanted out- if he wanted to go closer to home for his OA year this is the closest place I believe and oddly enough we need a RHD.

Erie is probably one of the top contenders in the other conference

 

[frontsfan67]

It's been said McCoy did request to be moved, and Papineau denied that because he believes the wolves will be in contention

Ok

I think Uens pans out before he ages out

for the sake of my sanity I hope you’re right

Erie is probably one of the top contenders in the other conference

Fair point. I don’t know what to expect of them they’re a real wildcard for me

 

[OHL4Life]

Ok

for the sake of my sanity I hope you’re right

Fair point. I don’t know what to expect of them they’re a real wildcard for me

Erie is holding or buying

 

[HolyRoller]

"For many kids the OHL is not the best."

Looks like someone missed watching the NHL Draft last week.