Kingston Frontenacs 2023-24 Off-Season Thread (Part 4)

[beastintheeast]

Looks like someone missed watching the NHL Draft last week.

No I didn't The point was that 20 years ago the CHL was the only game in town for a lot of kids. They had a monopoly on who got drafted and who did not.

Then, the NCAA started to get recognition, followed by the USHL National camps and now the BCHL.

Now, the CHL is one of many ways for NHL players to be drafted from all of these locations. THe ability for a kid that may lack size or has great school grades to attend NCAA and still have a chance to get drafted is huge. The USHL and now BCHL are now the same the kids have a chance to shine playing on teams that are considered competitive with the CHL and still have the chance to get drafted and or go to the NCAA. Parents and agents now have choices.

Is one route better than the other it is hard to say each person has their own dream. We have all seen kids that shone in a midget, or bantam were early draft picks and went nowhere at the NHL level.

 

[frontsfan67]

Is one route better than the other it is hard to say each person has their own dream. We have all seen kids that shone in a midget, or bantam were early draft picks and went nowhere at the NHL level.

bottom line is it’s not where you start- it’s where you finish. And it’s too early to talk about 2 years down the line when guys like manza may or may not get drafted. Lots can happen- good and bad in that timeframe.

 

[frontsfan67]

Anyone head anything juicy about the fronts as of late?? This is the boring part of the off season imo

 

[leafs4life94]

I doubt we're gonna get any news until the August trade window opens up.

I did notice the Gavin Betts was at the Maple Leafs "Fuelling the Future" camp while I was watching that YouTube video - I'm not sure how many players/what ages get the invite, but I don't think it's a very wide net - the other name I noticed was Braidy Wassilyn.

 

[leafs4life94]

Had some time to kill so I spent some time looking back through Kingston's import draft history - I didn't realize it's been 20+ years since their last import pick that didn't report (19 players).

Obviously there's not a ton of elite high end players - but a decent chunk of them ended being drafted in the NHL.

The other interesting thing I noticed - there were 3 separate years where they got two 2-year players out of the import draft - 2012 with Vainonen and Ikonen, 2016 with Nyman and Rasanen, and 2019 with Chromiak and Pinchuk (Pinchuk likely would've been here in 2020 if there was a season).

 

[leafs4life94]

Fronts with players at all 3 Team Canada summer camps

Burns for the Juniors
Hopkins for U18
Betts for U17

Admittedly I'm a little surprised Burns got an invite but hopefully he can take advantage and have a good showing.

I'm also somewhat surprised Malhotra didn't get an invite to the U17 camp - there are loads of players taken after him that got invites.

 

[ScoutLife4]

Fronts with players at all 3 Team Canada summer camps

Burns for the Juniors
Hopkins for U18
Betts for U17

Admittedly I'm a little surprised Burns got an invite but hopefully he can take advantage and have a good showing.

I'm also somewhat surprised Malhotra didn't get an invite to the U17 camp - there are loads of players taken after him that got invites.

Malhotra will be ineligible to play for Canada the second he steps on the ice in the BCHL.
Why would they waste a spot on him for camp?

 

[leafs4life94]

Malhotra will be ineligible to play for Canada the second he steps on the ice in the BCHL.
Why would they waste a spot on him for camp?

Oops - I completely forgot about the BCHL/Hockey Canada issue - the thought crossed my mind that it could have something to do with the NCAA path but then I saw guys like Valentini/Croskery there so I figured that couldn't be it - but that's BCHL vs USHL

 

[ScoutLife4]

Oops - I completely forgot about the BCHL/Hockey Canada issue - the thought crossed my mind that it could have something to do with the NCAA path but then I saw guys like Valentini/Croskery there so I figured that couldn't be it - but that's BCHL vs USHL

Yea the USHL kids are fine as they are not avoiding HC fees in an outlaw league they are taking a legitimate path.
The BCHL is a workaround to avoid HC / CHL / NCAA Rules.
This is supposed to be the part where kids / families, agents think twice about going to the BCHL and to hang back in the CHL or even USHL and represent their country.
It's about the only leverage Hockey Canada has in keeping them out of the BCHL.

 

[leafs4life94]

Yea the USHL kids are fine as they are not avoiding HC fees in an outlaw league they are taking a legitimate path.
The BCHL is a workaround to avoid HC / CHL / NCAA Rules.
This is supposed to be the part where kids / families, agents think twice about going to the BCHL and to hang back in the CHL or even USHL and represent their country.
It's about the only leverage Hockey Canada has in keeping them out of the BCHL.

I know it's a recent development but do you think it'll be a lifelong thing? Like if Malhotra plays a game for the BCHL, at no point in his career will he be eligible for any international hockey? That's a massive decision to make at 16/17.

 

[ScoutLife4]

I know it's a recent development but do you think it'll be a lifelong thing? Like if Malhotra plays a game for the BCHL, at no point in his career will he be eligible for any international hockey? That's a massive decision to make at 16/17.

It would take BCHL deciding to be a Hockey Canada league. (paying membership fees)
They are not going to let people bypass paying the fee and reward them by being on Canada's team who they fund / build / operate.
The kids and their families and Agent are completely aware of this when they choose the BCHL.
This is the first thing Kingston said questioned the family on too. -Why give up a potential opportunity to represent canada? -They are choosing NCAA over representing their country which is a very big statement.

 

[frontsfan67]

Had some time to kill so I spent some time looking back through Kingston's import draft history - I didn't realize it's been 20+ years since their last import pick that didn't report (19 players).

Yes they’ve always been good at getting them to report. If people like beast have been following the team this long they should know this.

The other interesting thing I noticed - there were 3 separate years where they got two 2-year players out of the import draft - 2012 with Vainonen and Ikonen, 2016 with Nyman and Rasanen, and 2019 with Chromiak and Pinchuk (Pinchuk likely would've been here in 2020 if there was a season).

Loved all these guys they picked. And I remember about Chromiak nobody thought he would come and then he did around Christmas time and he was one of the best imports we’ve ever had here. Too bad about his brother.

 

[ScoutLife4]

Yes they’ve always been good at getting them to report. If people like beast have been following the team this long they should know this.

Loved all these guys they picked. And I remember about Chromiak nobody thought he would come and then he did around Christmas time and he was one of the best imports we’ve ever had here. Too bad about his brother.

I don't think he really follows the team based on most of his posts i've seen.
It's a pretty dead giveaway when half the time he post's the roster its full of guys traded a year ago.

 

[frontsfan67]

Fronts with players at all 3 Team Canada summer camps

Burns for the Juniors
Hopkins for U18
Betts for U17

Admittedly I'm a little surprised Burns got an invite but hopefully he can take advantage and have a good showing.

I’m not surprised in the slightest about burns- I called that a mile away. He will be a guy they look at- may not make the team like ludwinski but if he tightens up his game in certain areas he will be a very valuable d man wherever he plays.

Not surprised about Hopkins obviously. I’m sure he has a lot of stuff to show there.

Betts I’m very happy for the guy. Don’t think he will be on the kingston team this year but vaccari made the u17’s his 16 year old year and it’s always great to see players get team Canada recognition.

 

[frontsfan67]

Just remembered about weir!

Wow a little surprising he didn’t get invited to the u18s maybe?? Ppg in GOJHL- I’m sure would’ve done better than some of the players on other teams if given a chance in the OHL this year.

 

[leafs4life94]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1812918171512545653

As expected Manza committed elswhere to go down the NCAA path - same team BCHL team Malhotra committed to

 

[frontsfan67]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1812918171512545653

As expected Manza committed elswhere to go down the NCAA path - same team BCHL team Malhotra committed to

Unreal same team as malholtra what are the odds

Any idea when decisions like this have to happen? Is there a final date? Just wondering about dervin

 

[OHL4Life]

Unreal same team as malholtra what are the odds

Any idea when decisions like this have to happen? Is there a final date? Just wondering about dervin

dervin is at sac, that’s a two year commitment. what makes you think dervin is coming?

 

[leafs4life94]

dervin is at sac, that’s a two year commitment. what makes you think dervin is coming?

I think there was a poster (don't remember who or how accurate the info is) a few weeks back that said that Dervin was in attendance at the orientation camp but wasn't participating due to injury - so if he did have a 2 year commitment why bother showing up.

 

[frontsfan67]

dervin is at sac, that’s a two year commitment. what makes you think dervin is coming?

Someone on here said it’s a possibility and that he circled back around the time of this years rookie camp. Just a rumour.

 

[OHL4Life]

Someone on here said it’s a possibility and that he circled back around the time of this years rookie camp. Just a rumour.

his brother just committed there, so I’d be surprised if he left

 

[frontsfan67]

his brother just committed there, so I’d be surprised if he left

Didn’t know that.

Damn.

 

[beastintheeast]

Would love to see how much of an effect the BCHL had on the WHL. A lot less travelling with BCHL.

I think that it is going to build in power as the USHL did.

As to playing for your country while as a teen there is a small amount of that would be awesome there is no guarantee that a player will be selected to play.

I see the BCHL being the Junioer hockey version of the WHA. It will be interesting to see what happens 5 years from now.

 

[OMG67]

Would love to see how much of an effect the BCHL had on the WHL. A lot less travelling with BCHL.

I think that it is going to build in power as the USHL did.

As to playing for your country while as a teen there is a small amount of that would be awesome there is no guarantee that a player will be selected to play.

I see the BCHL being the Junioer hockey version of the WHA. It will be interesting to see what happens 5 years from now.

The WHL does have some wonky travel but they don’t play nearly as balanced of a schedule as we do in the OHL. The West and East don’t play home and home. I think they rotate it around a bit and only play once at home every two seasons.

 

[frontsfan67]

The WHL does have some wonky travel but they don’t play nearly as balanced of a schedule as we do in the OHL. The West and East don’t play home and home. I think they rotate it around a bit and only play once at home every two seasons.

Believe that’s right.

Still though imagine travelling from brandon all the way to victoria. Unreal. Personally I’m surprised they don’t have a league in between for Manitoba and Saskatchewan with a few American teams and then the west with bc/Alberta and a few American teams.

Chl could definitely expand more. Whl has an all American division