Rumor: KINGS 2018-19 Season- Luc/Rob ****Show/ Sell Everyone!! Part 3

[KingsFan7824]

Kovy is likeable so it makes people think he has been better than he actually has and that he would be putting up serious points if he had better line mates.

Fact of the matter is that there is excitement around him even if it doesn't actually lead to anything. During a horrible season with not much to cheer about, him blasting a one-timer or doing something creative really stands out but, in reality, he's an aged star who has definitely lost something.

That being said, he can still play in the NHL; however, it won't be fun paying him $6MM a year for the next two. It isn't even fun right now if you look at it critically, and I like the guy.

Just like Leipsic, but with speed.

Kovalchuk is no different than he's always been, he's just a soon to be 36 year old version of what he's always been. Can't imagine the Kings get much for him, in addition to having to retain. The only reason to trade him will likely be to do him a favor.

 

[Sol]

What do you mean by "really good"? He's pretty much a non-entity defensively and hasn't provided much offense. Way underwater in every statistic. Sure he still has a cannon of a one-timer, so he's contributed on the power play, but opponents have scored 5 short handed goals while he's been on.

Kovalchuk has been a bad match since day one. Good teammate, though, so there's that.

What does him being on the PP equate to sh goals? Waht.

He's shown more drive than Kopitar.

 

[YP44]

What does him being on the PP equate to sh goals? Waht.

He's shown more drive than Kopitar.

Short handed goals against

 

[Sol]

Short handed goals against

Not that, Im saying him being on the PP doesnt mean it's on him

 

[YP44]

Not that, Im saying him being on the PP doesnt mean it's on him

Team effort to suck on the PP

 

[lumbergh]

What does him being on the PP equate to sh goals? Waht.

He's shown more drive than Kopitar.

Not sure what you're asking, but Kovalchuk is a liability, even on the power play. Opponents average 5.5 short handed goals per season when Kovalchuk is on the ice during a power play. That's not good. It's okay when his team scores a lot of power play goals, but this team clearly does not. The Kings have a goals for % of 75% with Kovalchuk on the power play. That means the opponent scores one out of every four goals, on your power play.

This is a minor point to a garbage season, but Kovalchuk has been a net minus on this team from the get go. If your definition of "drive" is the number of stickhandles a player makes on the way to doing nothing, okay. If you rather see your team score more goals than the opponent, then you might rather have Kopitar, the only competent center this team has right now.

 

[KingsFan7824]

Not that, Im saying him being on the PP doesnt mean it's on him

That's the risk of playing a forward not known for defense to begin with near the point on the PP. If he and the rest of the bunch aren't connecting, it can get stupid. Throw in a wanna-be PP QB in Doughty back there, and Kopitar sitting on the wall just lightly passing the puck around, and it's a mess.

Kopitar has 0 PP goals in his last 60 games. Only 14 PP shots on net, which is 5 fewer than Iafallo, in about 84 more PP minutes.

http://www.nhl.com/stats/player?agg...ype=2&filter=ppTimeOnIce,gte,172&sort=ppShots

Of the 80 players that have played 172 minutes on the PP in the last 60-ish games, Kopitar is 80th in shots on net.

 

[BigKing]

Dude is likeable and it is exciting when the puck is on his stick but there are serious issues with his game.

 

[KINGS17]

I would be happy with a 2nd round pick for Kovalchuk at 25% salary retention, and I agree it would be like buying the 2nd round pick.

 

[AzKing]

So the rumored asking price for Zuccarello is a 2nd and a prospect, that is interesting. He is a UFA after the season who makes $4.8 and has 9 goals and 25 assists. He is also 31.

You have Toffoli who is 26, has 12g/15a and is making $4.6 with another year on the contract. His value should be a 1st rounder and a prospect if you use Zuccarello as a comp. I think Zuccarello's asking price is high.

 

[kovacro]

So the rumored asking price for Zuccarello is a 2nd and a prospect, that is interesting. He is a UFA after the season who makes $4.8 and has 9 goals and 25 assists. He is also 31.

You have Toffoli who is 26, has 12g/15a and is making $4.6 with another year on the contract. His value should be a 1st rounder and a prospect if you use Zuccarello as a comp. I think Zuccarello's asking price is high.

I think it's pretty reasonable. Pretty consistent player during his career with the Rags. Crafty little player. Be interesting to see where he lands, but there shouldn't be a shortage of suitors.

Interested to see what sort of prospect they would get in return.

 

[DoktorJeep]

With all the speculation (or rumors?) that Florida wants Bob, CLB asking about Quick, Huberdeau on the block to free up cap space, Panarin not signing. I wonder if Blake would be able to jump in with Kekolinen and Tallon to pull off some sort of three way trade built around Quick and Toffoli, Bob and Panarin out of CLB, and Huberdeau from FL. Hash the rest out with picks going back and forth

I’d remove Toffoli and Panarin for the sake of simplifying the trade, and see it as Quick to CLB, Bob to FLA and Huberdeau to LA. Assuming the other teams were desperate enough to make this move, as a Kings fan, I’d be all over it.

Hey guys, Isles fan coming in peace. A lot of posters over on the NYI board are interested in Kovy. How's he been playing? His stats are meh but how are his skills (specifically, shooting)? Thanks!

Kovy would immediately play with the most talented center in his career if he slotted into Barzals line. Plus he can easily replace Eberles production if he walks next summer.

 

[Johnny Utah]

Kings should only be dumping olders player right now.

I would not trade Toffoli - he is one of the few decent players in that middle bracket.

On NHL network they were saying that's the problem with the Ducks, a lot of young rookies (19-23 years old) and then older guys (29+), not many guys in the middle except their solid top 4 D core.

We have Forbort, LaDue, Clifford and Toffoli all in that 26-27 year old range. Iafallo is 25. Not exactly an elite group in that middle bracket.

 

[KingsFan7824]

So the rumored asking price for Zuccarello is a 2nd and a prospect, that is interesting. He is a UFA after the season who makes $4.8 and has 9 goals and 25 assists. He is also 31.

You have Toffoli who is 26, has 12g/15a and is making $4.6 with another year on the contract. His value should be a 1st rounder and a prospect if you use Zuccarello as a comp. I think Zuccarello's asking price is high.

Toffoli career average: 23g, 47pts
Zuccarello career average: 18g, 57pts

Toffoli playoff average: 16g, 37pts
Zuccarello playoff average: 15g, 42pts

Toffoli average this year: 18g, 40pts
Zuccarello average this year: 18g, 66pts

Toffoli points/60 since 14-15: 2.20
Zuccarello points/60 since 14-15: 2.29

Toffoli points/60 this year: 1.66
Zuccarello points/60 this year: 2.45

Toffoli points/60 since Jan 1st: 2.68
Zuccarello points/60 since Jan 1st: 3.42

This is when Toffoli has actually been productive this season. When he hasn't driven us all insane.

Toffoli may be signed for another year, but you then have to account for that cap hit, even if he doesn't produce. Especially if he doesn't produce. If Zuccarello doesn't do anything, there's no commitment. Why would Toffoli's value be any higher? There doesn't seem to be more from Toffoli than Zuccarello. Can argue Toffoli has been dragged down my linemates, but that could also make Toffoli that much more dependent of a winger.

 

[YP44]

Toffoli career average: 23g, 47pts
Zuccarello career average: 18g, 57pts

Toffoli playoff average: 16g, 37pts
Zuccarello playoff average: 15g, 42pts

Toffoli average this year: 18g, 40pts
Zuccarello average this year: 18g, 66pts

Toffoli points/60 since 14-15: 2.20
Zuccarello points/60 since 14-15: 2.29

Toffoli points/60 this year: 1.66
Zuccarello points/60 this year: 2.45

Toffoli points/60 since Jan 1st: 2.68
Zuccarello points/60 since Jan 1st: 3.42

This is when Toffoli has actually been productive this season. When he hasn't driven us all insane.

Toffoli may be signed for another year, but you then have to account for that cap hit, even if he doesn't produce. Especially if he doesn't produce. If Zuccarello doesn't do anything, there's no commitment. Why would Toffoli's value be any higher? There doesn't seem to be more from Toffoli than Zuccarello. Can argue Toffoli has been dragged down my linemates, but that could also make Toffoli that much more dependent of a winger.

Looking at that I guess if a team values a goal scorer over a setup man they should Toffoli's way

 

[BigKing]

Issue is paying him for next season as well. There is future risk associated with Toffoli that won't be there at next year's deadline.

Muzzin's additional year was a positive but Toffoli's is a negative.

 

[fsanford]

This turned out to be quite the Valentine's Day.

Man Alex played in the league for lots of years after leaving the Kings, I hated watching him in the Sabres. Boucher best years were with the Stars.. Kings got a whole lot of nothing int that deal

 

[AzKing]

Toffoli career average: 23g, 47pts
Zuccarello career average: 18g, 57pts

Toffoli playoff average: 16g, 37pts
Zuccarello playoff average: 15g, 42pts

Toffoli average this year: 18g, 40pts
Zuccarello average this year: 18g, 66pts

Toffoli points/60 since 14-15: 2.20
Zuccarello points/60 since 14-15: 2.29

Toffoli points/60 this year: 1.66
Zuccarello points/60 this year: 2.45

Toffoli points/60 since Jan 1st: 2.68
Zuccarello points/60 since Jan 1st: 3.42

This is when Toffoli has actually been productive this season. When he hasn't driven us all insane.

Toffoli may be signed for another year, but you then have to account for that cap hit, even if he doesn't produce. Especially if he doesn't produce. If Zuccarello doesn't do anything, there's no commitment. Why would Toffoli's value be any higher? There doesn't seem to be more from Toffoli than Zuccarello. Can argue Toffoli has been dragged down my linemates, but that could also make Toffoli that much more dependent of a winger.

Toffoli is also 5 years younger than Zuccarello. Just age alone probably makes him more valuable because he still has years left to develop wheras at 31, Zuccarello is starting the later part of his career.

 

[AmadiosAmigos]

Hey guys, Isles fan coming in peace. A lot of posters over on the NYI board are interested in Kovy. How's he been playing? His stats are meh but how are his skills (specifically, shooting)? Thanks!

My question is what do Isles fans think a fair deal would be? I believe most Kings fans would be open to dealing him, I dont feel there is a lot of hate but this were going south as the season started for this team and our new coach has taken any possible chances of getting Kovy going away from him.

Would you guys take on Alzner's contract if it came with Suzuki if it meant giving Toffoli?

I think I have been playing NHL 19 too much but it would allow LA to move Martinez for a 1st (hopefully) or a 2nd. However then we would be stuck with Alzner and Dion dragging down our D.

Yes please to Suzuki!!!
Even if it means taking on an Alzner contract that we could hopefully compliance buyout after a season anyways. Suzuki is an absolute treat to watch play, high end skill with an absolute sniper shot. Id do it in a heartbeat

 

[KingsFan7824]

Toffoli is also 5 years younger than Zuccarello. Just age alone probably makes him more valuable because he still has years left to develop wheras at 31, Zuccarello is starting the later part of his career.

But Zuccarello has been more productive, despite being older. Be it in the longer term, the short term, regular season, post season. Toffoli scores more goals, but not that many more on average. Not sure I'd say Toffoli has more room to develop either. He is what he is now. Maybe in the right situation, with the right C, he can get 30, but he's going to be 27 in April. He's a finished product.

 

[YP44]

My question is what do Isles fans think a fair deal would be? I believe most Kings fans would be open to dealing him, I dont feel there is a lot of hate but this were going south as the season started for this team and our new coach has taken any possible chances of getting Kovy going away from him.



Yes please to Suzuki!!!
Even if it means taking on an Alzner contract that we could hopefully compliance buyout after a season anyways. Suzuki is an absolute treat to watch play, high end skill with an absolute sniper shot. Id do it in a heartbeat

compliance buy outs were a one time thing. It would be a regular buy out and come with a cap hit of $1M next season, $4.2M 2020-2021, $2.2M the next year and then just over $1M for 3 years.

 

[AzKing]

But Zuccarello has been more productive, despite being older. Be it in the longer term, the short term, regular season, post season. Toffoli scores more goals, but not that many more on average. Not sure I'd say Toffoli has more room to develop either. He is what he is now. Maybe in the right situation, with the right C, he can get 30, but he's going to be 27 in April. He's a finished product.

Could be that he has hit his ceiling. I think that there are teams out there that may look at him as a guy who could thrive if put on a line with an elite setup guy. On a team going somewhere could make a difference as well. I don't think that anyone would argue that even if he is a finished product, that product has 25-30 goal potential if in the right environment.

Zuccarello is going to get more assists for sure while Toffoli is that shoot first type of guy. It probably depends on the needs.

 

[KINGS17]

compliance buy outs were a one time thing. It would be a regular buy out and come with a cap hit of $1M next season, $4.2M 2020-2021, $2.2M the next year and then just over $1M for 3 years.

I think some people may be expecting compliance buyouts to be brought to life again in the next CBA.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I don’t anticipate a trade, however, it wouldn’t surprise me to see the Kings be one of his suitors on July 1.

 

[Reaper45]

Free agency? Sure go after him. Trade? Not a chance.