Confirmed with Link: Keith Jones actually set to be named real life part-time President of Hockey Operations, Danny Briere full-time GM

[Larry44]

In the video Hilferty is referring to Tortorella and Briere collaborating together.

"Again working in collaboration with Coach Torts about potential trades and about potential draft picks."

He then follows that up with:

"What we're about now is we're going to take a deliberate approach to build this team the right way."

Whatever the f*** that means. They don't know what the "right" way is.

I could have respected this process if Hilferty had just come out and said, “Look, I know SFA about hockey but I am man crushing hard on Torts. He just talks so macho, ooh, he gives me goosebumps. He's like that coach in that Miracle movie. Again! Again! You got it, big boy. And Val’s banging him too, so she's on board. We made John “President of Hockey Ops, GM and Head Coach." Then we realized that was too much. We saw a Hobbit, Bilbo Briere, sitting outside Chuck's old office looking for something to do and made him GM, as long as he agreed to give Torts final say on everything. Torts didn't want to deal with the media, so we hired that amusing goof Jones from Brantford who is on the TV broadcasts to do whatever he can to distract from the team's disarray. It's a revolutionary reverse hierarchy, where the Coach rules everything. It's a New Error in Orange!

 

[Columbus Hockey Dad]

No one has argued that. The point is the McDavid would be a better player if he made the transition Sidney made mid-career, where he went from elite offensive player to elite two way player. It's less whether there's a net benefit from his play than the example your best player sets for his teammates - that winning is more important than personal stats.

I don't get while people don't understand this. Sometimes it feels like they are purposefully twisting the argument.

McDavid has perfect chemistry on any team in the league.

This is like turning your nose up at Mario or Wayne because they don't defend more. Literally the same thing. It's insane. When defending the team requires being completely unreasonable, it isn't worth defending.

I think he's just saying that McDavid could be even better. That's it. Nothing more to it.

 

[Starat327]

While were at it, why dont we turn all the Kentucky Derby racehorses into plowhorses. I dont see why they cant do the grunt work.

 

[Flyerfan4life]

I don't get while people don't understand this. Sometimes it feels like they are purposefully twisting the argument.


I think he's just saying that McDavid could be even better. That's it. Nothing more to it.

next level Mcjesus would be unfair to the rest of the league.

hes already a borderline cheatcode

 

[Beef Invictus]

I don't get while people don't understand this. Sometimes it feels like they are purposefully twisting the argument.


I think he's just saying that McDavid could be even better. That's it. Nothing more to it.

Nah. You do not want McDavid sacrificing a scrap of offense to grind the boards more. He is average to above-average at defense, which makes him better than many other players across the league already. It's like Oates declaring that he wants to f*** with Ovechkin's stick and shot mechanics. You fire any coach who wants to do that immediately

 

[Columbus Hockey Dad]

Nah. You do not want McDavid sacrificing a scrap of offense to grind the boards more. He is average to above-average at defense, which makes him better than many other players across the league already. It's like Oates declaring that he wants to f*** with Ovechkin's stick and shot mechanics. You fire any coach who wants to do that immediately

Well, this is where there's an argument to be had. Do you mess with McDavid and have him be a relentless backchecker? Would it really hamper his offensive game? Would he be better overall? I don't know. Personally, what I've seen out of him the last two years is remarkable. The problem in Edmonton remains their defense and goaltending.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Well, this is where there's an argument to be had. Do you mess with McDavid and have him be a relentless backchecker? Would it really hamper his offensive game? Would he be better overall? I don't know. Personally, what I've seen out of him the last two years is remarkable. The problem in Edmonton remains their defense and goaltending.

I don't mess with a Prime McDavid's game in the slightest. I'd just unleash him. All he does is beat down his opposition. It's the rest of the team where I'd need to worry about if they're playing adequate defense

 

[Beef Invictus]

Thinking of it more, people like McDavid aren't people I worry about changing.

People like Hayes though? There's a guy who needs a coach hammering on his game hard. He needs to be better on defense to maximize utility, and he also needs to cut out the Zherdevesque one man show where he puts up decent individual stats but for long stretches anyone who plays with him is negatively impacted and it offsets his individual achievements.

For the offensively elite though, I prefer to let them just outscore the opposition and worry about defense elsewhere. Let the other team try to catch up to them instead of having them suppress the other team, when they can achieve the similar result by just doing offense.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

It's the same thing he's been doing for years, no matter what or who the topic. It's the same thing he'll continue to do for more years to come because you nimkampoops keep taking the bait

I would like this post even more if I could because you dropped ninkampoops in a post.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

You know what is considered good defense? Possessing the puck. Something McDavid does better than anyone else. The other team can’t score if you have the puck. So this just adds how f***ing dumb this argument is.

 

[Rebels57]

I would like this post even more if I could because you dropped ninkampoops in a post.

I find it to be the least offensive way of telling people they're being stupid lol

 

[Beef Invictus]

I find it to be the least offensive way of telling people they're being stupid lol

It is spelled nincompoop though

 

[Lindberg]

The more time I spend on this forum the more I realize how much of a waste of time it is.
Same stupid arguments by the same people.

 

[Larry44]

The more time I spend on this forum the more I realize how much of a waste of time it is.
Same stupid arguments by the same people.

Unless you choose not to see the redundant click bait....

 

[Rich Nixon]

The more time I spend on this forum the more I realize how much of a waste of time it is.
Same stupid arguments by the same people.

There aren't really distinct threads here. It's all just kind of one big circular and toxic conversation, especially now that we're not in draft/trade/free agency mode, and especially during the season since the games suck and the outcomes don't matter.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

You know what is considered good defense? Possessing the puck. Something McDavid does better than anyone else. The other team can’t score if you have the puck. So this just adds how f***ing dumb this argument is.

You realize that opponents have the puck plenty even when McDavid is on the ice, right?

Christ, you make it sound like Edmonton plays keep-away & has the puck 100% of the time whenever McDavid is out there.

 

[FLYguy3911]

Lost in the Barkov vs. McDavid discussion is Torts saying Makar is too high. Ofc he immediately goes on to win a Norris, becomes the backbone of a Cup winning team, and joins the discussion of best non-McDavid player in the world.

Barkov 12 months later isn't even the best forward on his own team.

Just the foresight you want from the guy in charge of leading your "new era". So exciting!

The funny thing about hockey guys is they go out of their way to imply that maybe the best offensive player we've ever seen needs to be better defensively but if the shoe is on the other foot, they never say guys need to be better offensively. It's so ridiculous.

 

[deadhead]

You realize that opponents have the puck plenty even when McDavid is on the ice, right?

Christ, you make it sound like Edmonton plays keep-away & has the puck 100% of the time whenever McDavid is out there.

The difference in possession between top and bottom is something on the order of 55% to 45%.
The guys below 45% tend to be fourth liners playing 8 minutes a night.

So even if you're great at possession, you can be a liability if that 45% includes a lot of HDCF b/c you're caught out of position and allow too many odd man rushes, or don't work hard to back check and leave your defense out to dry.

Nor does playing great defense preclude offense, just look at Selke voting (which is generally the best defensive players with good offense!)
winners: Bergeron (5), Barkov, Couts, ROR, Kopitar (2), Toews, Kesler, Datysuk (3), Brind'Amour (2).

Though there seems to be a balance, but this may reflect usage as well as skill, i.e., if you're really good defensively, you may be used more in shutdown situations and less in offense first situations.

10+% of Selke votes and > ppg:
2021-22: Lindholm (2), Barkov (3)
2020-21: Barkov (1), Stone (3)
2018-19: Crosby (4), Barkov (5)
2017-18: Kopitar (1)
2015-16: Thorton (5)
2012-13: Toews (1), Datysuk (3)
2008-19: Datysuk (1)
2007-08: Datysuk (1), Zetterberg (3)
2006-07: Brind'Amour (1)
2005-06: Alfredsson (4)
2003-04: St. Louis (4)
2002-03: Forsberg (4), Modano (6)
2000-01: Sakic (2), Modano (3), Elias (8)

 

[Beef Invictus]

You realize that opponents have the puck plenty even when McDavid is on the ice, right?

Christ, you make it sound like Edmonton plays keep-away & has the puck 100% of the time whenever McDavid is out there.

When the other team has the puck McDavid is not a detriment on defense. Tortorella thinks he is because he is an idiot.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

The difference in possession between top and bottom is something on the order of 55% to 45%.
The guys below 45% tend to be fourth liners playing 8 minutes a night.

So even if you're great at possession, you can be a liability if that 45% includes a lot of HDCF b/c you're caught out of position and allow too many odd man rushes, or don't work hard to back check and leave your defense out to dry.

Nor does playing great defense preclude offense, just look at Selke voting (which is generally the best defensive players with good offense!)
winners: Bergeron (5), Barkov, Couts, ROR, Kopitar (2), Toews, Kesler, Datysuk (3), Brind'Amour (2).

Though there seems to be a balance, but this may reflect usage as well as skill, i.e., if you're really good defensively, you may be used more in shutdown situations and less in offense first situations.

10+% of Selke votes and > ppg:
2021-22: Lindholm (2), Barkov (3)
2020-21: Barkov (1), Stone (3)
2018-19: Crosby (4), Barkov (5)
2017-18: Kopitar (1)
2015-16: Thorton (5)
2012-13: Toews (1), Datysuk (3)
2008-19: Datysuk (1)
2007-08: Datysuk (1), Zetterberg (3)
2006-07: Brind'Amour (1)
2005-06: Alfredsson (4)
2003-04: St. Louis (4)
2002-03: Forsberg (4), Modano (6)
2000-01: Sakic (2), Modano (3), Elias (8)

Right, that’s what I’m saying.

People always say “the best defense is having the puck!” as if the other team still won’t have the puck ~45% of the time.

 

[Danko]

I would like to take this moment to remind everyone that the best defense, is a great offense

Sun Tzu wrote, "Attack is the secret of defense; defense is the planning of an attack."

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

I would like to take this moment to remind everyone that the best defense, is a great offense

Sun Tzu wrote, "Attack is the secret of defense; defense is the planning of an attack."

I would like to take this moment to remind everyone that preferring a Barkov type player to Connor McDavid is moronic.

 

[Columbus Hockey Dad]

I would like to take this moment to remind everyone that preferring a Barkov type player to Connor McDavid is moronic.

I would like to take this moment to remind everyone that Torts often speaks in hyperbole...particularly when he was an ESPN analyst. Though I hate to get in the way of the agenda of certain people here.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

I would like to take this moment to remind everyone that Torts often speaks in hyperbole...particularly when he was an ESPN analyst. Though I hate to get in the way of the agenda of certain people here.

Torts’ actions correlate to his words.

So… it sure seems like the people that are inserting themselves into Torts’ head and telling us what he really means are the ones with an agenda.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

I would like to take this moment to remind everyone that Torts often speaks in hyperbole...particularly when he was an ESPN analyst. Though I hate to get in the way of the agenda of certain people here.

And apparently it worked, because people are still talking about it.