Confirmed with Link: Keith Jones actually set to be named real life part-time President of Hockey Operations, Danny Briere full-time GM

[LegionOfDoom91]

Zito made perhaps the highest degree of difficulty NHL trade in a decade and hit a grand slam. You describe him as such.

Someone Chuck Fletcher drafted scores a goal against HC Reykjavik in the Icelandic league in his mid 30s against a team consisting entirely of geldings with trowels for skates and you can see the plan in action.

This is why you get baffled reactions.

You don’t enjoy hearing about Samu Tuomaala ripping up a second tier Finnish pro league?

 

[Chicken N Raffls]

I found part of that fan base....

Who the f*** does that?

Actually, probably one of Val's stooges

 

[WIP CALLER]

I found part of that fan base....

I’m prepared! Just got my new jersey!!

 

[JojoTheWhale]

You cannot blow by the degree of difficulty of that Tkachuk trade and expect me to do anything but laugh. Huberdeau was coming off of ONE HUNDRED AND FIFTEEN Points, good for 2nd place. He lead the league in Assists. They not only sold him at his apex, they added a top pair Defenseman to get back one player and it was still a grand slam.

I hated some of Zito’s other moves. I don’t expect to agree with everything a team does. But in a league defined by steering into the path of least resistance, he pulled off a trade less than 5 other teams even attempt. If that doesn’t fall under a separate category from most trades, we do not approach the current NHL in ways that will ever find a meeting point.

If Zito was smart enough to recognize that Verhaeghe was a top scorer who just needed a chance, he should have recognized that Tippett was a potential goal scorer that just needed a chance. If one was a brilliant move, by the same standard, the other was a mistake.

Chuck Fletcher made one mistake. Trading Owen Tippett after your choice of 77 Games is a mistake.

Please ignore the 21 Games the previous season. Please ignore that I argued until I was blue in the face that trading for Artemi Panarin was among the mistakes by an “idiot GM” that hurt John Tortorella’s ability to perform.

I wish this was about something I could understand. Perhaps you’re just an unabashed fan of sweaters under suits. Then it would at least make sense. But I think it’s just about being a homer because your opinions change when theirs do. That’s boring.

 

[BillDineen]

You don’t enjoy hearing about Samu Tuomaala ripping up a second tier Finnish pro league?

Love Jonesey talking about some of the top teams getting skill outside of the first round and not only is Tuomaala looking like a bust, but chuckles has them down 2 2nds and more in upcoming drafts

 

[Magua]

Wheeler ranked their farm system 26th in January 2023.
They've traded their first rd pick the next three drafts, their 3rd this year and 2nd next year.

And one of those 1sts was used to acquire Tkachuk after they went "all-in." They still have Lundell and Samoskevich, their previous 2 picks, who should have quality impact in their window. For the more than one way to skin a cat crowd (ew), who say that lottery picks aren't necessary, Florida is one of the best pro scouting teams in the league under Zito. They not only identify moldable underrated talent but they actually do the molding. It has allowed them to move picks. Picks are not the end all be all -- they're a means to acquire NHL talent. They just so happen to be the most foolproof way to do so in a league of fools. It's very fitting if Vegas is in the Cup Finals too while riverboat gambling for elite talent.

Last time I checked, the Flyers traded the 13th overall pick, 3 high 2nds, and a 3rd rounder in a similar timeframe for net negative players on a bottom feeder. Let alone Giroux (rental) and Tkachuk long-term for a contender. Do you think a couple extra late 1sts makes up for that gap? Fortunately, when Fletcher was hired, the Flyers had a universally praised top 3-5 pool.

 

[Deadpool8812]

I may be wrong, but was Zito available when we fired Hextall? I thought I remember hearing his name as someone they interviewed

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

I may be wrong, but was Zito available when we fired Hextall? I thought I remember hearing his name as someone they interviewed

He was.

 

[freakydallas13]

They do need to focus on defense, right now it's a shambles.
On offense, they have Foerster and maybe Brink this fall, Gauthier next fall, they have a shot at a decent top six.
But other than York, nothing is certain with this defense.

The Flyers were 29/32 in terms of goals scored this season.

"Need to focus on defence", lmao.

 

[Rebels57]

The Flyers were 29/32 in terms of goals scored this season.

"Need to focus on defence", lmao.

No one in the media will call them on it. Its amazing.

 

[Deadpool8812]

He was.

Thought so....good thing they went with someone with a track record like Fletcher

 

[Flyerfan4life]

No one in the media will call them on it. Its amazing.

no ones lifting their snoot out of the Flyer food trough..

 

[deadhead]

You cannot blow by the degree of difficulty of that Tkachuk trade and expect me to do anything but laugh. Huberdeau was coming off of ONE HUNDRED AND FIFTEEN Points, good for 2nd place. He lead the league in Assists. They not only sold him at his apex, they added a top pair Defenseman to get back one player and it was still a grand slam.

I hated some of Zito’s other moves. I don’t expect to agree with everything a team does. But in a league defined by steering into the path of least resistance, he pulled off a trade less than 5 other teams even attempt. If that doesn’t fall under a separate category from most trades, we do not approach the current NHL in ways that will ever find a meeting point.



Chuck Fletcher made one mistake. Trading Owen Tippett after your choice of 77 Games is a mistake.

Please ignore the 21 Games the previous season. Please ignore that I argued until I was blue in the face that trading for Artemi Panarin was among the mistakes by an “idiot GM” that hurt John Tortorella’s ability to perform.

I wish this was about something I could understand. Perhaps you’re just an unabashed fan of sweaters under suits. Then it would at least make sense. But I think it’s just about being a homer because your opinions change when theirs do. That’s boring.

I don't think the Panarin trade was a good trade, value on paper but not on ice, the same way signing JT didn't make Toronto a better team.
Chemistry and balance does matter, look at the players Carolina has let walk, and they'd be in the finals if Bob wasn't having a totally anomalous playoff run.
Reason is Carolina has a strong sense of who "fits" and values that as much as pure talent.

Huberdeau and Weegar for Tkachuck was driven by cap considerations and long-run v short-run - Florida isn't going to have much in the pipeline the next 3 years or so, so dumping cap and adding a top young talent was a coup. He couldn't afford to sign the two in the short-run, and be stuck with their contracts in their 30s without a lot of cheap young talent in the pipeline. They were taking a step backward this season until Bob went bat shit.

My point with Verhaeghe and Tippett if it's smart to recognize other teams' undervalued players, it's dumb not to recognize your own, You can't say he's smart for finding a player who didn't perform that well elsewhere, but couldn't foresee his own player playing better elsewhere - two sides of the same coin.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

The goalposts have been moved so far from the original topic that I’m not even sure they’re goal posts anymore. They may be foul poles.

 

[Beef Invictus]

They do need to focus on defense, right now it's a shambles.
On offense, they have Foerster and maybe Brink this fall, Gauthier next fall, they have a shot at a decent top six.
But other than York, nothing is certain with this defense.


Until the finals he had a save % > .920. When he faltered, so did the team.
He wasn't pulling a "Price," but he probably had the best Flyer playoff until Hart in 2019-20.
Flyers just haven't had goalies take them for long PO runs the last couple decades.
Sometimes it's less about being unstoppable than simply dependable.

They will not have a decent top six.

 

[FlyerNutter]

The Flyers were 29/32 in terms of goals scored this season.

"Need to focus on defence", lmao.

Flyers would be the idiots on Alderaan staring up at the nice shiny new moon.

 

[Beef Invictus]

The Flyers were 29/32 in terms of goals scored this season.

"Need to focus on defence", lmao.

And inability to control play and drive offense means you spend a lot more time defending, which always ends in failure.

But sure, let's go deeper down that hole. This is the dumbest team in the NHL.

 

[Magua]

I’m crying that trading for Panarin age 26 was a bad on-ice trade. The guy with the top 2 highest point totals in team history. Acquired for Saad and spare parts.

“Now, for my next trick watch as I spin Ristolainen as a good on-ice trade…...”

 

[Beef Invictus]

The goalposts have been moved so far from the original topic that I’m not even sure they’re goal posts anymore. They may be foul poles.

One of them has become a tetherball pole

 

[Beef Invictus]

I’m crying that trading for Panarin age 26 was a bad on-ice trade. The guy with the top 2 highest point totals in team history.

Now, watch as Ristolainen is spun as a good on-ice trade.

It makes sense when you try to think in a way where Tortorella has never erred, he is universally loved and players are honored to be treated like shit (never mind the Rangers room revolting against him), he despises offense but is an offensive mastermind, etc

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

Can we also point out the hilariousness of pointing out that the Hurricanes would likely be in the Finals if it wasn’t for Bob while also mocking the Leafs when they got Bob’d just the same?

The original Zito comment was in regards to let’s relax on making sweeping statements based off of random small sample sizes but somehow it’s morphed into a tetherball pole.

 

[ponder719]

I may be wrong, but was Zito available when we fired Hextall? I thought I remember hearing his name as someone they interviewed

As I recall (though this may be wishful thinking on my part), Zito was the other finalist for the job.

Hah, Google Fu for the win.

Chuck Fletcher named Flyers general manager, calls it a ‘dream come true’

The Harvard grad had a mostly successful nine-year run as the Minnesota Wild GM before being fired after last season.

www.inquirer.com

About halfway through the article.

 

[Deadpool8812]

As I recall (though this may be wishful thinking on my part), Zito was the other finalist for the job.

Hah, Google Fu for the win.

Chuck Fletcher named Flyers general manager, calls it a ‘dream come true’

The Harvard grad had a mostly successful nine-year run as the Minnesota Wild GM before being fired after last season.

www.inquirer.com

About halfway through the article.

Article is behind a pay wall, but yeah, I thought so.

Good job, Flyers

Apparently Fletchet had a "mostly successfull" run in Minnesota...are they serious?

 

[Beef Invictus]

Can we also point out the hilariousness of pointing out that the Hurricanes would likely be in the Finals if it wasn’t for Bob while also mocking the Leafs when they got Bob’d just the same?

The original Zito comment was in regards to let’s relax on making sweeping statements based off of random small sample sizes but somehow it’s morphed into a tetherball pole.

I hear training camp is a better assessment tool than NHL games.

 

[deadhead]

I’m crying that trading for Panarin age 26 was a bad on-ice trade. The guy with the top 2 highest point totals in team history. Acquired for Saad and spare parts.

“Now, for my next trick watch as I spin Ristolainen as a good on-ice trade…...”

Two years of Panarin were acquired, since he made it clear he had no interest in staying in Columbus.
They scored 247 goals the year before they acquired Panarin, 236 and 256 after they acquired him.

The offense collapsed after Panarin, Duchene, Duclair left, but primarily b/c Torts got conservative after Bob left, protecting two mediocre goalies in Korpisalo and Merzlikins.

Nor did acquiring Panarin turn the Rangers around, it would take two more years and the emergence of Shesterkins and a bunch of young players like Fox, Chytil, adding Trouba, etc.

Toronto
2016-17: 250 goals
2017-18: 270 goals
2018-19: 286 goals (add JT)
2019-20: 278 goals (237 in 70 games)
2020-21: 272 goals (186 in 56 games)
2021-22: 312 goals
2022-23: 278 goals

Adding a top scorer doesn't always make a big difference for a number of reasons:
1) cost to add player, trade, cap hit, weakens depth or makes it hard to retain other offensive players
2) chemistry, only one puck, lines are most effective with the right mix of players, a top score can push other players into less effective roles
3) minutes, you pay a scorer, you feel obligated to give him a lot of minutes, blocking the development of other players

Article is behind a pay wall, but yeah, I thought so.

Good job, Flyers

Apparently Fletchet had a "mostly successfull" run in Minnesota...are they serious?

About as good as Toronto, he made the playoffs six straight seasons and got to the 2nd rd twice.