Confirmed with Link: Keith Jones actually set to be named real life part-time President of Hockey Operations, Danny Briere full-time GM

[Ghosts Beer]

I see you're dodging the question. Why is that? Is it because you're not actually serious about this "series wins" evaluation?

What are you struggling to grasp here?

I’m asking why people would clamor to hire a GM who had no more success over the last five years than the GM they constantly mocked & ridiculed.

Why?

 

[Beef Invictus]

What are you struggling to grasp here?

I’m asking why people would clamor to hire a GM who had no more success over the last five years than the GM they constantly mocked & ridiculed.

Why?

Because there's more to evaluating a GM than simply series wins. And you know this, or you'd have no problem selecting Holland over Dubas. But you can't do that because you realize Holland sucks.

 

[GapToothedWonder]

They’re (Toronto) not in much better shape than the Flyers.

Early candidate for post of the year.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Because there's more to evaluating a GM than simply series wins. And you know this, or you'd have no problem selecting Holland over Dubas. But you can't do that because you realize Holland sucks.

I’m not creating a standardized GM rating formula.

I’m asking a philosophical question:

Why would one clamor to hire a GM who had no more success than the guy you just spent years mercilessly ridiculing? Why?

Why?

This Holland-Dubas nonsense is a silly non-sequitir effort to obfuscate my simple philosophical question. It’s utterly irrelevant.

 

[Chicken N Raffls]

I’m not creating a standardized GM rating formula.

I’m asking a philosophical question:

Why would one clamor to hire a GM who had no more success than the guy you just spent years mercilessly ridiculing? Why?

Why?

This Holland-Dubas nonsense is a silly non-sequitir effort to obfuscate my simple philosophical question. It’s utterly irrelevant.

Are you sure? Seems like you did exactly that. This from Mr Objective who talks about not seeing things in black and white. Series wins = success. I don't even know squat about either of those guys, and I know this is nonsense.

 

[Tripod]

Reminder....GB still thought this year Fletch was a good GM with those playoff losses.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Are you sure? Seems like you did exactly that. This from Mr Objective who talks about not seeing things in black and white. Series wins = success. I don't even know squat about either of those guys, and I know this is nonsense.

So would you say Kyle Dubas was successful in Toronto?

 

[Beef Invictus]

I’m not creating a standardized GM rating formula.

I’m asking a philosophical question:

Why would one clamor to hire a GM who had no more success than the guy you just spent years mercilessly ridiculing? Why?

Why?

This Holland-Dubas nonsense is a silly non-sequitir effort to obfuscate my simple philosophical question. It’s utterly irrelevant.

Because there's more to measuring success than just series wins. And you know this.

He's had massively more success than Fletcher. Fletcher left a smoking crater. Dubas has not.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Because there's more to measuring success than just series wins. And you know this.

He's had massively more success than Fletcher. Fletcher left a smoking crater. Dubas has not.

I’m not saying there isn’t. And every situation is different.

That said, Dubas’ situation was to win in the playoffs.

And you’d think, if he were so good, he could manage more playoff wins than a guy everyone said was so bad, right?

 

[Beef Invictus]

This is clearly a bad-faith argument devoid of all required context.

 

[FLYguy3911]

Early candidate for post of the year.

People were saying this after the 2020 season. Wasn't a good prediction then either. Reminds me of people convincing themselves the Flyers passed Pittsburgh all of those years. Whoops.

 

[Chicken N Raffls]

So would you say Kyle Dubas was successful in Toronto?

Certainly more than Chuck. Unless we're going by PO series wins again? One thing about Toronto's embarrassing PO record recently is....they were in the Playoffs. Can't be a 2nd round pretender if you don't get to the 1st round

 

[bobbythebrain]

Every team in every league in every sport worth a damn uses data in bulk.

Except this isn't the be all end all like it's made to be on these forums. Aside from analytics, the "experts" on these boards ignore ALOT of other tangibles that contribute, even when the right decision

The amount of times "analytics" have been misrepresented here to make an argument is mind boggling, and comical, and a metric ton of contradictions too if you have a good memory

 

[Beef Invictus]

Weird how often the people using analytics (pretty much always in conjunction with other context) end up being right more often that the Flyers and their defenders.

 

[FLYguy3911]

What's David Desharnais up to?

 

[ponder719]

What's David Desharnais up to?

About 5'9".

 

[Beef Invictus]

I like how we always hear about how Gourde is a 4th line center and he was somehow the key to the Lightning. So therefore it is good that the Flyers obsess over grinders.

Meanwhile that 4C would have been our 1C last year. That's how disastrously grim things are.

 

[Rebels57]

The really hired Keith Jones as the President of Hockey Ops

 

[renberg]

Early candidate for post of the year.

I'm not saying that the Flyers are in great shape but the Leafs are having serious issues that will have a negative impact on them going forward. Notice the qualifier in my post-not in much better. Their FO is in terrible shape with guys jumping the ship there. Coach is probably going to be fired. Their overall defense isn't much better than that of the Flyers. Goaltending goes to the Flyers. Cap issues go to them. Let's just see who they have to deal off to adjust their core and what thee coat and return are. If Matthews walks after the upcoming season, they're in the same boat as the Flyers will be at that time.

 

[Columbus Hockey Dad]

I'm not saying that the Flyers are in great shape but the Leafs are having serious issues that will have a negative impact on them going forward. Notice the qualifier in my post-not in much better. Their FO is in terrible shape with guys jumping the ship there. Coach is probably going to be fired. Their overall defense isn't much better than that of the Flyers. Goaltending goes to the Flyers. Cap issues go to them. Let's just see who they have to deal off to adjust their core and what thee coat and return are. If Matthews walks after the upcoming season, they're in the same boat as the Flyers will be at that time.

The Leafs really are in trouble. They can't trade Matthews because he's their franchise, but they very well could watch him walk next year. They can't trade Tavares because no one wants that contract, not even for two years. They won't trade Marner, but they WILL trade Nylander who is the one guy signed to a good deal. Their defense is suspect, their goaltending is as well, and they are stuck with Matt Murray's contract for another year. The things they need to do to stay relevant are the things they will never do. They could be in a lot of trouble.

 

[kudymen]

The Guy with Glasses put Toronto in a position where they couldnt claim every year that they are the 5th most imporved team too. Big mistake

 

[Columbus Hockey Dad]

Arizona could be another interesting team to talk to. They need to both hit the cap floor and convince Clayton Keller that they're going to compete. Could they move their Ottawa first and/or some of their prospects for a Provorov/Konecny and the corpse of Ryan Ellis?

 

[Curufinwe]

I'm not saying that the Flyers are in great shape but the Leafs are having serious issues that will have a negative impact on them going forward. Notice the qualifier in my post-not in much better. Their FO is in terrible shape with guys jumping the ship there. Coach is probably going to be fired. Their overall defense isn't much better than that of the Flyers. Goaltending goes to the Flyers. Cap issues go to them. Let's just see who they have to deal off to adjust their core and what thee coat and return are. If Matthews walks after the upcoming season, they're in the same boat as the Flyers will be at that time.

Since the bubble playoffs, the Flyers are ranked 26th and the Leafs are ranked 4th. They're not similar at all.

NHL Stats

The official source for NHL Stats including skaters, goalies, teams stats and more.

www.nhl.com

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

The really hired Keith Jones as the President of Hockey Ops

Wait they did?

 

[Tripod]

Since the bubble playoffs, the Flyers are ranked 26th and the Leafs are ranked 4th. They're not similar at all.

NHL Stats

The official source for NHL Stats including skaters, goalies, teams stats and more.

www.nhl.com

The amount of delusion going on is astounding.