Speculation: Keeping Ck

[SA16]

Im really hoping this next CBA has some sort of variation on the Larry Bird rule. I think it would be a great idea if you got a reduced hit on guys you brought into the league and have stayed with your team. I ha e been saying it for years and finally heard someone say it on one of the sports talk shows the other day. If they did this we would be in good shape. You could keep guys like Kreider and it would create some loyalty to your players even if it were for selfish reasons.

Would make escrow an even bigger issue than it is now though. Teams would go further above the midpoint above the cap due to the exceptions.

 

[Clark Kellogg]

I am the side of the camp that agrees that we should keep Kreider till a least the trade deadline.
Sometimes these Power Forwards don’t hit their stride till their late 20s.
Mike Knuble comes to mind as one.

 

[SML2]

Kreider may be the most frustrating player I've ever seen. He goes hard to the net some games and other games you would never know he's even playing. It's almost like he could be a point per game player, but he's ok with just being average. No way I'm giving a guy like that 7X7

Don't you remember Kovalev? All the talent in the world. Not so much on results.

 

[Good Intentions]

Don't you remember Kovalev? All the talent in the world. Not so much on results.

19 year career, 430 NHL regular season goals. Not so much on results? I don’t think you mean that...strongly suggest you take a closer look at his 19 year career...now was he a frustrating talent during various career stints? Sure, but his production puts him into a 0.1% for career output.

His 94 locker room trolls live on.

 

[SML2]

19 year career, 430 NHL regular season goals. Not so much on results? I don’t think you mean that...strongly suggest you take a closer look at his 19 year career...now was he a frustrating talent during various career stints? Sure, but his production puts him into a 0.1% for career output.

His 94 locker room trolls live on.

Don't give me career stats, man. I'm talking about his Ranger stint. That guy was top 5 talent, and never gave top 5 numbers. He put up some good stats overall but please don't act like he hit the mark he could have.

 

[FoxyClean]

I'd give Kreider a 2M raise (6.7M) for 5-6 years. Anything more and it's going to have to be a no. Don't get me wrong, the day Chris Kreider is no longer a Ranger, I will shed tears. He was the first Rangers prospect I fell in love with and as all the other great Rangers from this decade that left here empty-handed, he won't deserve his fate. But I'll wish him the best of luck.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

I am the side of the camp that agrees that we should keep Kreider till a least the trade deadline.
Sometimes these Power Forwards don’t hit their stride till their late 20s.
Mike Knuble comes to mind as one.

What happens if he gets hurt before then?

 

[Ghost of jas]

At this point, until stealthy Jeff Gorton strikes, I think we're going to be looking at Kreider being on the opening night roster.

 

[BobMarleyNYR]

Smith is tradeable if you go 1 step back to advance 2 steps and rid the contract's 2nd yr
Smith at half to Vegas for Holden + Merill, both expiring. Vegas gets almost 1.5 instant relief.

Buch should be considered depending on if we can sell high.

Also, outside chance Shatty does us a huge favor later and retires, taking a coach/consultant job.



Namest either take like a 6th just to recover the cap or eat and take a 3rd or a 4th
I don't care, just move him.

The unspoken X factor here is if we trade
Skjei to Habs
Deangelo to Flyers or best offer.

That would facilitate a lot of things.

Much bigger problems on D and probably THE WORST time in his career to trade DeAngelo.

 

[True Blue]

Smith at half to Vegas for Holden + Merill, both expiring. Vegas gets almost 1.5 instant relief.

Why would Vegas take on a contract that will weight them down for an additional year?

Also, outside chance Shatty does us a huge favor later and retires, taking a coach/consultant job.

Where did something like this even come from? There is absolutely ZERO chance that Shattekirk retires. Come on, Bern. Really?

 

[True Blue]

At this point, until stealthy Jeff Gorton strikes, I think we're going to be looking at Kreider being on the opening night roster.

Which means good chance that his contract is redone and it is Buch that gets moved. Which I am fine with.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

I'd give Kreider a 2M raise (6.7M) for 5-6 years. Anything more and it's going to have to be a no. Don't get me wrong, the day Chris Kreider is no longer a Ranger, I will shed tears. He was the first Rangers prospect I fell in love with and as all the other great Rangers from this decade that left here empty-handed, he won't deserve his fate. But I'll wish him the best of luck.

Interesting. May I suggest adopting a more "hard to get" mentality?

 

[sbjnyc]

Don't give me career stats, man. I'm talking about his Ranger stint.

His name is on the cup. In 44 playoff games for the rangers he had 39 points. He produced when it mattered.

 

[bernmeister]

Much bigger problems on D and probably THE WORST time in his career to trade DeAngelo.

I don't agree there are bigger probs on D.
Hajek looked ready and got injured.
No reason to think he is not ready now.

Lindgren, they didn't want to burn a full yr elc.
We are stuck w/Staal for 3rd pair

Assuming we deal Skjei and Deangelo
that leaves
Trouba - Fox - Shatty for RD
any 2 of Hajek/Lindgren/Rykov/Claesson for top 2 pair, Staal 3rd pair.

the D is a work in progress
If we were not resolving cap/getting futures that would be one thing

make the development moves

Now is the best time to sell Deangelo IF the price is high enuf.
Dont' have to overcharge, just get good value.
RDs highly in demand. take advantage.

 

[bernmeister]

...

Why would Vegas take on a contract that will weight them down for an additional year?

because of the net benefit.

they save almost 1.5 immediately
they are getting him at half
yes he is their obligation next year, but
that is only for 2.175
and they have the whole year to backpedal on their options

then on top of that, if they want to dump him he can be retained 1 more time, he doesn't have to be bought out
so they can pay a 5th or whatever to a bottom dweller who takes on the expiring 1.9 whatever

If they were not really crushed immediately this min, maybe Holden + Merril makes more sense, although Smith actually arguably has more life than either of those 2, and would bust his butt on his brother's team.

But with cap reality, this is an instant fix, partially.

Where did something like this even come from? There is absolutely ZERO chance that Shattekirk retires. Come on, Bern. Really?

I admit it's a very outside chance.
Pro athletes want to go right up to when they have to hang em up.
And I don't think he retires now, whether we need him to or not.
But I think he might do us a solid and do it at some point next year.
He doesn't have that much left on his deal.

The real ? is what does he have left in the tank?
If he's fully back into top peak form, he will take another final contract elsewhere.
But if he is not much better than now, a nice MSG gig or a coaching/consultant job makes sense for him.

 

[SRTtoZ]

I like Kreider but he never took that step to become the player we thought he could be. If I'm the Rangers I let him go unless he gives us some sort of home town discount.

 

[Unusual Suspect]

Hadn't thought about it til this moment, but this COULD be a good time to move DeAngelo. His game picked up considerably last year and rumblings about issues in the room or with the coach were pretty minimal. He might play more minutes than Fox for some of the coming year, but probably not by year's end if Fox is at all ready and as advertised. We might be able to get a lot more for him now than after another year on the 3rd pairing with reduced PP time...

 

[Hi ImHFNYR]

To be honest, I am surprised Kreider isn't gone already. I assume he gets traded at some point before the deadline. The Rangers simply cannot be investing almost $20M annually in Panarin and Kreider. His net front presence will be missed, but someone else will fill that roll for far less money.

Having him around to eat a top line spot is crucial this year imo. At the very least, it's reasonable to think he can be very important for this team. His work ethic, leadership and production far exceed what he's been paid for the last season or two. Unless we can get a top 15 pick or a REAL good prospect than it's not worth trading him imo. Maybe he's reasonable and willing to take a 5.5-6 M deal for 5 or 6 seasons. If so then I bring him back for sure.

If he, rightfully so, wants to get paid then don't re-sign him. Either way, it can still make perfect sense to keep him this coming season.

 

[True Blue]

they save almost 1.5 immediately
they are getting him at half
yes he is their obligation next year, but
that is only for 2.175
and they have the whole year to backpedal on their options

So you believe that teams are simply ignorant and will all go in favor of short term pleasure for long term pain? Sorry, Bern. GMs see what is coming in the following years. No one wants to obligate them selves to Smith for over $2m in two years.

The real ? is what does he have left in the tank?
If he's fully back into top peak form, he will take another final contract elsewhere.
But if he is not much better than now, a nice MSG gig or a coaching/consultant job makes sense for him.

It must be a really happy place that you live in. The Rangers are paying him $6+m for this year and next year. After that, he WILL get another contract, whatever those terms might be. There is absolutely NO CHANCE that is is a coach next year. Of all of your proposals, this one may actually take the cake.

 

[BobMarleyNYR]

I don't agree there are bigger probs on D.
Hajek looked ready and got injured.
No reason to think he is not ready now.

Lindgren, they didn't want to burn a full yr elc.
We are stuck w/Staal for 3rd pair

Assuming we deal Skjei and Deangelo
that leaves
Trouba - Fox - Shatty for RD
any 2 of Hajek/Lindgren/Rykov/Claesson for top 2 pair, Staal 3rd pair.

the D is a work in progress
If we were not resolving cap/getting futures that would be one thing

make the development moves

Now is the best time to sell Deangelo IF the price is high enuf.
Dont' have to overcharge, just get good value.
RDs highly in demand. take advantage.

So you think Smith and Staal are not problems and DeAngelo and Skjei are? Shattenkirk, again, is hot garbage.

 

[Clark Kellogg]

What happens if he gets hurt before then?

Chis Krieder is a Tank.
He doesn’t get hurt. He does the Hurting.

 

[Ghost of jas]

I like Kreider but he never took that step to become the player we thought he could be. If I'm the Rangers I let him go unless he gives us some sort of home town discount.

You don't let him go. He's too valuable an asset.

 

[Machinehead]

You don't let him go. He's too valuable an asset.

Kreider is a player I suck it up and give the contract to rather than accept a "just to avoid the contract" return.

It would have to be a good trade for us.

 

[bernmeister]

Hadn't thought about it til this moment, but this COULD be a good time to move DeAngelo. His game picked up considerably last year and rumblings about issues in the room or with the coach were pretty minimal. He might play more minutes than Fox for some of the coming year, but probably not by year's end if Fox is at all ready and as advertised. We might be able to get a lot more for him now than after another year on the 3rd pairing with reduced PP time...

exactly
there are no sacred cows, including Deangelo

 

[bernmeister]

So you believe that teams are simply ignorant and will all go in favor of short term pleasure for long term pain? Sorry, Bern. GMs see what is coming in the following years. No one wants to obligate them selves to Smith for over $2m in two years.

It must be a really happy place that you live in. The Rangers are paying him $6+m for this year and next year. After that, he WILL get another contract, whatever those terms might be. There is absolutely NO CHANCE that is is a coach next year. Of all of your proposals, this one may actually take the cake.

Bold:
Holden 2.2 + Merrill 1.375 = total of 3.575, but all of it now, and uses 2 slots. And as bad as BS is, they are comparatively worse.
I think it's reasonable to believe a team with 0 per CF in cap space would strongly consider the 3.5 ish - 2.1 ish = 1.4 immediate cap savings if, worse case scenario, they were only going to pay, in addition to that balance of 1.4, another .7m next season.

And again, if they want to ditch a late pick, they can eat half of Smith at 2.175 so the hit can be reduced, reasonably assumed, to just over 1.

underline
You are probably right about Shattenkirk.
I think he insists on seeing how far he has recovered from injury, which does not help this season.
But if his production is worst case scenario, I think the same guy who famously wanted to come here and took less to do so MIGHT consider it.

Athletes have pride. usually.
If he can earn, he will want to,
If he is too far gone, I think he considers it if upper mgmt reaches out.