Speculation: Kaliyev trade...

[GoldenBearHockey]

He's a lefty
View attachment 879633

No idea why I thought he was a righty....

 

[AbsentMojo]

No idea why I thought he was a righty....

I was surprised to find out they were both lefties on the top pairing

 

[BaileyFan]

I agree with item 1 completely- even long time canadien fans were saying that the apperantly non sensical moves that were and are being made have bergevins fingerprints all over them. Just look at the results of his tenure in montreal and unfortunately we're headed for the same.
As far as item2 the aquisition of turcotte my thought was that the boys were just doing a favor for his dad alfy- i dont know the connection but by history these guys are like humane relations hiring dept for unemployed and unemployable (recent asst coach) boys from theold network.
I have alot of respct for jon rosen- compared to what we have now rosen was the dan jenkins of kings hockey writers.

Bergevin’s role as the boogeyman who ruined an “up-and-coming” Kings team is way overstated simply because he’s one of the few LA guys that East Coast fans are familiar with and because people legit hate the guy for the Mailloux pick.

We’ve never seen any indication that he has any actual decision making power in the front office. He’s never done an interview, doesn’t appear in any of the behind the scenes puff pieces they do and has generally been a ghost since he was hired. To me, it seems like a classic case of Luc hiring his old frat bro to keep him gainfully employed by an NHL club and all he has to do is watch a couple hockey games and drink with the boys. It’s nepotism, but he’s not the man behind the curtain steering the club into the black hole.

 

[King'sPawn]

I am still not convinced that Zegras would have been a better pick than Turcotte. He isn't necessarily the kind of player you want in your organization regardless of ability. Dude has a LOT of growing up to do and isn't in a hurry to do so.

I agree. I wish I could remember my exact list, but I remember thinking Zegras was closer to Robbie Schremp than an NHLer. I know, I underestimated him, but agree that he has a lot of maturing to do.

I do still honestly think Turcotte's biggest issue is health. While not *as* skilled, his skillset isn't holding him back.

Though now I wish the Kings had taken Boldy or Seider, especially with how high I ranked them. I would have felt smart

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

I agree. I wish I could remember my exact list, but I remember thinking Zegras was closer to Robbie Schremp than an NHLer. I know, I underestimated him, but agree that he has a lot of maturing to do.

I do still honestly think Turcotte's biggest issue is health. While not *as* skilled, his skillset isn't holding him back.

Though now I wish the Kings had taken Boldy or Seider, especially with how high I ranked them. I would have felt smart

I remember everyone freaking out when Detroit went "off the board" with Seider

 

[FrozenKing18]

I agree. I wish I could remember my exact list, but I remember thinking Zegras was closer to Robbie Schremp than an NHLer. I know, I underestimated him, but agree that he has a lot of maturing to do.

I do still honestly think Turcotte's biggest issue is health. While not *as* skilled, his skillset isn't holding him back.

Though now I wish the Kings had taken Boldy or Seider, especially with how high I ranked them. I would have felt smart

How high up was Cozens up your list? I’m a fan of his overall game. I always trade for him in Franchise mode lol so I have a 1-2 punch of Byfield-Cozens.

 

[King'sPawn]

How high up was Cozens up your list? I’m a fan of his overall game. I always trade for him in Franchise mode lol so I have a 1-2 punch of Byfield-Cozens.

I don't remember where exactly, but I wasn't nearly as high on him as others were. It was probably between 9-12ish.

I remember being pretty high on Podkolzin, Krebs, Heinola, Beecher, Kaliyev, and Bjornfot as well (this was all

So... yeah. Sometimes I look back and feel smart about how I read them. Other times I feel silly. But I try to be honest with myself either way and try to learn from it. It's a process for sure.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

He's a lefty
View attachment 879633

what the f*** is this, youtube 2003?

 

[Surf Nutz]

You left off Willy D, the single worst coach in NHL history. The hire alone should've got Blake canned.

Huh, that was a genius its too late, lets fail for draft position move in my book.

 

[AbsentMojo]

what the f*** is this, youtube 2003?

Nah just a zoomed in screen cap - quick and dirty

 

[SettlementRichie10]

I was super high on Byram, Podkolzin, and Kaliyev that draft.

I was shocked when Kaliyev dropped out of the first round and argued with a lot of people about risking the Bjornfot pick over him.

 

[chris kontos]

Bergevin’s role as the boogeyman who ruined an “up-and-coming” Kings team is way overstated simply because he’s one of the few LA guys that East Coast fans are familiar with and because people legit hate the guy for the Mailloux pick.

We’ve never seen any indication that he has any actual decision making power in the front office. He’s never done an interview, doesn’t appear in any of the behind the scenes puff pieces they do and has generally been a ghost since he was hired. To me, it seems like a classic case of Luc hiring his old frat bro to keep him gainfully employed by an NHL club and all he has to do is watch a couple hockey games and drink with the boys. It’s nepotism, but he’s not the man behind the curtain steering the club into the black hole.

So you write authoritatively that bergevin has nothing to do with this mess because he did not call a press conference and issue a media release that its his responsibility for this mess. Who is responsible? Or is it a team effort of dunces? Everywhere ive been part of or led a group of people working towards a common goal responsibility must be fixed on an individual for its success or failure. Otherwize chaos.
the fact is becoming readily appearent that success means something completely divfferent to the kings front office than it does to most of us.

 

[kingsfan28]

Huh, that was a genius its too late, lets fail for draft position move in my book.

Rob isn't that smart. And of course it backfires, dropping to fifth and striking out on all 3 picks.

 

[Herby]

Huh, that was a genius its too late, lets fail for draft position move in my book.

So 3 months and 13 games after signing Ilya Kovalchuk to a 3 year $19m deal to bolster a playoff roster, the Kings were in full tank mode?

 

[Schrute farms]

Huh, that was a genius its too late, lets fail for draft position move in my book.

Rooting against your team and hoping they lose?!? You are NOT a true fan.
(lol, you literally tell people now that same exact thing WRT the FO boozos smh).

 

[SettlementRichie10]

So 3 months and 13 games after signing Ilya Kovalchuk to a 3 year $19m deal to bolster a playoff roster, the Kings were in full tank mode?

This is one of the more absurd arguments from the revisionists around here.

Blake took control and publicly stated the team was a contender. He then made several moves (like Kovalchuk) consistent with a team attempting to contend.

Now some claim there was never any intention to contend, and what we see with our eyes and hear with our ears is false.

Ministry of Truth in full swing.

 

[All The Kings Men]

So 3 months and 13 games after signing Ilya Kovalchuk to a 3 year $19m deal to bolster a playoff roster, the Kings were in full tank mode?

I can't say definitively if they were or weren't but there's a totally credible narrative that accounts for a full timeline of events that supports the theory and it's not "Pravda" to consider it legitimate.

 

[bland]

I can't say definitively if they were or weren't but there's a totally credible narrative that accounts for a full timeline of events that supports the theory and it's not "Pravda" to consider it legitimate.

Does this include the Pacioretty deal?

This is one of the more absurd arguments from the revisionists around here.

Blake took control and publicly stated the team was a contender. He then made several moves (like Kovalchuk) consistent with a team attempting to contend.

Now some claim there was never any intention to contend, and what we see with our eyes and hear with our ears is false.

Ministry of Truth in full swing.

Hey, don't forget he moved Gaborik, who was looking down a back surgery that would have given the team LTIR cap space, for a fully cooked player with a worse contract in Phaneuf, despite already having 4 LHD on the roster before buying him out.

 

[All The Kings Men]

Does this include the Pacioretty deal?

IF Pacioretty was ever actually going to sign that deal THEN we could worry about that trade but since he was never going to I don't know why everybody keeps pearl clutching about it.


But generally speaking no it doesn't... that's a good wrinkle

 

[Herby]

Rooting against your team and hoping they lose?!? You are NOT a true fan.
(lol, you literally tell people now that same exact thing WRT the FO boozos smh).

This is one of the more absurd arguments from the revisionists around here.

Blake took control and publicly stated the team was a contender. He then made several moves (like Kovalchuk) consistent with a team attempting to contend.

Now some claim there was never any intention to contend, and what we see with our eyes and hear with our ears is false.

Ministry of Truth in full swing.

It's just one excuse after the other

Stevens hire was not his fault because "he was obligated to hire him" . Reality: There was no contractual obligation, promises made by former management groups do not carry over. It was a poor hire, the previous regime had turned rotten and a page should have been turned.

The whole Turcotte debacle was "Tony Granato's fault" Reality: Tony Granato had no problem developing players, that team alone had two players who are key contributors on their teams in Caufield and Miller and another one in Holloway who is playing regularly for a team in the finals, you can throw Trent Frederic in their too. It just ended up being a terrible decision by Blake, one that was apparent right away to anyone who followed college hockey closely, and was compounded by an inexcusable decision to put him in the AHL as a teenager.

"Faber wasn't going to sign in LA" - Reality: One that is constantly used on this forum without any basis in reality. Faber never indicated he wasn't signing in LA, just that he wanted to play in college and then jump to the NHL. Of course for the Kings that is blasphemous. The Kings could very easily have signed Faber following his junior year, immediately put him in the NHL and we'd have the best 1-2 punch of young RHD's in the league, who perfectly compliment each other as a defensive stopper and an offensive guy.

"Marco Sturm is the reason the young players struggle" - Reality: Marco Sturm's job is to win games, if he loses games he gets fired. If Kings players aren't producing to expectations in the AHL, while similarly aged players are dominating that league or in many cases playing very well in the NHL that is on management and the players themselves, not on some AHL coach.

"Marc Bergevin is to blame for everything" - This is the new flavor of the month, the reality is he was the GM of the Habs when most of these terrible moves were made, including BY FAR the worst one, ending the rebuild in 2021. Nobody in their right mind is going to sit idly by as their name and reputation is completely ruined by terrible hockey moves by some advisor being made in your name.

"They had already punted the season when they hired Willy D" - Reality: As you mentioned, it was 13 games into the season and months after they ADDED one of the highest paid UFA's to a team that been a playoff team the year before. No team is punting a season after 13 games when they were all-in over the summer.

 

[BigKing]

@All The Kings Men
Bluc said they were a contender when they took over. They made the playoffs, got swept while Quick was excellent but the team couldn't score. "All we need is some more scoring". Enter Kovalchuk after failing to land Patches with a 1st round pick when trading 1st round picks was a major reason for moving off of DL.

Big expectations for 2019. Complete collapse after the dead cat bounce caused by the guys being happy to come to the rink and be out from under Sutter.

Bluc trades Muzzin and says in the press that they always knew that they were going to have to rebuild but this is now happening a year early, even though they just signed Kovy to a 35+ contract for three years.

So, at best, they thought they needed to rebuild in either 2019-20 or 20-21, based on how you interpret the "one year early" thing when it is said in January/February of 2019.

They admitted it themselves that they didn't expect to be rebuilding that soon. Kovy deal was made because they thought they could make a Cup run because, you know, all they needed was a couple more goals against Vegas, a team that made the SCF...I mean, THEY WERE RIGHT THERE!

 

[Herby]

I can't say definitively if they were or weren't but there's a totally credible narrative that accounts for a full timeline of events that supports the theory and it's not "Pravda" to consider it legitimate.

What team is punting a season 13 games into it after committing big money to a 34 year old free-agent mere months before?

And if you are right, and they were, what does that say about the competence of this GM? It's just another laughably bad decision in this nightmare under Robitaille/Blake

The PLD trade
The Faber trade
The Kovalchuk signing
Going against his scouts on the Turcotte pick
3 awful coaching hires, probably soon to be 4.
The Gavrikov/Quick trade
Cal P signing
Multiple coaches and players being paid to not coach/play
No playoff series wins
No division finish higher than 3rd.
Up against the cap
Multiple 1st round picks traded w/ no results to show for it

At what point is enough enough? This has to be one of the worst resumes I've ever seen for an NHL GM. And the ones who are worse lasted a fraction of the time on the job.

This is mid 90's bad.

 

[bland]

IF Pacioretty was ever actually going to sign that deal THEN we could worry about that trade but since he was never going to I don't know why everybody keeps pearl clutching about it.


But generally speaking no it doesn't... that's a good wrinkle

Well, we are discussing intentions here so it's an important note that the agent (guess who) was trying to bring Kovalchuk and Pacioretty in as a package deal and the timing was urgent to have the cap space ready as soon as free agency started.

Whether they couldn't get it done is a different aspect of the conversation, but the goal was to bring in instant offense at the cost of the futures involved in the Montreal deal.

 

[All The Kings Men]

Well, we are discussing intentions here so it's an important note that the agent (guess who) was trying to bring Kovalchuk and Pacioretty in as a package deal and the timing was urgent to have the cap space ready as soon as free agency started.

Whether they couldn't get it done is a different aspect of the conversation, but the goal was to bring in instant offense at the cost of the futures involved in the Montreal deal.

I get it and you're not going to get a ton of push back from me on it

BUT

it was all contingent on someone agreeing to something that they didn't agree to

you can have all the intention you want but if you don't have willing partners then your intentions frequently change

 

[Schmooley]

I get it and you're not going to get a ton of push back from me on it

BUT

it was all contingent on someone agreeing to something that they didn't agree to

you can have all the intention you want but if you don't have willing partners then your intentions frequently change

Their intentions didnt change. They wanted a goal scorer, failed to get Pachioretty and pivoted to plan b in Kovulchuk.
Have you heard if they are intent on trading Kaliyev or are open to letting him have another shot? A late round pick would do them no good.
If they can swap him for someone in a similar age range of Byfield and Clarke it would be nice. There were rumors of Turcotte and Kaliyev for Kakko and a pick around the deadline.