Player Discussion Kaapo Kakko

[80shockeywasbuns]

He probably wouldn't produce next to McDavid and Draisaitl with the way he played the last number of games before his injury. He started the season decently, actually creating chances but Mika/Kreider couldn't convert on those. He also had some bad luck himself. But the more the season progressed, the worse Kakko became in the offensive zone. Just not trying to get to the goal, not being in the right areas... Eventually even losing puck battles which he has been so good with for almost his entire career here (apart from his rookie year). It has to be mental.

I'm not going to give up on the kid (probably ever, lol), but he has himself to blame for his awful start. And yes, Mika being so off didn't help things, but can't be solely blamed either.

Again, Nick Bonino.

 

[LOFIN]

Again, Nick Bonino.

Nick Bonino might explain Kakko not getting an assist for a tap in goal, or not finding teammates to pass to. It doesn't explain Kakko going to corners instead of the net, losing puck battles, fumbling pucks, fanning on shots etc. Those or himself, and it has gotten progressively worse during the course of the season. In a way, the injury might be a blessing in disguise as a mental reset.

 

[bhamill]

Kakko's issues are (aside from the injury) confidence issues. Not shocking for a still 22 year old player in the best league on the planet. Even "hockey" trades where it's not just a cockamamie "lets dump him while we can" proposal, would be selling low on him. We've already seen what he CAN do at 5v5, and he's still got a lot of runway. But trading him while he's injured/in a slump you aren't going to get that value for him. It's still selling low and selling low is bad business.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Kakko's issues are (aside from the injury) confidence issues. Not shocking for a still 22 year old player in the best league on the planet. Even "hockey" trades where it's not just a cockamamie "lets dump him while we can" proposal, would be selling low on him. We've already seen what he CAN do at 5v5, and he's still got a lot of runway. But trading him while he's injured/in a slump you aren't going to get that value for him. It's still selling low and selling low is bad business.

Nonsense. Kakko's issues are far more than just confidence.

He's just not very good - at least in comparison to what we thought we were getting. He doesn't stand out anywhere other than puck possession.

He's a better version of Marcel Hossa. Wake me when his play changes and the promise he showed as a 17 year old comes to light. He's a valuable player as a bottom-sixer. But let's stop pretending he's going to be even a 2nd line forward at this point.

 

[will1066]

Phone battery at 24%. We miss you, Kakko!

 

[bhamill]

Nonsense. Kakko's issues are far more than just confidence.

He's just not very good - at least in comparison to what we thought we were getting. He doesn't stand out anywhere other than puck possession.

He's a better version of Marcel Hossa. Wake me when his play changes and the promise he showed as a 17 year old comes to light. He's a valuable player as a bottom-sixer. But let's stop pretending he's going to be even a 2nd line forward at this point.

I call nonsense on you calling nonsense on me! He's actually a very good hockey player.... just not for a 2OA, that's true. But he's still just 22. He scored 40 pts at 5v5 last year while being a possession monster and defensive stalwart... of course he could be a 2nd liner or even 1st when he is done developing and gets his confidence back.
I heard this same line of reasoning about Laf in preseason, "his next contract should be a PTO," "He's just not any good," "he has no skills that stand out".... while at the same time people were talking about how Kakko looked ready to take the next step. Just weeks ago...
It was confidence for Laf, and its a confidence thing for Kakko now. (Unless his health has taken a hit, he does have chronic issues.)

 

[80shockeywasbuns]

I just don’t understand how people are basically insinuating that Kakko is a liability in the top 6. The Kreider-Mika-Kakko line this season had a 58% xGF with 1st line matchups. Obviously the offensive generation/production was nonexistent and not close to good enough from them, but it wasn’t shit tier hockey they were playing. Its not that I think Kakko can’t ever be replaced there, but when you’re waiting for a high upside player to find their offensive game you can do a lot worse than 58% xG share in the meantime. And we know it’s not a fluke given Kakkos excellent defensive 5v5 impacts.

If anyone deserves a shot at RW for Kreider-Mika right now it’s Vesey. As far as the numbers go, he’s been the best wing with those two since Buch.

 

[Daves a mess]

I look at it as your phone is telling you that you and the Rangers got 24% of the player that they thought they were drafting.

 

[80shockeywasbuns]

“At least Kakko is noticeable, what does Laf even do” - every person on here 2 months ago who would’ve traded Laf for Marcus Foligno

 

[Clark Kellogg]

I just don’t understand how people are basically insinuating that Kakko is a liability in the top 6. The Kreider-Mika-Kakko line this season had a 58% xGF with 1st line matchups. Obviously the offensive generation/production was nonexistent and not close to good enough from them, but it wasn’t shit tier hockey they were playing. Its not that I think Kakko can’t ever be replaced there, but when you’re waiting for a high upside player to find their offensive game you can do a lot worse than 58% xG share in the meantime. And we know it’s not a fluke given Kakkos excellent defensive 5v5 impacts.

If anyone deserves a shot at RW for Kreider-Mika right now it’s Vesey. As far as the numbers go, he’s been the best wing with those two since Buch.

It doesn’t seem to matter who plays on the right side of Zibanejad if Kreider going to be on his left. Mika won’t look right. If Zibanejad and Kreider are to be kept together they would benefit from a RW who is a banger and can play down low (Think of a healthy Sammy Blais type).

In the future, Brett Berard might be that player. Maybe even Matt Rempe? But I believe neither is NHL ready.

If I were to guess, they could give Blidh or Belzile a shot. Both play with snarl.

Kaapo needs to be the mailman, but mentally he is not there. He needs to be selfish and I’m not sure it’s in his nature.

 

[nyr2k2]

I feel like there's this assumption by some that because Lafreniere was being written off and turned it around, that it's definitely going to happen with Kakko. I mean, it might? But it also might not. It's totally possible--and maybe even likely--that the guy is what he is at this point. I mean we can all hope he makes a big jump, but I'd say what we saw from him last season is probably his realistic "normal" season.

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

I feel like there's this assumption by some that because Lafreniere was being written off and turned it around, that it's definitely going to happen with Kakko. I mean, it might? But it also might not. It's totally possible--and maybe even likely--that the guy is what he is at this point. I mean we can all hope he makes a big jump, but I'd say what we saw from him last season is probably his realistic "normal" season.

He's been so hot and cold with his confidence, and its a direct result of his production or lack thereof.

He took a step last season and looked like an NHL version of himself we could all be happy with, to your point.

Puck possession, bull on the walls, Responsible defensively, takeaways. It appeared he was starting to raise his game in camp, doing more of the things we wanted to see from him to take it to the next level: Getting to the net, not defer to his teammates as often, finding open ice to get off better shots and showing some fire and physicality.

It was leading me to believe there could be another level - 55 points was the bar I had set for him, especially since he was set to line up with Mika from the start of it. I still think he could get back to that level of expectation, but he's got to have that stretch of success like Lafreniere is experiencing, somewhere. When you can go out there night after night and consistently be a noticeable force - then you start to believe it.

I feel like with Kakko, point production means a lot to him. I mean hell - it means a lot to any forward, but especially when you are young and used to doing it in the past. So many times he's been robbed of points, getting 3rd assists or just snake bit and without any PP time to help, he just continues to try with nothing to show for it. It wears on him and unfortunately it soured his confidence.

I really think when he comes back if they can send him down, they should and let him (hopefully) tear it up in the A for as long as they are allowed to. Let him get on the scoresheet every night and then foster his confidence when hes back in the NHL by putting him on an offensive line where he can succeed.

 

[Captain Monglobster]

Hes been invisible these last few games. Might be time to cut ties.

 

[mas0764]

Nonsense. Kakko's issues are far more than just confidence.

He's just not very good - at least in comparison to what we thought we were getting. He doesn't stand out anywhere other than puck possession.

This is exactly what people were literally just saying about Lafreniere. “He has no skill” and “name one thing he’s good at” and “he’s doing nothing out there.”

With all due respect, a lack of confidence and a lack of knowledge of what you are supposed to be doing out on the ice will make you look lost and like you have no skill. It’s exactly what Laf looked like for the prior 12 months.

Kakko on the other hand, we know he does some things well, including be a defensive force.

He looked like in the preseason like he was about to break out offensively, people were calling for 30-30.

I posit he looks like he can’t do anything well right now because he’s lost like Laf was last year. Get him his confidence back and he may never be a superstar but 25-25-50 with Selke level defense is very possible IMO.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

This is exactly what people were literally just saying about Lafreniere. “He has no skill” and “name one thing he’s good at” and “he’s doing nothing out there.”

. . .

Kakko on the other hand . . . he may never be a superstar but 25-25-50 with Selke level defense is very possible IMO.

 

[Jauffre]

These last few games have been his best

 

[Rongomania]

These last few games have been his best

The team is definitely getting scored on more. That is for sure.

 

[LionsHeart]

He and Chytils absence have been felt despite the winning. It’s essentially 2 fourth lines right now.

 

[Harbour Dog]

Only Chytil, among forwards, allows fewer shot against per 60, and no other player (forward or D) has a better xGA/60.

It's fair to be disappointed and pessimistic about his boom potential, but we are a significantly better team with him in the lineup. If he doesn't find his offense by the trade deadline, moving him for a rental win now piece would still be a mistake. Kakko is the win now piece, and with more potential than any rental we'd be able to add at the deadline.

 

[will1066]

Our unholy trinity of Laf, Kakko and Chytil is down to one player.

 

[bl02]

He and Chytils absence have been felt despite the winning. It’s essentially 2 fourth lines right now.

Yep who would have thought our 4th line is one of our top lines and Mika's line is a 4th line right now.
And our third line poor Cuylle playing with two 4th liners can't blame him.

 

[mas0764]

He had 40 points last year. It doesn't have to be a huge jump from that. A 50 point player who doesn't get PP time and is great on defense is a first line caliber player.

Again, yeah, he looks lost right this second. That wasn't the case last year. It tells me it's not a "he sucks," or "he's regressed," thing. It's a confidence/know-what-to-do thing, which was literally the case with Laf and the very last administration.

There is work to be done but it's not a pipe dream.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

He had 40 points last year. It doesn't have to be a huge jump from that. A 50 point player who doesn't get PP time and is great on defense is a first line caliber player.

Again, yeah, he looks lost right this second. That wasn't the case last year. It tells me it's not a "he sucks," or "he's regressed," thing. It's a confidence/know-what-to-do thing, which was literally the case with Laf and the very last administration.

There is work to be done but it's not a pipe dream.

40 points last year, on pace for 12 points this year.

But yeah. A 50-point, Selke-caliber forward. Right. I do love that you left the word "Selke" out of this reply, at least.

Also, the only pipe involved here is just filled with Grade-A hopium at this point.

I can't fathom how much we'd be laughing at Devils fans for their hope & cope if Kakko was theirs.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

In all seriousness.

Can we start to be honest with ourselves about Kakko, yet? Like, the ridiculous takes you still see about this kid becoming some elite player (and, yes, a 50-point SELKE-caliber forward is an elite player) are just laughable at this point.

My hope is he can become a fine middle-six forward who can PK a bit. This idea that we should be expecting anything more than a "solid" player at this point is wild.

 

[tlk]

40 points last year, on pace for 12 points this year.

But yeah. A 50-point, Selke-caliber forward. Right.

I can't fathom how much we'd be laughing at Devils fans for their hope & cope if Kakko was theirs.

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Lol but you're harsh. He's been good defensively.