Player Discussion Kaapo Kakko

[Irishguy42]

Goodrow has won two Cups. Panarin has won zero. McDavid.

Ergo, Goodrow is a better and more valuable player than Panarin in the playoffs.

 

[DanielBrassard]

Not looking to argue your opinion, but I’m curious: which player would you rather for a Cup run?

I think it's pretty obvious based on his answer.

 

[chosen]

Well, not exactly. He's played in three seasons, but none of them have been very normal. In his rookie season, the Rangers didn't play their last 12 games. Last year it was shortened to 56 games, and this year, well he's had the injuries.

Not to mention the odder schedules, COVID protocols, no crowds for part of the time....it's been an odd time for sure.

It's also worth considering his age. Arthur Staple had some useful perspective in his Mailbag yesterday, pointing out some recent Europeans who jumped straight to the NHl at a young age.

One of those examples was Aleksander Barkov, who didn't come flying out of the gate in his first two years either (and they were relatively normal), but has really turned into one of the best two way forwards in the game
Hockey Reference
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Could we have hoped for more....sure, but I think the lack of PP time, the learning process coming from Europe and his age...you want to really temper expectations.

He's shown when he plays with confidence (also mentioned in the Mailbag article), he's looked pretty good, and he even did for stretch earlier in the season after his slow start.

As an aside, it might actually help the Rangers that he hasn't stood out to date, given that he's up for a new contract this Summer. Perhaps they can get somewhat cheaper for the next 2-3 years, and he finds his footing....alternatively, he's still young enough that he'd be an asset with value in a trade on an affordable contract.

Right now the Rangers need players at different stages of their careers to fill in around the edges of a core that is being paid at, or close to the highest they'll ever make. I'm firmly for keeping Kakko, Lafreniere is more complicated because of the left wing issue, but I'd be inclined to keep him too until we know how Othmann and Cuylle fit (if at all) in the picture.

I don't think Kakko will bust, but certainly my opinion of him hasn't been enhanced since his arrival.

His first season was an unmitigated disaster. According to some metrics he was actually the worst player in the NHL. That part has turned around. My biggest concern is his lack of foot speed, but he could still become a legit 1st-liner.

If he doesn't shine next season, I'll begin to wonder if it will ever come together.

 

[chosen]

Goodrow has won two Cups. Panarin has won zero. McDavid.

Ergo, Goodrow is a better and more valuable player than Panarin in the playoffs.

Kind of like Osgood was a better goalie than Hasek.

 

[Irishguy42]

Kind of like Osgood was a better goalie than Hasek.

Also like how Del Zotto is better than Cale Makar

 

[CasusBelli]

Also like how Del Zotto is better than Cale Makar

And how Chris Kunitz wipes the floor with Bure.

 

[bhamill]

I think it's pretty obvious based on his answer.

I was genuinely curious. They are very different types of player. You can think one is a far better player in general but think the other is better built for the playoffs. I mean I did figure Fast was probably his pick, but you never know.

 

[Synergy27]

Are there any other diabetic/celiac players in the NHL?

 

[bhamill]

And how Chris Kunitz wipes the floor with Bure.

Of course I get what you guys are saying but then there are examples like Claude Lemieux vs Mike Gartner. Gartner was an ostensibly better NHLer, their numbers aren’t close, but you’d probably want Lemieux in the playoffs.
Fast and Goodrow have almost mirror scoring stats with Fast mostly playing farther up the lineup on his team. But they are vastly different types of player. And not in the superstar vs average NHLer sense, they are really both support players. And the Cup winning experience for Goodrow is not negligible. Inexperienced teams do seek it out. So I get if your preference is Fast, but I’m not sure how it’s a stretch that many people would rather have Goodrow for the playoffs.

 

[Peltz]

Jesper Fast is actually having a way better season than Barclay Goodrow right now, like it's not even close. I don't "hate" Goodrow but like a few players on our roster he's getting too much love from our fanbase right now. He's better on the fourth line where he's a better player than the ones he's facing, as opposed to the third line where he's more of an even draw or negative.

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And maybe the reason that the team was snakebitten was because it had too many Sammy Blaises in the lineup. It remained snakebitten until good players like Vatrano and Copp were added.

Letting go of Fast was a dumb move by JG. Very dumb.

 

[Peltz]

I don't think Kakko will bust, but certainly my opinion of him hasn't been enhanced since his arrival.

His first season was an unmitigated disaster. According to some metrics he was actually the worst player in the NHL. That part has turned around. My biggest concern is his lack of foot speed, but he could still become a legit 1st-liner.

If he doesn't shine next season, I'll begin to wonder if it will ever come together.

I think he was shining a lot this season already. Even last game when he got hurt, I liked what I saw.

 

[bhamill]

Letting go of Fast was a dumb move by JG. Very dumb.

When you consider his cap hit is 2 million, I think, it does seem foolish.

 

[Peltz]

When you consider his cap hit is 2 million, I think, it does seem foolish.

Exactly. Fast’s contract is fantastic.

 

[Miamipuck]

Of course I get what you guys are saying but then there are examples like Claude Lemieux vs Mike Gartner. Gartner was an ostensibly better NHLer, their numbers aren’t close, but you’d probably want Lemieux in the playoffs.
Fast and Goodrow have almost mirror scoring stats with Fast mostly playing farther up the lineup on his team. But they are vastly different types of player. And not in the superstar vs average NHLer sense, they are really both support players. And the Cup winning experience for Goodrow is not negligible. Inexperienced teams do seek it out. So I get if your preference is Fast, but I’m not sure how it’s a stretch that many people would rather have Goodrow for the playoffs.

I would prefer Fast to Goodrow. Likewise, I also think that if you substituted Fast for Goodrow on Tampa's 3rd line, the end result would have been the same for Tampa. That said, they are fairly different players and admittedly love Fast always did. I think he's certainly the type of player you can win cups with.

Also, I have to ask why why why why would you argue with Bernmeisters miserable unlikable brother?


Not directed towards you, but I thought the Rangers tried to get Fast back, but Fast preferred to play somewhere else.

 

[frozenrubber]

I would prefer Fast to Goodrow. Likewise, I also think that if you substituted Fast for Goodrow on Tampa's 3rd line, the end result would have been the same for Tampa. That said, they are fairly different players and admittedly love Fast always did. I think he's certainly the type of player you can win cups with.

Also, I have to ask why why why why would you argue with Bernmeisters miserable unlikable brother?


Not directed towards you, but I thought the Rangers tried to get Fast back, but Fast preferred to play somewhere else.

The Rangers wouldn't give Fast the 3rd year, Carolina would.

Fast is exactly the type of homegrown player where you can actually pay LESS to stay, opposed to bidding on a comparable free agent. He won multiple Player's Player awards, just a phenomenal worker. The only reason I think the Rangers balked was in the belief that his body (specifically his shoulders) wouldn't hold up.

I love everything Goodrow has done for the team this year, but 6 years at 3.6M still worries me.

 

[Rongomania]

Letting go of Fast was a dumb move by JG. Very dumb.

Luckily Goodrow was a better pick up by Dru

 

[bhamill]

I would prefer Fast to Goodrow. Likewise, I also think that if you substituted Fast for Goodrow on Tampa's 3rd line, the end result would have been the same for Tampa. That said, they are fairly different players and admittedly love Fast always did. I think he's certainly the type of player you can win cups with.

Also, I have to ask why why why why would you argue with Bernmeisters miserable unlikable brother?


Not directed towards you, but I thought the Rangers tried to get Fast back, but Fast preferred to play somewhere else.

I actually really like Fast as well, but for a playoff run I like Goodrow more. As I said though I can see why others would go the other way.
As for the second part I guess I’m a masochist. Haha.

 

[MBrodeur]

Are there any other diabetic/celiac players in the NHL?

Domi's diabetic

 

[bobbop]

Max Domi and Luke Kanin are diabetic.

 

[NHLInjuryViz]

We’re probably about middle of the pack w injuries /games lost.
But we lost very little from the top of our lineup, or we’re able to move guys up to not feel it and keep moving.
Montreal was the worst team for injuries. Islanders were really injured as well.

As of Friday, 8th fewest man games lost and similar ranking when weighting by various measures of value.

Montreal has had close to a record number of MGL (or beyond depending who you count). Despite what some of their fans seem to be claiming, the Islanders haven't had it that bad at all. Granted, they had to (or chose to) initially play through their Covid outbreak before the league started postponing games but, other than that, they've been relatively healthy.

 

[Ola]

Letting go of Fast was a dumb move by JG. Very dumb.

The Rangers wouldn't give Fast the 3rd year, Carolina would.

Fast is exactly the type of homegrown player where you can actually pay LESS to stay, opposed to bidding on a comparable free agent. He won multiple Player's Player awards, just a phenomenal worker. The only reason I think the Rangers balked was in the belief that his body (specifically his shoulders) wouldn't hold up.

I love everything Goodrow has done for the team this year, but 6 years at 3.6M still worries me.

I don't know if JG wanted to resign Fast, but the player wanted to leave.

There was a big disconnect between the veterans in the room and management. Put yourself in Fast's shoes. What would your view of management be at the time he left?

Not saying these things are easy or even that JG made mistakes leading up to the point where guys like Fast felt that they 'had it'. A player plays to win the next game, management has to think 5-10 years down the line. We naturally had a strong locker-room. JG obviously wanted free reigns to make decisions without consideration to anything other than implementing his plan. Take Hank for example, was losing his voice and presence in the locker-room 100% a negative side effect -- from Gorton's POV -- in the three-goalie situation we ended up with? It is not black or white but from the perspective of someone like Fast, the decision Gorton made came across as purge-like. DQ was not in any way popular among these players.

 

[Peltz]

I don't know if JG wanted to resign Fast, but the player wanted to leave.

There was a big disconnect between the veterans in the room and management. Put yourself in Fast's shoes. What would your view of management be at the time he left?

Not saying these things are easy or even that JG made mistakes leading up to the point where guys like Fast felt that they 'had it'. A player plays to win the next game, management has to think 5-10 years down the line. We naturally had a strong locker-room. JG obviously wanted free reigns to make decisions without consideration to anything other than implementing his plan. Take Hank for example, was losing his voice and presence in the locker-room 100% a negative side effect -- from Gorton's POV -- in the three-goalie situation we ended up with? It is not black or white but from the perspective of someone like Fast, the decision Gorton made came across as purge-like. DQ was not in any way popular among these players.

If fast wanted to leave then I feel less bad about it. I just like the player and think he would’ve been a good signing on this particular squad especially with how thin they were prior to TDL.

 

[bhamill]

If fast wanted to leave then I feel less bad about it. I just like the player and think he would’ve been a good signing on this particular squad especially with how thin they were prior to TDL.

esp at 2 million per...

 

[Larrybiv]

Letting go of Fast was a dumb move by JG. Very dumb.

Too many Sammy's? We didn't/don't even have ONE! Loved Jesper, NOT a huge Goodrow fan BUT, you cannot overlook that Goodrow had been a part of going all the way. Even if they are exactly the same in what they bring, Jesper hasn't won one yet.
And again, love Jesper and not so much Barclay, but WILL love him if he succeeds being a part of that cup again.

 

[Cuckoo4Kakko]

Can someone start a Fast thread? This thread is about letting us know how soon we have to wait for us to either have a great 3rd line, or if GG is gonna make us all angry by putting Goodrow on line 3 and Laf on line 4. That's it. That's the point of this thread.