Juraj Slafkovsky - Year Two

[417]

In the case of Cauldield, what I recall is he also worked on strength training. It's easier to do with the lighter NCAA schedule. The NHL involves an exception travel and play load with lots of different time zones, it's harder on the body.

Yes and I agreed that in his case, it was that he needed to get stronger and the NCAA schedule makes it easier to get those gains.

But the AHL was a waste of time for him. What he needed was an NHL coach not named Ducharme

 

[Mrb1p]

Yes and I agreed that in his case, it was that he needed to get stronger and the NCAA schedule makes it easier to get those gains.

But the AHL was a waste of time for him. What he needed was an NHL coach not named Ducharme

Yeah the AHL was a waste of time. The first two games, they were being careful. He scored 4 points in two games. At that point, he should've been a NHLer and played on the first two lines with all the PP time possible.

 

[417]

Yeah the AHL was a waste of time. The first two games, they were being careful. He scored 4 points in two games. At that point, he should've been a NHLer and played on the first two lines with all the PP time possible.

100% so maybe deployment/usage is as much a factor in deployment as the difficulty of the league?

There were times under Ducharme where Caufield looked totally lost, but all he needed was some belief from his coach.

So while we can disagree on the NHL/AHL option, we can agree that the coaching staff hasn't exactly put Slafkovsky in the best of situations either and until that variable changes, any progress in development will be stunted.

 

[Mrb1p]

100% so maybe deployment/usage is as much a factor in deployment as the difficulty of the league?

There were times under Ducharme where Caufield looked totally lost, but all he needed was some belief from his coach.

So while we can disagree on the NHL/AHL option, we can agree that the coaching staff hasn't exactly put Slafkovsky in the best of situations either and until that variable changes, any progress in development will be stunted.

Of course it is, the whole idea behind starting in lower league is playing more and having more puck touches.

Why is the first line the best situation for Slaf then ?

 

[417]

Of course it is, the whole idea behind starting in lower league is playing more and having more puck touches.

Sure but then there's also the question of whether that's truly replicating the NHL experience where playing more is no guarantee and puck touches are fewer and further in between.

Why is the first line the best situation for Slaf then ?

I don't know if it's the best situation, but it is odd to keep him in the NHL and not even consider the option given that the alternativies really haven't done better.

Everyone wants to talk about Slafkovsky’s performance being underwhelming so far (something that I'd probably agree with tbh) but what about the players he's played with?

He shouldn't be the one carrying them, so it's no shock that althoughbs very short sample, he's looked much better playing alongside better players.

So sure, send him to Laval, let him dominate for awhile.

But if he comes back and he’a playing on the 3rd line with Christian Dvorak, don’t expect him to look any different than what he did in the NHL so far.

 

[Mrb1p]

Sure but then there's also the question of whether that's truly replicating the NHL experience where playing more is no guarantee and puck touches are fewer and further in between.

I don't know if it's the best situation, but it is odd to keep him in the NHL and not even consider the option given that the alternativies really haven't done better.

Everyone wants to talk about Slafkovsky’s performance being underwhelming so far (something that I'd probably agree with tbh) but what about the players he's played with?

He shouldn't be the one carrying them, so it's no shock that althoughbs very short sample, he's looked much better playing alongside better players.

So sure, send him to Laval, let him dominate for awhile.

But if he comes back and he’a playing on the 3rd line with Christian Dvorak, don’t expect him to look any different than what he did in the NHL so far.

Replicating isn't necessary, you want the player to have the best skillset possible. McDavid and Sid werent amazing at 18 because they had something replicating the NHL experience. They were amazing because their skillset were turned up to 11.

I agree with the second part of your post, even if a player thats good enough and developped enough will most likely carry these guys, up to a point.

 

[Twisted Sinister]

I would have avoided Michkov no matter the other prospects. Not even the first russian drafted; I bet he never even sniffs the nhl.

As for Slaf, I wanted him at that draft, and I call out what I see as it goes. He looked to have improved his first 2-3 games, then looked completely lost and overwhelmed for the rest until last night where he looked like a good 19 year old prospect again. Sorry to not come at this talking in absolutes or categorically.

Rumors are he's in the NHL before the end of his current KHL contract.

 

[Kobe Armstrong]

Life is better when our Slovaks look like a power couple instead of Bust and Buster

 

[BaseballCoach]

The new Ownership rule will be that all prospects will be sent back to their respective draft clubs for a minimum of 2 years (obvious other than a McDavid type of prospect). Not matter how good they look during preseason games they get sent back down

This new rule will be called the Caufield rule because it WORKS! I know this rule is not perfect but I'm 100% positive it will develop a few more quality prospects and also savage some that would have been destroyed by rushing them to the NHL.

Like Monahan? The Tkachuk brothers? Stutzle? Eichel? Svechnikov? Bergeron?

Note that none of these were 1OAs.

 

[Heffyhoof]

It was a great game for sure and he even got a point. That also happened in the first game of the year. I felt the doom and gloom was starting to be justified, so what currently amounts to an outlier performance is nice, but doesn't change much in the grand scheme of things.

Slaf can't go back to playing like he was the last couple of games. Doubly so if he's now being given time on the top line.

 

[Scriptor]

Who knows if Slafkovsky, playing with Caufield and Suzuki, will be like he was in his first game with them, worse over time, or better with developing chemistry between them.

If, somehow, he becomes an actual option for the first line, now and in the future, Roy becomes an interesting player in Montreal, on a 2nd line next year, with Dach and Newhook. This year, after Christmas, he could get a call-up to play with Monahan (C) and Newhook (LW)

Caufield - Suzuki - Slafkovsky
Newhook - Monahan - Roy
RHP - Dvorak - Anderson
Pearson - Evans -Gallagher

 

[BaseballCoach]

Suzuki had a cup of coffee on the 4th line

Lafleur is from a different era, can't compare.

Lecavalier was playing over 19 mins a game as soon as year 2.

The key point is increasing responsibility…not stagnating.

Suzuki did have a short stint on the 4th line (13 games?).

The stint would have been longer if he did a bit less well, and he would have been sent to Laval if he did a lot less well, i.e. no longer the 12th best F playing every night.

 

[BaseballCoach]

It was a great game for sure and he even got a point. That also happened in the first game of the year. I felt the doom and gloom was starting to be justified, so what currently amounts to an outlier performance is nice, but doesn't change much in the grand scheme of things.

Slaf can't go back to playing like he was the last couple of games. Doubly so if he's now being given time on the top line.

What is encourging is that if we take a step back.....

Slafkovsky has done well in basically every game he has played with either Suzuki, Dach or Monahan at center. Saturday night and in the first game of the year with Dach, he created more offence than RHP and Anderson did with those same opportunities, by far. Slaf belongs on this team.

Give him time playing with Suzuki, and if the lines need to be juggled at any point, play him with Monahan if Suzy is not possible. Regardless of exact point production, if he follows the play with top-6 linemates, and contributes to offence while being reasonably responsible, the year of development will be worth it.

 

[cave troll]

Then there's the euro pro leagues that would mostly all rank similarly-ish between NCAA and AHL. Slovakia, DEL, Extraliga, NL, Liiga, SHL and KHL.

Then there's AHL.

Strongest european leagues are above AHL.
Before the war and the mass exodus of top imports, KHL was miles ahead of AHL. AHL was not even close in quality.
Those players now play in DEL, SHL, Switzerland and that made those leagues stronger.

 

[sandviper]

Of course it is, the whole idea behind starting in lower league is playing more and having more puck touches.

Why is the first line the best situation for Slaf then ?

I didn’t go through your whole conversation but agree the lower leagues will get him a lot more puck touches and getting more time to process space.

That said, since he’s staying up with the big club, first line is ideal. I get competition is a lot higher on the other teams when you play first line, but Slaf I think needs higher IQ players to play with. Newhook and Anderson are more straight line N-S players.

Rethinking what I said, maybe first line isn’t exactly what I meant by best situation but more the type of player. Think this is why Slaf looked good with Dach this preseason and with Monahan last season.

 

[Toene]

I didn’t go through your whole conversation but agree the lower leagues will get him a lot more puck touches and getting more time to process space.

That said, since he’s staying up with the big club, first line is ideal. I get competition is a lot higher on the other teams when you play first line, but Slaf I think needs higher IQ players to play with. Newhook and Anderson are more straight line N-S players.

Rethinking what I said, maybe first line isn’t exactly what I meant by best situation but more the type of player. Think this is why Slaf looked good with Dach this preseason and with Monahan last season.

He needs to play with a good center, period. We complained for years and years that our star winger Pacioretty had terrible centers. Now we draft a LW first overall and we play him with an inexperienced center in Newhook? Nonsense.

Chicago has added Perry to help Bedard. Why don't we do the same with Monahan?

Edit : Right now he plays with Foligno and Kurashev but you get my point.

 

[NORiculous]

Think of it as having enough money in the bank before you move to your dream location. You can make money in all locations, and some will require more money to go from one place to another.

In that case, the money overhead would be the talent disparity between you and competition (Or output, instead of talent.) Without getting into too much economy, one would need more money the weaker the currency is, and some places might have close to equal values.

Thats roughly how I'd rank these leagues:
For junior leagues that are not major, (No CHL, and Id say USHL tip-toes here), you'd need to be the best player in the league to make the jump right away, and even then I don't think you could. I can't really think of a player going from USHL, AJHL, BCHL, J20 or U20 Liiga and making the NHL, but the talent level is weaker and rarer.

For junior majors (USHL tip-toed and CHL), you'd need to be one of the best players... Think Suzuki in his final year, Guhle, Xhekaj vs say Mailloux, Barron, Davidson and Mesar.

For NCAA, you'd need to be at a similar level to CHL, but the league is slightly better than average CHL, so I rank it higher. Think of Makar, Fox, Caufield vs Harris, Struble, etc. Of course, there's always a case by case, and especially when it comes to players with big asterisks. Size and speed are the biggest ones, sometimes the jump is just too big for small players, like Farrell.

Then there's the euro pro leagues that would mostly all rank similarly-ish between NCAA and AHL. Slovakia, DEL, Extraliga, NL, Liiga, SHL and KHL.

Then there's AHL.

The further up the list you are, the better player you need to be in your respective league. In Slafkovsky's case, the jump generally requires you to be the best player on your team to make an impact right away in the NHL and to be able to keep learning at the rate you should learn.

Examples:
Rantanen was the best player on his team, then went to AHL and broke records and then started in the NHL. He never had "adapt" his play style, he learned to impose his playstyle on the NHL.
Hintz was the same, even if he took longer.
Teravainen followed the same route, but had a hard time to impose his playstyle in the NHL, he adapted in other ways. Size and skating both played a role in this.
Barkov and Heiskanen were both elite prospects coming out of their Liiga season, they dominated there and were good enough and had a clear defined play style that allowed them to have success right away.

I was hoping for math.

There were a couple of versions of this out there . This is the last one I saw but it’s probably out dated:

.80 Kontinental Hockey League (up .02)

.60 Swedish Hockey League (up .05)

.47 American Hockey League (up .02)

.44 Western Collegiate Hockey Association (defunct, up .02)

.41 National Collegiate Hockey Conference (new league)

.40 Switzerland NLA (up .04)

.37 Hockey-East (up .04)

.35 Big-10 (new league)

.32 Ontario Hockey League (up .02)

.32 Central Collegiate Hockey Association (defunct) (up .02)

.29 Finland SM-Liiga (down .01)

.27 Western Hockey League (up .01)

.26 Quebec Major Junior Hockey League (no change)

.23 Eastern College Athletic Conference (down .02)

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

That goal the other night was textbook Joel Armiaesque future is bright!!!

 

[Egresch]

Slafkovsky has done well in basically every game he has played with either Suzuki, Dach or Monahan at center.

And honestly, this cannot surprise anyone. Slaf has always been known for his lower hockey IQ, but if he was given opportunity to play with smart linemate, he complemented very well. Combining him with Anderson you would need at least Gretzky to compensate the lack of hockey IQ.

 

[BaseballCoach]

And honestly, this cannot surprise anyone. Slaf has always been known for his lower hockey IQ, but if he was given opportunity to play with smart linemate, he complemented very well. Combining him with Anderson you would need at least Gretzky to compensate the lack of hockey IQ.

I don't fully agree. I think the reason he looks better than Anderson and even RHP with top players is Slaf has better IQ. What is still developing is his play driving, which is not the same as IQ. At 19 he is not a play driver like McDavid or Jack Hughes or other mostly centremen.

Joshua Roy is not a big time play driver, but has high IQ which is why he does so much better with a guy like Bedard than other Juniors did.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

Strongest european leagues are above AHL.
Before the war and the mass exodus of top imports, KHL was miles ahead of AHL. AHL was not even close in quality.
Those players now play in DEL, SHL, Switzerland and that made those leagues stronger.

I disagree. AHL are all borderline NHLers on top of having many more talented NHL prospects.

 

[Jaynki]

He is excellent and he just oozes massive potential. He don't have an elite skill, he has an elite package.

Y'all are getting fooled by his slow debut season. He is a monster in the making.

Right now, they are teaching and focusing him to play a pro games and develop pro reflex. When and how to change efficiently, how to protect himself, how an effective defense translate into a dangerous offense, the importance of proper positioning in different circumstances. Etc. These thing are better taught in the NHL. And its way better for him to learn those than to dominate lesser league in his current stage.

At this point in his career, what we saw in training camp, in the 1st game and against St. Louis are way more telling than game 2-10. You all are acting like he will not improve or barely improve when actually he should improve in an exponential fashion.

As he is professionalising his game and once he is a little bit more quick, a little bit stronger and a little bit more consistent. We should have his power, speed burst, shifty hands, heavy shot, puck protection and playmaking on full display. A two way power forward in the making with PPG upside.

Im doubling down on Slafkovsky. At your own risk to dismiss a 1st overall with this talent. Too bad if you can't appreciate the skills. One day you won't be able to deny it anymore.

 

[cave troll]

I disagree. AHL are all borderline NHLers on top of having many more talented NHL prospects.

I can't even tell you how many times I watched my team consisted of borderline NHL-ers, former NHL-er and top tier AHL-ers getting trashed hard in KHL.

 

[Tyson]

I think before long Slaf will remove the low IQ myth from people's mindset.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Who knows if Slafkovsky, playing with Caufield and Suzuki, will be like he was in his first game with them, worse over time, or better with developing chemistry between them.

If, somehow, he becomes an actual option for the first line, now and in the future, Roy becomes an interesting player in Montreal, on a 2nd line next year, with Dach and Newhook. This year, after Christmas, he could get a call-up to play with Monahan (C) and Newhook (LW)

Caufield - Suzuki - Slafkovsky
Newhook - Monahan - Roy
RHP - Dvorak - Anderson
Pearson - Evans -Gallagher

If Slaf works on the first and Dach comes back healthy, we just might have a pretty strong top six going forward. I’m really hopeful for Roy. We’ll see how that goes.