Juraj Slafkovsky - Year Two

[Lafleurs Guy]

Yeah but the half season and the playoff run before, people weren’t completely sold on him.

Ironically enough it was really just you and I who we’re super bullish on his potential at that point who we’re being vocal about it. Others liked him but thought maybe he’d be Cammy good or 30 goals good. But you and I didn’t hedge at all. I remember it clear as day

Geez, I don't remember.

There's no doubt in my mind though that there were probably the usual 'he has to earn it' type posts by some people.

What's really unreal is that if the coach hadn't been fired, he'd still be struggling. Imagine being a Hab prospect back when it was SL and MT... how the hell were you supposed to go anywhere? Just brutal.

MSL is night and day better - even if I'm not thrilled with Slaf's development plan, I still have a lot of faith in MSL.

 

[SlafySZN]

Delete

 

[dackelljuneaubulis02]

Actually, Andrei Markov was a blue chip prospect.

Back when hockey's future had a prospect ranking system, Markov was rated a 9.0, which was superstar potential. I don't think any other prospect in Montreal ever got that rating, including price (although I could be wrong on that)

I recall Andrei Markov coming to Vancouver to play an exhibition game back in 2000 when he was trying to make the nhl team, and the Canucks commentators were raving about his game and how much of a slam dunk he is.

I remember him during those Theodore playoffs and he really stood out but I don’t think people were pegging him to be a star.

But I’ll stand corrected

 

[JianYang]

I remember him during those Theodore playoffs and he really stood out but I don’t think people were pegging him to be a star.

But I’ll stand corrected

Yeah, the work he did to make that famous koivu goal possible in the 02 playoffs was incredible. I still don't know how he managed to keep that puck in the zone to this day.

Markov was drafted as an unknown, but the hype started quickly thereafter.

It's a shame that he had so many ugly injuries in his prime because it looked like he was just starting to get his name into that Norris echelon by 2008.

 

[YukonCornelius 5thOA]

I remember him during those Theodore playoffs and he really stood out but I don’t think people were pegging him to be a star.

But I’ll stand corrected

03-04 is when he really started becoming the General. He was a potentially exciting prospect, but you are correct, not pegged to be a star as it was unknown where his ceiling in the NHL was going to be.

 

[nhlfan9191]

I made reference to this a while back... it really, really helps when you've got a superstar in the lineup to help other players develop. That's something that's really held us back. Imagine how much easier it would be for a guy like Slaf if we said, 'hey... go suit up with Mackinnon tonight.' Points are way easier, it leads to confidence, that always you to build your game more... We've sorely missed that on our team forever.

I’ve said this for years. I also think it’s one of the reasons we’ve been so successful with goaltending. We’ve always had really solid veteran goalies for the younger guys to come in and play with during formative years. We don’t certainly haven’t had that at forward. Guys like Gallagher can teach you how to conduct yourself as a professional, but they can’t teach you how to handle being a star in a big market.

 

[le_sean]

Yeah how silly of me to want a highly ranked and highly hyped draft pick to show something special beyond “he’s very very heavy for his age”

We should tank every year, sure

Except everyone and their dog knows that a player of his type and size takes years to develop. So to whine because he’s not a PPG player right now is stupid.

 

[salbutera]

Geez, I don't remember.

There's no doubt in my mind though that there were probably the usual 'he has to earn it' type posts by some people.

What's really unreal is that if the coach hadn't been fired, he'd still be struggling. Imagine being a Hab prospect back when it was SL and MT... how the hell were you supposed to go anywhere? Just brutal.

MSL is night and day better - even if I'm not thrilled with Slaf's development plan, I still have a lot of faith in MSL.

Markov “developed” in AHL under Therrien, and was called up to Habs under MTs urging after being named Habs coach replacing Vigneault.

 

[ReHabs]

Except everyone and their dog knows that a player of his type and size takes years to develop. So to whine because he’s not a PPG player right now is stupid.

Who said anything about demading this teenager to be an NHL PPG player? A little over a year ago he was struggling to find his feet in Liiga, nobody should expect him to be a PPG player in the NHL right now. Take a step back and look at the general picture: we're told to mollycoddle this player because the Habs organization rushed him to the NHL. Now he's in the NHL and the head coach and team president both pretty much underlined that he's here to stay. If he doesn't produce, it will be talked about and it's entirely the doing of the Habs organization. So he should show something interesting and special to justify this rather ridiculous development arc upon which he's been placed. I didn't watch his last pre-season game but it seems he showed a lot of good things -- he'll need to keep doing that, there is no reason to expect any less from him. He's the 2022 first overall pick for heaven's sake, have some expecations and standards, it is perfectly healthy.

You have to perform when you're in the NHL, you can't just not produce and expect to be given a free ride with viewers and fans. Ordinary fans and commentators aren't stupid even if Tankists are convinced that losing and failing to perform is better than winning.

 

[OnTheRun]

Who said anything about demading this teenager to be an NHL PPG player? A little over a year ago he was struggling to find his feet in Liiga, nobody should expect him to be a PPG player in the NHL right now. Take a step back and look at the general picture: we're told to mollycoddle this player because the Habs organization rushed him to the NHL. Now he's in the NHL and the head coach and team president both pretty much underlined that he's here to stay. If he doesn't produce, it will be talked about and it's entirely the doing of the Habs organization. So he should show something interesting and special to justify this rather ridiculous development arc upon which he's been placed. I didn't watch his last pre-season game but it seems he showed a lot of good things -- he'll need to keep doing that, there is no reason to expect any less from him. He's the 2022 first overall pick for heaven's sake, have some expecations and standards, it is perfectly healthy.

You have to perform when you're in the NHL, you can't just not produce and expect to be given a free ride with viewers and fans. Ordinary fans and commentators aren't stupid even if Tankists are convinced that losing and failing to perform is better than winning.

That's a pretty confusing and conflicting stance to take. If you think he was rushed to the NHL then your expectations of what he is ready to do in the NHL should reflect that.

 

[Milhouse40]

Yeah how silly of me to want a highly ranked and highly hyped draft pick to show something special beyond “he’s very very heavy for his age”

We should tank every year, sure

What you want is to dream!

Do you want Lafrenière, highly ranked and highly hyped draft pick in his draft year?
Today your answer would be no, but the real answer is YES you would have like that.

If you look at the Top10 last year in the NHL for top point producers, the majority were not highly touted prospect and the majority were not good in their D+1, guess you don't want those

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Markov “developed” in AHL under Therrien, and was called up to Habs under MTs urging after being named Habs coach replacing Vigneault.

We’ve been through this before… MT did not develop Markov. Please stop trying to rehabilitate the broken reputation of a God awful coach.

 

[ReHabs]

That's a pretty confusing and conflicting stance to take. If you think he was rushed to the NHL then your expectations of what he is ready to do in the NHL should reflect that.

In sports you have to produce the goods. I know the regular season is essentially meaningless in North American professional sports but the fact is you don't ice a peewee team even if your organization seeks to tank and lose. We watch to enjoy the performance, we were cheering on the small bright spots last year weren't we?

If you're a player in the NHL, you're taking the job from another would-be NHLer. There is nothing confusing about this in my opinion: if you're in the NHL, you have to perform and produce (this goes double for top6 players or skill players). If you cannot perform or produce, you shouldn't be in the NHL. This is why I burned to stress that Slaf was not meant to be in the NHL last year.

What you want is to dream!

Do you want Lafrenière, highly ranked and highly hyped draft pick in his draft year?
Today your answer would be no, but the real answer is YES you would have like that.

If you look at the Top10 last year in the NHL for top point producers, the majority were not highly touted prospect and the majority were not good in their D+1, guess you don't want those

Lafrenière is an odd case but I would still want him today. I trust and believe in his pedigree -- I think there's something there. If Drouin got nearly 8 years of non-stop faith, Lafrenière should get at least four. Of course this could all change (and who knows if Lafrenière was rushed or not -- I haven't followed him closely to know).

Slafkovsky's D+1 has come and gone. Let's focus on the D+2, shall we? Do you not expect to see something good from him this year -- what are your expectations? Isn't it unusual there is no aura of greatness around him, just a lot of nervous consternation and strained convincing from the PR agents in the media?

If he's as good as he's meant to be why does it feel so strained?

 

[BLONG7]

Somewhere in the past I read Montreal believes he will be the best player from that draft...in 5 years.

Let's hope years 3-4 but who knows.......do we even need him to be the best player in his draft?

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Let's hope years 3-4 but who knows.......do we even need him to be the best player in his draft?

Not if Hutson’s the best player in that draft.

 

[dackelljuneaubulis02]

In sports you have to produce the goods. I know the regular season is essentially meaningless in North American professional sports but the fact is you don't ice a peewee team even if your organization seeks to tank and lose. We watch to enjoy the performance, we were cheering on the small bright spots last year weren't we?

If you're a player in the NHL, you're taking the job from another would-be NHLer. There is nothing confusing about this in my opinion: if you're in the NHL, you have to perform and produce (this goes double for top6 players or skill players). If you cannot perform or produce, you shouldn't be in the NHL. This is why I burned to stress that Slaf was not meant to be in the NHL last year.


Lafrenière is an odd case but I would still want him today. I trust and believe in his pedigree -- I think there's something there. If Drouin got nearly 8 years of non-stop faith, Lafrenière should get at least four. Of course this could all change (and who knows if Lafrenière was rushed or not -- I haven't followed him closely to know).

Slafkovsky's D+1 has come and gone. Let's focus on the D+2, shall we? Do you not expect to see something good from him this year -- what are your expectations? Isn't it unusual there is no aura of greatness around him, just a lot of nervous consternation and strained convincing from the PR agents in the media?

If he's as good as he's meant to be why does it feel so strained?

If he can use last game as a baseline and generally trend up from there, he’s gonna be a tremendous player. Still needs to work on things obviously but man he does so much that could be huge in the playoffs.

Even if Cooley produces 10 or so more points on average more than Slaf, I think I’d still prefer Slaf. But I don’t know enough about Copley’s all around game. Slaf can bring something really unique that can wreak utter havoc on other teams’ D.

If there’s a worst case scenario I could envision him is possibly being an Anderson with inconsistency. I don’t think he will be. The Draft year highlights are invariably him playing a high tempo game. The effort always seems to be there which is a great sign. He has way too much going for him

 

[dackelljuneaubulis02]

Let's hope years 3-4 but who knows.......do we even need him to be the best player in his draft?

If he pans out he won’t be far off best player at the very least.

The only thing is the IQ. With the puck on his stick I don’t think he’s low IQ at all. Positionally and putting himself in vulnerable positions is the real question mark. If that’s no longer a problem then he’ll be a stud. 100%

 

[OnTheRun]

In sports you have to produce the goods. I know the regular season is essentially meaningless in North American professional sports but the fact is you don't ice a peewee team even if your organization seeks to tank and lose. We watch to enjoy the performance, we were cheering on the small bright spots last year weren't we?

If you're a player in the NHL, you're taking the job from another would-be NHLer. There is nothing confusing about this in my opinion: if you're in the NHL, you have to perform and produce (this goes double for top6 players or skill players). If you cannot perform or produce, you shouldn't be in the NHL. This is why I burned to stress that Slaf was not meant to be in the NHL last year.

Again, this is just you struggling to adjust your expectations to your own premise, You said he wasn't ready, so that mean he is doing his apprenticeship in the NHL, from that point on your general idea of what one should do in the NHL is already out of the window.

 

[salbutera]

We’ve been through this before… MT did not develop Markov. Please stop trying to rehabilitate the broken reputation of a God awful coach.

 

[ReHabs]

Again, this is just you struggling to adjust your expectations to your own premise, You said he wasn't ready, so that mean he is doing his apprenticeship in the NHL, from that point on your general idea of what one should do in the NHL is already out of the window.

Can you define for us what you mean by an apprenticeship in this context, and can you give some examples of such?

 

[OnTheRun]

Can you define for us what you mean by an apprenticeship in this context, and can you give some examples of such?

I'm not sure what you are asking for here, but it's not really important.

It all come down to: If someone is considered to be not ready (by you) to perform a task or role, that someone cannot be expected (by you) to perform that task or role with the same proficiency as someone considered ready to perform the task/role.

The Habs don't have cognitive dissonance on this, according to them, Slaf is here to learn and progress into that role.

 

[Milhouse40]

Lafrenière is an odd case but I would still want him today. I trust and believe in his pedigree -- I think there's something there. If Drouin got nearly 8 years of non-stop faith, Lafrenière should get at least four. Of course this could all change (and who knows if Lafrenière was rushed or not -- I haven't followed him closely to know).

Slafkovsky's D+1 has come and gone. Let's focus on the D+2, shall we? Do you not expect to see something good from him this year -- what are your expectations? Isn't it unusual there is no aura of greatness around him, just a lot of nervous consternation and strained convincing from the PR agents in the media?

If he's as good as he's meant to be why does it feel so strained?

The funny thing is that if Lafreniere was here, you would be saying the exact same thing.
Rushed in the NHL, not use properly, doesn't show any flash......his first season was not that far from the one of Slafkovsky and maybe you would have been right.

He was the 1st overall in a weak draft. There would likely be no stars players in that draft. Very good players, but no projected 100pts players either. The expectations need to be realistic.

Slafkovsky will play his game #40 in the NHL, so my expectations goes accordingly, he has not played a full season yet, not even half of one. I do expect more than last year but I'm not expecting a 60pts season suddenly out of nowhere.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

The funny thing is that if Lafreniere was here, you would be saying the exact same thing.
Rushed in the NHL, not use properly, doesn't show any flash......his first season was not that far from the one of Slafkovsky and maybe you would have been right.

He was the 1st overall in a weak draft. There would likely be no stars players in that draft. Very good players, but no projected 100pts players either. The expectations need to be realistic.

Slafkovsky will play his game #40 in the NHL, so my expectations goes accordingly, he has not played a full season yet, not even half of one. I do expect more than last year but I'm not expecting a 60pts season suddenly out of nowhere.

I was all for trading for Laf… now I don’t know. I certainly wouldn’t pay a premium and honestly I don’t know he’d have a place in our future top six. Caufield, Roy, Slaf… I’m excited about them. Dach, Newhook might eventually wind up on the wing as well.

 

[SlafySZN]

 

[JianYang]

I was all for trading for Laf… now I don’t know. I certainly wouldn’t pay a premium and honestly I don’t know he’d have a place in our future top six. Caufield, Roy, Slaf… I’m excited about them. Dach, Newhook might eventually wind up on the wing as well.

I think it would be a big mistake to move dach to the wing long term. He's Tailor made for center, and these attributes aren't necessarily easy to find.

Gorton also admitted as much when he was asked about it while dach was clicking on the wing with caufield and suzuki. Even at that time, he still saw dach at center long term.