Player Discussion JT Miller Thread

[ghostingtaro]

its too bad we cant fire jt miller

but the next best thing is to trade his lazy ass

 

[SeawaterOnIce]

Its ok as long as he returns a Luongo-level player in a trade soon.

To Florida for Spencer Knight?

 

[IslandBeast]

Even as an 80 point player you might as well subtract like 20 from his totals considering his poor defensive play and team deflating attitude, meaning he's more like a 60 point player. You can score 100 goals in a season but if you're taking a dump on on each one of your teammates chest before each game you probably aren't a good cohesive unit.

 

[BimJenning]

He is also the teams defending MVP, has contributed to more W's than anyone since joining the team, and is the only player here who has had an elite season as a Canuck. (Hughes maybe the exception)

This team is a lottery team without Demko or Markstrom previously playing out of their minds. He absolutely has not continued to more wins vs. them, nor should he have been MVP over them.

 

[sting101]

What a difference a year makes

This team is a lottery team without Demko or Markstrom previously playing out of their minds. He absolutely has not continued to more wins vs. them, nor should he have been MVP over them.

lol yes ok

 

[CanucksSayEh]

This team is a lottery team without Demko or Markstrom previously playing out of their minds. He absolutely has not continued to more wins vs. them, nor should he have been MVP over them.

I don't really like mixing goalies with skaters, but cmon, those 2 have a fraction of the games played as JT over the past 3.5 seasons. Hard to contribute to winning on IR, the bench, or a different team.

Ill listen to a draw between JT and Markstrom for the 19/20 season, but it was clearly JT last season. Hughes and Demko were great, but a distinct gap for 2nd and 3rd.

 

[Brookbank]

its too bad we cant fire jt miller

but the next best thing is to trade his lazy ass

Horvat didn't backcheck a couple times last game. One led to a goal. But he can never do anything wrong eh

I'd agree with you if this wasn't such a common sight. This team is in for a lot of losing and he signed up for a front row seat. The bench reaction tells it all, they know it's a tired routine.

Does Jim Benning make that signing ? Im not sure that he does.

 

[BimJenning]

I don't really like mixing goalies with skaters, but cmon, those 2 have a fraction of the games played as JT over the past 3.5 seasons. Hard to contribute to winning on IR, the bench, or a different team.

Ill listen to a draw between JT and Markstrom for the 19/20 season, but it was clearly JT last season. Hughes and Demko were great, but a distinct gap for 2nd and 3rd.

This year, no doubt, and with Demko obviously being a wreck or injured. He played 64 games last year though and was a very busy man in them. Fair though to agree to disagree, especially because it's not like JT didn't have a dominant season last year.

 

[IslandBeast]

Horvat didn't backcheck a couple times last game. One led to a goal. But he can never do anything wrong eh

Weird flex seeing as how Horvat is going to be traded within a few weeks

 

[Breakers]

100% that is true about Miller not finding his money elsewear.

Which is COMPLETELY negated by trading him past deadline as the contract can’t be discussed till the offseason

You have an OUT with full value at the deadline.

waiting till the off-season shows how stupid rutherford and Alvin were like with the islanders
he can just say "nope more" and they wont trade for him.

 

[I Hart Conor Garland]

Its also pretty much completely buyout proof.

Seems like our team continues that trend from previous management.

Don't know why.

That’s part of the give and take. Miller got that security for the sacrifices he made on AAV and term.

 

[Grantham]

I just don't get the amount of criticism for JT lately. He's been much better defensively in the last dozen or so games. Yes I get that the tantrums are childish, and his passes can be picked off, but he's been much better here too.

Is he just the lightning rod for criticism? Is he not the exact same player since he arrived day 1 for these things? Why start hammering on him now? Seems a bit excessive is all

I do think he needs to change the negative body language though big time, and let's see if RT can reach him there like he did Kessel.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

I just don't get the amount of criticism for JT lately. He's been much better defensively in the last dozen or so games. Yes I get that the tantrums are childish, and his passes can be picked off, but he's been much better here too.

Is he just the lightning rod for criticism? Is he not the exact same player since he arrived day 1 for these things? Why start hammering on him now? Seems a bit excessive is all

I do think he needs to change the negative body language though big time, and let's see if RT can reach him there like he did Kessel.

I think that a lot of people are expecting Tocchet to tear a strip off JT, or discipline him in some way...I dont see it,.. both previous Canuck coaches (and Jon Cooper) have said glowing things about the player.

When JT is on, he's a force all by himself..Hopefully, Tocchet can ignite Miller, and get him back to his level of play from last season.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

I just don't get the amount of criticism for JT lately. He's been much better defensively in the last dozen or so games. Yes I get that the tantrums are childish, and his passes can be picked off, but he's been much better here too.

Is he just the lightning rod for criticism? Is he not the exact same player since he arrived day 1 for these things? Why start hammering on him now? Seems a bit excessive is all

I do think he needs to change the negative body language though big time, and let's see if RT can reach him there like he did Kessel.

Oh he is absolutely fine defensively when he isnt playing center.

Think of him as a really talented child. The kind you see on programs like "Last Chance U."

 

[kanucks25]

He's really good when he tries.

When he's skating and actually showing effort he can be a force: strong in puck battles, plus shot, plus playmaker, plus hands.

Just has to try every game...

 

[JohnHodgson]

I just don't get the amount of criticism for JT lately. He's been much better defensively in the last dozen or so games. Yes I get that the tantrums are childish, and his passes can be picked off, but he's been much better here too.

Is he just the lightning rod for criticism? Is he not the exact same player since he arrived day 1 for these things? Why start hammering on him now? Seems a bit excessive is all

I do think he needs to change the negative body language though big time, and let's see if RT can reach him there like he did Kessel.

Canucks media/twitter is honestly the worst.

All it takes is one party to jump on a narrative and it just takes a life of its own.

Miller is having a bad year but so is 90% of the roster? Dude scored 99 points for us last year (and near PPG the two years prior - 200 games of amazing production) and Canucks fans are turning on him after a bad 30 games to start the year where the entire team sucked and looked lost and unmotivated.

I really think we have a bottom 5 fanbase. Tons of so called fans are band wagoners. Tons of fans just echo whatever the media says and can't really form opinions for themselves.

Miller hasn't found a consistent role this year or linemates. He's been hopping between centre and wing, playing through a carousel of wingers/centers.

Not to mention the Vancouver media/fanbase has been constantly taking a fat dump on him despite being an absolute warrior for us and arguably MVP of our last 3 seasons. When the entire fanbase is taking a fat dump on you, there's no way that helps a players game.

Even in a down year, he has 41 points in 46 games, alongside 18 goals. He's a shoe-in for 30+ goals and 70+ points. For 8M, it's not amazing, but it's not a problem.

People act like he's Huberdeau making 11M and scoring 30 points.

 

[F A N]

Miller is having a bad year but so is 90% of the roster? Dude scored 99 points for us last year (and near PPG the two years prior - 200 games of amazing production) and Canucks fans are turning on him after a bad 30 games to start the year where the entire team sucked and looked lost and unmotivated.

I really think we have a bottom 5 fanbase. Tons of so called fans are band wagoners. Tons of fans just echo whatever the media says and can't really form opinions for themselves.

To be fair, Miller has been criticized for his defensive effort and angry outbursts well before this season.

I do agree that our fan base has a lot of band wagoners. As for whether we have a bottom 5 fanbase, technically we are a bottom 5 franchise in terms of historical winning %. Top 3 if we don't count Seattle. We also have not won a Cup. It's understandable that the frustration level would be high compared to other fan bases who have seen their teams achieve greater success historically.

 

[mriswith]

Everyone on twitter is toxic, that's a twitter thing not a Vancouver thing.

 

[JohnHodgson]

To be fair, Miller has been criticized for his defensive effort and angry outbursts well before this season.

I do agree that our fan base has a lot of band wagoners. As for whether we have a bottom 5 fanbase, technically we are a bottom 5 franchise in terms of historical winning %. Top 3 if we don't count Seattle. We also have not won a Cup. It's understandable that the frustration level would be high compared to other fan bases who have seen their teams achieve greater success historically.

OEL is playing like a #6 defensemen making 7M.

Boeser is playing like a bottom end second line forward making 6.6M.

Garland is barely passing by as a top nine forward making 5M.

Myers is playing like a #5 making 6M.

Miller (who is still making 5M mind you), even considering his 8M extension, is not even the worst value on this team. These players are playing far worse for their salary.

Yet somehow, Miller is taking more brunt of the blame than all these players combined. Canucks fanbase is truly toxic af.

I wanted Miller traded too. I also understanding signing him to an extension. In terms of problems, Miller is not even close to the top on this team.

 

[JohnHodgson]

Everyone on twitter is toxic, that's a twitter thing not a Vancouver thing.

Vancouver fans are toxic.

Vancouver fans on twitter are undeniable.

Then pour a little toxicity of Vancouver media.

Just a beautiful disaster.

 

[mriswith]

Your post on OEL/Boeser/Garland/Myers making 25M and all massively underperforming is precisely why people aren't excited about having signed a 30 year old forward until 2030.

We were looking forward to a good trade return for him and look to a future where there isn't almost 1/3 of the cap tied up in underperforming players. Now Miller's on a contract that is guaranteed to be bad for x number of years at the end, he's been floating and lazy this season, and Horvat is going to walk presumably over money while JT is here until 2030.

I can see how you think Vancouver is overly pessimistic when this is your take on the defense and our path to be competitive but most people don't share your rosy optimism on the likelihood of half of this occurring. It would have been nice to actually build towards something instead of the permanent day by day brick by brick mid round pick for tweener plan we're on, but here we are instead.

Canucks don't need 3 top 4 d-men - that's absolutely asinine to say. It's not about taking it step-by-step to turn things around. Canucks need to get 1 top 4 dman and then build off that. They need guys like Bear and Dermott to take positive steps. They need guys like Myers and OEL to bounce back.

All we need is for Myers and OEL to bounce back, Bear and Dermott to take positive steps, and to add a top 4 dman while not losing our offense? That's an enormous and unrealistic ask.

 

[LickTheEnvelope]

Canucks media/twitter is honestly the worst.

All it takes is one party to jump on a narrative and it just takes a life of its own.

Miller is having a bad year but so is 90% of the roster? Dude scored 99 points for us last year (and near PPG the two years prior - 200 games of amazing production) and Canucks fans are turning on him after a bad 30 games to start the year where the entire team sucked and looked lost and unmotivated.

I really think we have a bottom 5 fanbase. Tons of so called fans are band wagoners. Tons of fans just echo whatever the media says and can't really form opinions for themselves.

Miller hasn't found a consistent role this year or linemates. He's been hopping between centre and wing, playing through a carousel of wingers/centers.

Not to mention the Vancouver media/fanbase has been constantly taking a fat dump on him despite being an absolute warrior for us and arguably MVP of our last 3 seasons. When the entire fanbase is taking a fat dump on you, there's no way that helps a players game.

Even in a down year, he has 41 points in 46 games, alongside 18 goals. He's a shoe-in for 30+ goals and 70+ points. For 8M, it's not amazing, but it's not a problem.

People act like he's Huberdeau making 11M and scoring 30 points.

... the team has been a bottom 10 team in the league for 10 years.

Worse than that, after 10 years of being a bottom 10 team they are not close to the playoffs + are capped out + have a bottom 5 prospect pool + somehow believe they are close to cup contention.

 

[CanucksSayEh]

... the team has been a bottom 10 team in the league for 10 years.

Worse than that, after 10 years of being a bottom 10 team they are not close to the playoffs + are capped out + have a bottom 5 prospect pool + somehow believe they are close to cup contention.

They weren't even a bottom 10 team last year, let alone the last 10. Averages mean little when you've had complete roster and suit turnover. Really just means pain for fans, but not the shape of the team as a whole.

Don't mistake pessimism for realism. Exaggerating the negatives, can lead to worse moves than hope.

Everyone thinks they can stomach stripping it down, until EP and Hughes are gone, and our 1st lotto pick ends up a 3rd liner, and the 2nd a concussion case. A scorched earth requires straight up blind luck to be successful, countless moves need to go right, and you can still end up with a middling team at best.

 

[JohnHodgson]

Your post on OEL/Boeser/Garland/Myers making 25M and all massively underperforming is precisely why people aren't excited about having signed a 30 year old forward until 2030.

We were looking forward to a good trade return for him and look to a future where there isn't almost 1/3 of the cap tied up in underperforming players. Now Miller's on a contract that is guaranteed to be bad for x number of years at the end, he's been floating and lazy this season, and Horvat is going to walk presumably over money while JT is here until 2030.

I can see how you think Vancouver is overly pessimistic when this is your take on the defense and our path to be competitive but most people don't share your rosy optimism on the likelihood of half of this occurring. It would have been nice to actually build towards something instead of the permanent day by day brick by brick mid round pick for tweener plan we're on, but here we are instead.


All we need is for Myers and OEL to bounce back, Bear and Dermott to take positive steps, and to add a top 4 dman while not losing our offense? That's an enormous and unrealistic ask.

If we play with actual structure, all defensemen should be performing better. Pond hockey is basically equivalent to playing no defence.

I'm with you man, I've said before I'm on the tear it down path if I could choose. But that's not what's happening. Miller is not a problem on this hockey team right now. Nobody is excited for Miller when he's 36/37, no shit. He is still performing fine and shouldn't experience any steep declines anytime soon.

Vancouver is not overly pessimistic. Vancouver is completely a bandwagon city and fans are literally so biased one way or another and can't critically think. When Canucks were winning last year, how many fans were shouting Bruce there it is saying this team was ready to compete for the playoffs? All while completely disregarding the fact that they got carried by world-class goaltending.

Now fans are Doom and Gloom talking about how this team can't get better blah blah blah.

How many young players on this team that can still take steps forward? Petey, Hughes, Dermott, Bear, Hogs, Pods, Studnicka, Dries, Lockwood, Pederson etc..

How many players are having a bad year and can easily bounce back next year? Demko, Boeser, Garland, Miller, Lazar, OEL, Myers?

I'm not saying everything will go right, but this season has gone as bad as anyone could think. 90% of the roster is having bad years. Team has not been playing well outside of maybe 4/5 guys? The point is that, this is as low of a floor as you can go in terms of a bad season. Record will likely get better with better coaching and easier schedule. There's pathways to improvement... if you want to deny that's your perogative.

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

... the team has been a bottom 10 team in the league for 10 years.

Worse than that, after 10 years of being a bottom 10 team they are not close to the playoffs + are capped out + have a bottom 5 prospect pool + somehow believe they are close to cup contention.

Yes, but the media and fans are the real problem here.......... not the team....or management....nope the fans and media.....

They weren't even a bottom 10 team last year, let alone the last 10. Averages mean little when you've had complete roster and suit turnover. Really just means pain for fans, but not the shape of the team as a whole.

Don't mistake pessimism for realism. Exaggerating the negatives, can lead to worse moves than hope.

Everyone thinks they can stomach stripping it down, until EP and Hughes are gone, and our 1st lotto pick ends up a 3rd liner, and the 2nd a concussion case. A scorched earth requires straight up blind luck to be successful, countless moves need to go right, and you can still end up with a middling team at best.

As opposed to what we've been doing the last 10 years which has worked so damn well....most of us are sick of the same crap over and over and over, it's like freaking ground hog day every year.