Prospect Info: Joshua Roy Part 2

[BLONG7]

Sadly they deserve no thanks. They picked 6 players before Roy. He was the late round francophone to try to shut up Québec journalists. They took a chance on him at #150. The whole league was totally wrong passing so many times on such a talented player, identified as such at least since he was 15 in midget AAA with two points per game and first overall pickin the Q. Yes he had flaws, but the superior talent was there. Pick a guy with talent and work with him intead of limited guys with bottom 6 upside.

Every year, every team makes mistakes in the draft.............some of these kids, are motivated after being drafted, and want to be better, like Roy. Others become entitled floaters.......who expect stuff to be handed to them, and they stop working for it.
Bottom line, it's hard to get it right every time.................absolutely fantastic the habs found this kid in the 5th round.........and I really don't think it had to do with appeasing a franco media....because we all know that is basically impossible.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

Sadly they deserve no thanks. They picked 6 players before Roy. He was the late round francophone to try to shut up Québec journalists. They took a chance on him at #150. The whole league was totally wrong passing so many times on such a talented player, identified as such at least since he was 15 in midget AAA with two points per game and first overall pickin the Q. Yes he had flaws, but the superior talent was there. Pick a guy with talent and work with him intead of limited guys with bottom 6 upside.

That is a terrible take.

Roy was grossly out of shape, with a poor work ethic and had already forced a trade. He was viewed league wide as a slow, lazy diva but Montreal was still willing to take a chance on him. Go ahead and **** on them for missing on high picks but to do exactly the same for hitting on late picks is as disingenuous as it gets. Roy was passed over 149 times by the best scouts in the world.......149 times. You could hardly blame Timmins and company if they passed on him for the 150th time but they didn't and they deserve credit for that whether you want to give it or not.

It is very common for top Bantam players who go at the top of their respective CHL priority drafts to never make the NHL and Joshua certainly looked like he was going down that well worn road leading up to the draft. Poor skating and poor work ethic is what usually derails top Bantam players and that is exactly what Joshua was showing everyone leading up to the draft. Taking a shot on him meant passing on safer picks who were better athletes with better work ethics and that took some courage even if it was a 5th round pick. Joshua Roy was a blind shot in the dark that year for whoever selected him and clearly nobody was willing to throw that dart until pick #150 and there is no telling how much further he falls if the Habs don't take him.

Even Sean Day who was granted exceptional status and was huge and could skate like the wind fell to the 3rd round due to attitude and work ethic questions and he turned out to be a bust.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

Team Canada's celebration song after beating the U.S.A and Czechia.......

Wa Wa Wa Wa Hey Hey-ey Goodbye!

 

[JianYang]

That is a terrible take.

Roy was grossly out of shape, with a poor work ethic and had already forced a trade. He was viewed league wide as a slow, lazy diva but Montreal was still willing to take a chance on him. Go ahead and **** on them for missing on high picks but to do exactly the same for hitting on late picks is as disingenuous as it gets. Roy was passed over 149 times by the best scouts in the world.......149 times. You could hardly blame Timmins and company if they passed on him for the 150th time but they didn't and they deserve credit for that whether you want to give it or not.

It is very common for top Bantam players who go at the top of their respective CHL priority drafts to never make the NHL and Joshua certainly looked like he was going down that well worn road leading up to the draft. Poor skating and poor work ethic is what usually derails top Bantam players and that is exactly what Joshua was showing everyone leading up to the draft. Taking a shot on him meant passing on safer picks who were better athletes with better work ethics and that took some courage even if it was a 5th round pick. Joshua Roy was a blind shot in the dark that year for whoever selected him and clearly nobody was willing to throw that dart until pick #150 and there is no telling how much further he falls if the Habs don't take him.

Even Sean Day who was granted exceptional status and was huge and could skate like the wind fell to the 3rd round due to attitude and work ethic questions and he turned out to be a bust.

Its like he's saying the Habs only deserve credit if he went in the first two rounds or something.

First of all, why would the Habs draft him so high if they already know that other teams aren't taking him that high? That would be a waste.

 

[jfm133]

He was not viewed league wide as a slow lazy diva because Sherbrooke gave three first and a secound round picks to acquire him and Saint_John asked that much to trade him. You don't give that much if you think a 17 years old player is a slow lazy diva. How come a 17 years old can be a diva? This is crazy. So only that discredit the rest of what is really the terrible take here. The NHL scouts were all wrong on Roy. It was stupid to let him fall that low, scouting malpractice. We talk about a 17 years old player here. Also, all first overall in the Q are not equal, same in the NHL. So it is terrible to not understand that.

That is a terrible take.

Roy was grossly out of shape, with a poor work ethic and had already forced a trade. He was viewed league wide as a slow, lazy diva but Montreal was still willing to take a chance on him. Go ahead and **** on them for missing on high picks but to do exactly the same for hitting on late picks is as disingenuous as it gets. Roy was passed over 149 times by the best scouts in the world.......149 times. You could hardly blame Timmins and company if they passed on him for the 150th time but they didn't and they deserve credit for that whether you want to give it or not.

It is very common for top Bantam players who go at the top of their respective CHL priority drafts to never make the NHL and Joshua certainly looked like he was going down that well worn road leading up to the draft. Poor skating and poor work ethic is what usually derails top Bantam players and that is exactly what Joshua was showing everyone leading up to the draft. Taking a shot on him meant passing on safer picks who were better athletes with better work ethics and that took some courage even if it was a 5th round pick. Joshua Roy was a blind shot in the dark that year for whoever selected him and clearly nobody was willing to throw that dart until pick #150 and there is no telling how much further he falls if the Habs don't take him.

Even Sean Day who was granted exceptional status and was huge and could skate like the wind fell to the 3rd round due to attitude and work ethic questions and he turned out to be a bust.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

He was not viewed league wide as a slow lazy diva because Sherbrooke gave three first and a secound round picks to acquire him and Saint_John asked that much to trade him. You don't give that much if you think a 17 years old player is a slow lazy diva. How come a 17 years old can be a diva? This is crazy. So only that discredit the rest of what is really the terrible take here. The NHL scouts were all wrong on Roy. It was stupid to let him fall that low, scouting malpractice. We talk about a 17 years old player here. Also, all first overall in the Q are not equal, same in the NHL. So it is terrible to not understand that.

You are confusing/conflating junior teams who are trying to acquire a kid who can score at the junior level with NHL teams looking for projectable skills and habits that are conducive to success in the NHL. NHL scouts know that most top junior scorers bust as NHL prospects.........there is no linear correlation between value as a junior player and being an NHL prospect. There are also so many behind the scenes variables that you nor I have any idea about that greatly influence the decisions of junior teams and NHL teams.

It is 100% a well known fact that Roy was a poor skater and badly out of shape and demanded a trade which led to rampid speculation that he had a poor attitude and was an immature diva. If you believe that NHL scouts who were aware of the fact that he was a 1st overall priority selection and believed that he was a good skater with a good attitude yet just chose not to select him because they are incompetent then I don't know what to tell you other than the fact that you are so egregiously delusional that there is no point in continuing this absurd conversation.

Joshua Roy is a great story of a kid who learned from his mistakes and worked his *** off to better himself after he was drafted, that is the truth and the only story to be told. Your version of incompetent scouting by all 31 teams passing 149 times on a prodigy without any glaring flaws has zero credibility and does not belong in rational discourse.

 

[jfm133]

There is no conversation when one is insulting the other from the beginning. Also, worth noting that you started in your first message by describing Roy as a slow lazy diva and after I showed how ridiculous it was, you are now describing him as slow lazy diva that could score at the junior level. That does not make sense at all. When he was traded Roy was not as star player in the Q, but Sherbrooke saw the potential and the possiblity to allow it to bloom. That's what player evaluation is all about with 17 years old kids.

The new management selected Lane Hutson at the end of the second in 2022. Don't tell me you think Hustson can become an elite D at the NHL level at 5'09", 160 lbs. If he stays that small he will never be a good complete D at the NHL level. But HuGo took that bet because the kid has talent and the risk/reward is worth it. He was drafte at 5'08" and they are betting that he will grow to at least 5'10". It was the same for Roy but not about his size.. The talent was there and it was foolish to think he could not improve on his weaknesses. If Hutson's final size is what we see now, 5'09", 160 lbs, there is nothing he can do about that. Speed, training, eating habits, attitude, these are all stuff that can be improved, especially when you are immature at only 17.

If Roy did not improve on any of his weaknesses post draft, he would not have been productive as he had for Sherbrooke. So it's foolish to say that Sherbrooke gave three first and a second round picks to acquire a slow lazy diva that would be great in juniors and only in juniors. They paid that high price because they tought they would be able to correct the course with Roy and that growing older would also help him to behave with more maturity.

So again, all your BS does not make sense. If you think picking Trudeau, Sobolev and Kostenko ahead of him was the good way to go, then it says it all. I would like to see all the complaing and the Bergevin/Timmins bashing we would have here if another team would haved picked Roy around #145, just ahead of the Habs. We would hear again and again that they had six chances to take him and passed on all of them. Also, there is no way they could know Roy would still be there at #150. They benefited from the scouting malpractice from the whole league about Roy. At some point, somebody would end up picking the slow and lazy diva and the Habs were the lucky winners. That's the real story.

You are confusing/conflating junior teams who are trying to acquire a kid who can score at the junior level with NHL teams looking for predictable skills and habits that are conducive to success in the NHL. NHL scouts know that most top junior scorers bust as NHL prospects.........there is no linear correlation between value as a junior player and being an NHL prospect. There are also so many behind the scenes variables that you nor I have any idea about that greatly influence the decisions of junior teams and NHL teams.

It is 100% a well known fact that Roy was a poor skater and badly out of shape and demanded a trade which led to rampid speculation that he had a poor attitude and was an immature diva. If you believe that NHL scouts who were aware of the fact that he was a 1st overall priority selection and believed that he was a good skater with a good attitude yet just chose not to select him because they are incompetent then I don't know what to tell you other than the fact that you are so egregiously delusional that there is no point in continuing this absurd conversation.

Joshua Roy is a great story of a kid who learned from his mistakes and worked his *** off to better himself after he was drafted, that is the truth and the only story to be told. Your version of incompetent scouting by all 31 teams passing 149 times on a prodigy without any glaring flaws has zero credibility and does not belong in rational discourse.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

There is no conversation when one is insulting the other from the beginning. Also, worth noting that you started in your first message by describing Roy as a slow lazy diva and after I showed how ridiculous it was, you are now describing him as slow lazy diva that could score at the junior level. That does not make sense at all. When he was traded Roy was not as star player in the Q, but Sherbrooke saw the potential and the possiblity to allow it to bloom. That's what player evaluation is all about with 17 years old kids.

The new management selected Lane Hutson at the end of the second in 2022. Don't tell me you think Hustson can become an elite D at the NHL level at 5'09", 160 lbs. If he stays that small he will never be a good complete D at the NHL level. But HuGo took that bet because the kid has talent and the risk/reward is worth it. He was drafte at 5'08" and they are betting that he will grow to at least 5'10". It was the same for Roy but not about his size.. The talent was there and it was foolish to think he could not improve on his weaknesses. If Hutson's final size is what we see now, 5'09", 160 lbs, there is nothing he can do about that. Speed, training, eating habits, attitude, these are all stuff that can be improved, especially when you are immature at only 17.

If Roy did not improve on any of his weaknesses post draft, he would not have been productive as he had for Sherbrooke. So it's foolish to say that Sherbrooke gave three first and a second round picks to acquire a slow lazy diva that would be great in juniors and only in juniors. They paid that high price because they tought they would be able to correct the course with Roy and that growing older would also help him to behave with more maturity.

So again, all your BS does not make sense. If you think picking Trudeau, Sobolev and Kostenko ahead of him was the good way to go, then it says it all. I would like to see all the complaing and the Bergevin/Timmins bashing we would have here if another team would haved picked Roy around #145, just ahead of the Habs. We would hear again and again that they had six chances to take him and passed on all of them. Also, there is no way they could know Roy would still be there at #150. They benefited from the scouting malpractice from the whole league about Roy. At some point, somebody would end up picking the slow and lazy diva and the Habs were the lucky winners. That's the real story.

You should quit while you are so far behind lol.

You simply do not make any sense .

 

[DAChampion]

There is no conversation when one is insulting the other from the beginning. Also, worth noting that you started in your first message by describing Roy as a slow lazy diva and after I showed how ridiculous it was, you are now describing him as slow lazy diva that could score at the junior level. That does not make sense at all. When he was traded Roy was not as star player in the Q, but Sherbrooke saw the potential and the possiblity to allow it to bloom. That's what player evaluation is all about with 17 years old kids.

The new management selected Lane Hutson at the end of the second in 2022. Don't tell me you think Hustson can become an elite D at the NHL level at 5'09", 160 lbs. If he stays that small he will never be a good complete D at the NHL level. But HuGo took that bet because the kid has talent and the risk/reward is worth it. He was drafte at 5'08" and they are betting that he will grow to at least 5'10". It was the same for Roy but not about his size.. The talent was there and it was foolish to think he could not improve on his weaknesses. If Hutson's final size is what we see now, 5'09", 160 lbs, there is nothing he can do about that. Speed, training, eating habits, attitude, these are all stuff that can be improved, especially when you are immature at only 17.

If Roy did not improve on any of his weaknesses post draft, he would not have been productive as he had for Sherbrooke. So it's foolish to say that Sherbrooke gave three first and a second round picks to acquire a slow lazy diva that would be great in juniors and only in juniors. They paid that high price because they tought they would be able to correct the course with Roy and that growing older would also help him to behave with more maturity.

So again, all your BS does not make sense. If you think picking Trudeau, Sobolev and Kostenko ahead of him was the good way to go, then it says it all. I would like to see all the complaing and the Bergevin/Timmins bashing we would have here if another team would haved picked Roy around #145, just ahead of the Habs. We would hear again and again that they had six chances to take him and passed on all of them. Also, there is no way they could know Roy would still be there at #150. They benefited from the scouting malpractice from the whole league about Roy. At some point, somebody would end up picking the slow and lazy diva and the Habs were the lucky winners. That's the real story.

Prediction of complex processes is an inexact science. A simpler example than people is the weather. You might have several different weather models predicting rain 8 days in advance. If there ends up being no rain it doesn't mean that all of the weather models are trash.

 

[CHwest]

He was not viewed league wide as a slow lazy diva because Sherbrooke gave three first and a secound round picks to acquire him and Saint_John asked that much to trade him. You don't give that much if you think a 17 years old player is a slow lazy diva. How come a 17 years old can be a diva? This is crazy. So only that discredit the rest of what is really the terrible take here. The NHL scouts were all wrong on Roy. It was stupid to let him fall that low, scouting malpractice. We talk about a 17 years old player here. Also, all first overall in the Q are not equal, same in the NHL. So it is terrible to not understand that.

Your argument is based on this. It's ridiculous. Scouts weren't crazy about him, end of story.

 

[HuGort]

Way Roy played with Bedard he is likely first line material. Especially with Caufield. He made some good plays to set up Badard. Roy can keep up with speedy Bedard. So, Suzuki line good spot for him. Also allows Dach to center 2nd line

 

[Matthew McConaughay]

Is Roy injured? how come he's still not playing with Sherbrooke ?

 

[jfm133]

Because their last game was Sunday against a weak team. He did not play, same for Hinds, Spacek and Brabenec. He should play tomorow.

Is Roy injured? how come he's still not playing with Sherbrooke ?

 

[Matthew McConaughay]

One goal and 3 assists for Roy tonight, he's back.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

One goal and 3 assists for Roy tonight, he's back.

He sucks. I bet his Goals Against Average is horrible. And he hasn't scored a single touchdown all year.

 

[Kojo]

He sucks. I bet his Goals Against Average is horrible. And he hasn't scored a single touchdown all year.

What?

Anyways, Roy looked so good out there tonight.

 

[Scriptor]

What?

Anyways, Roy looked so good out there tonight.

Patrick Roy (GAA) and I assume there is a Roy that plays football.

 

[BaseballCoach]

Way Roy played with Bedard he is likely first line material. Especially with Caufield. He made some good plays to set up Badard. Roy can keep up with speedy Bedard. So, Suzuki line good spot for him. Also allows Dach to center 2nd line

Roy and Farrell open up a lot of potential combinations with Suzuki, Caufield, Slafkovsky, Dach, Monahan if we can re-sign him, our 2023 first pick, and a Dubois or other legit 2C via trade/UFA (we have the cash to do it). Nine top 6ers is a real contender.

 

[Scriptor]

Roy and Farrell open up a lot of potential combinations with Suzuki, Caufield, Slafkovsky, Dach, Monahan if we can re-sign him, our 2023 first pick, and a Dubois or other legit 2C via trade/UFA (we have the cash to do it). Nine top 6ers is a real contender.

Again, the key to a solid forward nucleus, as always, is the C-line. If, after years of not even having two top-6 Cs, we can somehow reach a point where we have 4 natural Cs with top-6 skills (at C or W) on our top two-lines, we will be sitting pretty going forward.

We currently see that Dach is presently the best match with Suzuki and Caufield on the first line and the reasoning behind that is pretty simple, supported cleanly by the stats.

With Dach, who falls back defensively to cover those assignments in the D-zone as a C, the Suzuki line jumps from low 40s to mid 50s in percentage of shots controlled, scoring opportunities Vs opponents and puck possession jumps up. Even if Slafkovsky were to be a beast in puck possession on a line with Caufield and Suzuki, for example, he could not give Suzuki the latitude that a natural C playing ion the wing can, as he can cover the pivot's role by falling back first in defensive assignments for the D-zone.

His ability to handle defensive assignments early in our zone frees up Suzuki to create offensively. As a winger, a natural C can ease in and out of those assignments in support of the line's pivot.

Dubois, for example, on a line with Bedard, Fantilli, Carlsson or Dvorsky, could do the same thing, allowing Fantilli or Carlsson to play deeper in the O-zone (net front presence?) and limiting the need for them to fall back as quickly when puck possession changes hands between teams.

Having four natural Cs in the top-6 also guarantees a top-6 C for the top-6 even if the injury bug hits us hard. Suzuki and Bedardf/Fantilli/Carlsson/Dvorsky, could go down, for example and we would still have Dubois and Dach as Cs to hold the fort.

Then, we'd have Caufield and Slafkovsky as top-6 wingers and the potential to find two other top 6 wingers for the third line amongst, Farrell, Roy, Mesar and Heineman. If two of those end up top-6 quality wingers and play on an exploitation, offensive third line (with Beck at C, maybe) instead of the top-6, we are swimming in offensive talent and sitting in the driver's seat.

Depending on the quality of the 2023 draft and the development of the prospects already in the system and showing really well at their respective levels for the moment, we could be really blessed for the future. Adding Dubois to the mix would only raise the level of compete one notch higher and we could be a contender again, IMO, within four years, five at the latest.

Suzuki would be in his prime at 27, 28 and Caufield would be mind-blowing by then at only 26, 27. There would be a window of about two years before needing to re-sign Suzuki, three years before needing to re-sign Caufield and Dubois and three years before needing to re-sign the 2023 draft class and other notables like Farrell, Roy, Mesar and Heineman.

Then, there's the D, but that's another story entirely.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Roy and Farrell open up a lot of potential combinations with Suzuki, Caufield, Slafkovsky, Dach, Monahan if we can re-sign him, our 2023 first pick, and a Dubois or other legit 2C via trade/UFA (we have the cash to do it). Nine top 6ers is a real contender.

Monahan's getting traded dude, you need to get off that horse.. it's dying

 

[DAChampion]

Monahan's getting traded dude, you need to get off that horse.. it's dying

I don't see how you know that for sure.

 

[WeThreeKings]

I don't see how you know that for sure.

He was acquired to be traded. Every media member who has even brushed elbows with Hughes and Gorton have qualified in every article that he will be traded. Hughes and Gorton every time they speak continue to fortify that they have a rebuild plan that they will stick to regardless of any short term periods of success.

They're not going to extend an injury prone Monahan.

 

[BaseballCoach]

Monahan's getting traded dude, you need to get off that horse.. it's dying

If Monahan is traded, then we probably have the assets to acquire a similar player. My point is that Farrell and Roy as 2-way players open up lots of combinations.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Way Roy played with Bedard he is likely first line material. Especially with Caufield. He made some good plays to set up Badard. Roy can keep up with speedy Bedard. So, Suzuki line good spot for him. Also allows Dach to center 2nd line

I would peg Roy as someone who can play anywhere in the top 9 depending on team needs. He's clever and he just seems to produce everywhere he goes. Both Roy and Kidney had great seasons last year and this year but heading into rookie camp last season, Roy stood out and Kidney struggled.

I'd still would like to see Roy improve skating. It's not terrible but you need every advantage you can get in the NHL.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Patrick Roy (GAA) and I assume there is a Roy that plays football.

Funny, I had actually forgotten about Patrick Roy when making that smart alrky remark.

Pretty cool to have gotten this kid in the 5th round or whatever. What a steal.