Prospect Info: Joshua Roy Part 2

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26Mats

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Jun 23, 2018
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Well on our way to at the very least be a Carolina type contender IMO. Pieces are there. Pieces are very similar.

Guhle as Slavin, Reinbacher as Pesce, Slaf as Svech, CC as TT, Nick as Aho, Dach as KK.

It's going to be very interesting to see what kind of team we have next year if Dach can come back healthy, and Monahan as well.

A center line of Suzuki - Dach - Monahan is quite a backbone.
 
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Kimota

ROY DU NORD!!!
Nov 4, 2005
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Hudon might be harsh. Maybe the Scherbak highway is better?

Well, whatever, my point is easily understandable.

Roy to me is a player who still plays the game in a juniorish fashion, who has dubious athleticism and im not sure about his commitment level.

Next training camp there will be Beck, Mesar pushing. Maybe we go on the trade market or sign someone and we probably draft top 15 this year.

Clock is ticking fast en criss for him.

People have been saying this about Roy at every levels he has played. That "it will never worked in this league" and he has always surprised people. I know it's hard to see but we should not be surprised if he doesn't make a liar out of people once he join the NHL as well.
 
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cave troll

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Oct 9, 2013
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Im not bashing anyone. Simply stating opinion and debating hockey.

Some will make it, others won't and its just fun debating and guessing no?

You are the one coping and fanboyingbody, i dont care about hockey players specifically, i care about the Montreal Canadiens and thats it.
Well, Roy used to be a 1OA in Q. Then a year passed and was named one of the biggest junior busts ever and then he turned things around, became the best Q player and won 2 WJC golds.
Yet, you dismiss him after first 17 games in pro hockey without even seeing him in NHL.
Seems the rule "give him time" applies only to one specific player who is struggling hard not to become worst 1OA bust in decades. Others are dismissed in advance or after first 2 months of pro hockey.
 

Jaynki

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Well, Roy used to be a 1OA in Q. Then a year passed and was named one of the biggest junior busts ever and then he turned things around, became the best Q player and won 2 WJC golds.
Yet, you dismiss him after first 17 games in pro hockey without even seeing him in NHL.
Seems the rule "give him time" applies only to one specific player who is struggling hard not to become worst 1OA bust in decades. Others are dismissed in advance or after first 2 months of pro hockey.

One is a NHL top six regular in his D+2.

The others haven't cracked it in his D+3 and he is not trending exactly like a future top six player.

They are operating in two very different context.

Next training camp, Roy will be competing for a spot against Mesar and Beck, on top of those with whon he competed for a spot this year. We are drafting top 15 this year again and that is gonna be another competition for Roy in future training camp.

"Give him time" is for every player , every time.

You understand that while we give time to Roy, we also give time to others who may burn him in the final lap? Whereas the other specific guy is younger and already there?
 
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Jaynki

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People have been saying this about Roy at every levels he has played. That "it will never worked in this league" and he has always surprised people. I know it's hard to see but we should not be surprised if he doesn't make a liar out of people once he joined the NHL as well.

I will happily eat crow if that happen.
 
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cave troll

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One is a NHL top six regular in his D+2.

The others haven't cracked it in his D+3 and he is not trending exactly like a future top six player.

They are operating in two very different context.

Next training camp, Roy will be competing for a spot against Mesar and Beck, on top of those with whon he competed for a spot this year. We are drafting top 15 this year again and that is gonna be another competition for Roy in future training camp.

"Give him time" is for every player , every time.

You understand that while we give time to Roy, we also give time to others who may burn him in the final lap? Whereas the other specific guy is younger and already there?
Dude, you are comparing the 1OA pick to 150th pick.
Considering the pick positions, that 1OA is underperforming big time and is one of the worst 1OA rookies and sophomores in decades considering his NHL impact and production while other is overperforming big time considering he is a 5th rounder.
Still, you think 60 games are too little to make any assumptions , but you write off somebody after 17 games in AHL in which he is the leading scorer in that team.
By writing off Roy after 17 AHL games we can assume that Farrell, Mailloux, Heineman are also written off?
Could be that Hutson who plays D+2 in NCAA is also written off? Or Mesar not even able to crack the AHL roster in D+2 even if he already played 2 seasons of senior hockey as a kid? Beck too with his 1,10 PPG in D+2 in juniors?
 

Jaynki

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Dude, you are comparing the 1OA pick to 150th pick.
Considering the pick positions, that 1OA is underperforming big time and is one of the worst 1OA rookies and sophomores in decades considering his NHL impact and production while other is overperforming big time considering he is a 5th rounder.
Still, you think 60 games are too little to make any assumptions , but you write off somebody after 17 games in AHL in which he is the leading scorer in that team.
By writing off Roy after 17 AHL games we can assume that Farrell, Mailloux, Heineman are also written off?
Could be that Hutson who plays D+2 in NCAA is also written off? Or Mesar not even able to crack the AHL roster in D+2 even if he already played 2 seasons of senior hockey as a kid? Beck too with his 1,10 PPG in D+2 in juniors?

I am not comparing anyone. You are the one bringing Slafkovsky in the conversation with Roy. Are you confused?

Yes, i also don't think Farrell, Heineman and Mailloux have great career in front of them. You think they are great prospects? You see things backward body.

Also, i am not particularly high on Mesar or Beck to be honest but so far,

Mesar D+2 > Roy D+2.

Only prospects i am high is Hutson and Reinbacher. Hutson will be an NHL regular at the end of this season and especially next season. Trust me a guy with his talent wont have time to spend in the american hockey league of desperation, ehh sorry american hockey league of development.
 

cave troll

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You're not comparing, lol?
It's you who used the argument Top six NHL-er in D+2 vs Roy in AHL while ommiting the fact you're comparing a 1OA to a 5th rounder and even more ommiting that fact that that Top6 1OA is one of the most undeprforming 1OA forwards in decades.

You're also comapring 26th OA (Mesar) vs 150 OA (Roy) with a sample of 13 games in OHL. So 13 games in OHL is enough for you to say Mesar > Roy.
In which way Mesar D+2 is better then Roy's? In PPG? Well' let's see. Mesar in 13 games 1.84 PPG. Roy in 55 games 1.8 PPG, playoffs 1.71...in the meantime WJC gold and second only to Bedard in Team Canada.

So basically, it took you 17 Roy's games is AHL to write him off and calling him "Scherbak", and it took you 13 games to write that Mesar D+2 is better.
 

26Mats

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I am not comparing anyone. You are the one bringing Slafkovsky in the conversation with Roy. Are you confused?

Yes, i also don't think Farrell, Heineman and Mailloux have great career in front of them. You think they are great prospects? You see things backward body.

Also, i am not particularly high on Mesar or Beck to be honest but so far,

Mesar D+2 > Roy D+2.

Only prospects i am high is Hutson and Reinbacher. Hutson will be an NHL regular at the end of this season and especially next season. Trust me a guy with his talent wont have time to spend in the american hockey league of desperation, ehh sorry american hockey league of development.

I think Mailloux, like Hutson, will be a good NHLer, whether as a dman or a fireard. Mailloux is such a hood skater, with a good shot and offensive instincts. He'll be able to carve out a niche for himself, eventually.
 
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Jaynki

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I think Mailloux, like Hutson, will be a good NHLer, whether as a dman or a fireard. Mailloux is such a hood skater, with a good shot and offensive instincts. He'll be able to carve out a niche for himself, eventually.

He certainly has the tools but i think he is a braindead defenseman.

I am not sure he passes Barron or Reinbacher on the depth chart at RD and at LD, we have Guhle, Matheson, Hutson and i would guess Xhekaj has the last spot because of what he brings. I doubt any of these guy is going anywhere.

Mailloux to me is a trade chip. Dubious about his value, he will have NHL games no doubt, unsure about his ultimate potential.
 

DAChampion

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May 28, 2011
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I am not comparing anyone. You are the one bringing Slafkovsky in the conversation with Roy. Are you confused?

Yes, i also don't think Farrell, Heineman and Mailloux have great career in front of them. You think they are great prospects? You see things backward body.

Also, i am not particularly high on Mesar or Beck to be honest but so far,

Mesar D+2 > Roy D+2.

Only prospects i am high is Hutson and Reinbacher. Hutson will be an NHL regular at the end of this season and especially next season. Trust me a guy with his talent wont have time to spend in the american hockey league of desperation, ehh sorry american hockey league of development.

I think that you're emotionally invested into arguing that any player that isn't an NHL regular by D+3 is a bust.
 

Mrb1p

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I am not comparing anyone. You are the one bringing Slafkovsky in the conversation with Roy. Are you confused?

Yes, i also don't think Farrell, Heineman and Mailloux have great career in front of them. You think they are great prospects? You see things backward body.

Also, i am not particularly high on Mesar or Beck to be honest but so far,

Mesar D+2 > Roy D+2.

Only prospects i am high is Hutson and Reinbacher. Hutson will be an NHL regular at the end of this season and especially next season. Trust me a guy with his talent wont have time to spend in the american hockey league of desperation, ehh sorry american hockey league of development.
Are you just trying to make inflammatory posts for attention? Mesars d2 is better than Roys d2? Roy played more games, had a better PPG on a less offensive team in a less offensive league and was a WJC standout for team canada. Roy was the best player on his team in his d+2, while Mesar is the 3rd best player.

Mesar is also small as shit and cannot shoot like Roy.

Honestly this post is ridiculous, once again, youre finding new ways to be parabolical.
 

Jaynki

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Feb 3, 2014
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I think that you're emotionally invested into arguing that any player that isn't an NHL regular by D+3 is a bust.

No, i don't even think that

Are you just trying to make inflammatory posts for attention? Mesars d2 is better than Roys d2? Roy played more games, had a better PPG on a less offensive team in a less offensive league and was a WJC standout for team canada. Roy was the best player on his team in his d+2, while Mesar is the 3rd best player.

Mesar is also small as shit and cannot shoot like Roy.

Honestly this post is ridiculous, once again, youre finding new ways to be parabolical.

Imagine going to HFBoards for attention
 

SlafySZN

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May 21, 2022
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And how would you know? At 17-18 he was playing in 2nd swiss league.
You were watching him carefuly vs Olten Thurgau, Visp...?
It's good to see that even 2 years ago Habs fans were watching him in 2nd league. Even then they already knew he's a Hab !!!

Right now he has problem dicserning between his own teammates and his opponents and also being with a puck as a last man in NZ or his own zone it's a risk.
His 17-18 years old season, was his draft year. Last season.
 

Scriptor

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Jan 1, 2014
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I will happily eat crow if that happen.
Your stance is so rigid and based strictly on D+ calculations, regardless of the player's evolution and progress on his way up to the NHL.

You must enjoy crow as an appetizer, as a main course and as a desert!

Hitting a hime run with Roy would be him living up to his selection as a 1st OA in the Q's draft, after recovering from what made him appear to be a bust early on, before he took things into his own hands and started putting in the effort, rather than coasting strictly on talent.

Roy put to use his hockey IQ and changed what was initially a purely N/S offensive game into a well-rounded, creative, all around offensive game.

He then also added strong puck retrieve and possession skills to his arsenal and, finally, had his hockey IQ contribute to a solid D-game once he focused on that part of his play.

Connor Bedard even praised Roy for the quality of his play in the WJCs.

What Roy has essentially done is learn to play a well-rounded game in order to earn the ice time that can help him produce thanks to a creative offensive game that has evolved into something dangerous during his development.

Once at the NHL level, Roy may not be a play driver, but his game has evolved to the level where he can play with the better players as a solid complement on a line, playing solid transition defence, retrieving pucks, creating offensive chances, setting up line mates and even completing scoring opportunities.

It would be a home run to see Roy emerge as a solid top-6 player after getting nabbed in the 5th round of his draft year, but a solid double if he becomes a two-way, third line player that can score 20 goals and help shut down opponents in the process, capable of covering in the top-6 in case short term injuries..

If Hughes is capable of building a lineup where Roy is forced into a third pairing role, the Habs will only be stronger for it.

Still, for now, until proven otherwise with him playing in the NHL, Roy has remaining upside as a regular top-6 player there.

Hughes would need to add two top-6 wingers before Roy gets relegated to such a third line role on the prospects' depth chart and on a competitive NHL roster.

NHL Top-9:

Caufield - Dach - Slafkovsky
XXX - Suzuki - XXX
Newhook - Beck - Roy

With such a top-9, I can see Caufield in an ideal position with size in the middle and on the other wing, both of his line mates being able playmakers. However, as with Suzuki, both would need to shoot more than they naturally do to keep opposing Ds guessing and create more space for Caufield than he already does by weaving in and out of open ice.

Hughes will also need to acquire a top end scorer who can also play defensively for Suzuki's line and a complementary, two-way winger to complete that line, however he achieves this; draft, trade, UFA market.

Acquiring wingers is always easier than Cs and 1st pairing Ds.

The third line, with Montreal hitting a solid double, both via the Newhook acquisition -- with this role better suited for him -- and Roy lining up on the RW, is an ideal complementary line. Beck's a F/O beast that aligns speed, defensive acumen and offensive upside as a creative C. Newhook aligns speed and two-way skills, able to play a solid D game and owning a genuine NHL wrist shot. Roy, although slower than the other two players, he can be complementary piece on that line as a trailer who puts his hockey IQ to user as one who lends support on the forecheck. Roy can play both sides the ice and win one on one battles for the puck that can help keep pressure in the O-zone.

I believe that we have a top-9 C-line in the making with Dach - Suzuki - Beck and can find a 4th line C better than Evans either within the system, or by acquiring a veteran presence at a relatively cheap price on the UFA front.

We're still 5 years away from having a complete rebuild/lineup and being anywhere near in player development to mount charge for a long playoff run.

Plenty of time to acquire, develop and complete our line up, given that timeline.

On D, while I certainly don't believe that all prospects reach their projected ceilings, I think we have too many prospects or young NHLers with high ceilings on the backend not to end up with a solid (if not impressive) top-4 in 5 years from amongst Guhle, Reinbacher, Hutson, Mailloux, Barron, Engstrom, Xhekaj, Struble and Konyushlin.

A veteran like Matheson would better serve as trade ammo (along with prospectsor draft picks) to acquire a top-6 winger. As a 29 year old, now, he would already be a 33-year old when we become early contenders. Plus, along the way he'd likely block Guhle and Hutson's development at the NHL level.

That's it in a nutshell, I think, without falling into this D+ trap where everything is a cookie cutter analysis.
 

Jaynki

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Feb 3, 2014
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Your stance is so rigid and based strictly on D+ calculations, regardless of the player's evolution and progress on his way up to the NHL.

You must enjoy crow as an appetizer, as a main course and as a desert!

Hitting a hime run with Roy would be him living up to his selection as a 1st OA in the Q's draft, after recovering from what made him appear to be a bust early on, before he took things into his own hands and started putting in the effort, rather than coasting strictly on talent.

Roy put to use his hockey IQ and changed what was initially a purely N/S offensive game into a well-rounded, creative, all around offensive game.

He then also added strong puck retrieve and possession skills to his arsenal and, finally, had his hockey IQ contribute to a solid D-game once he focused on that part of his play.

Connor Bedard even praised Roy for the quality of his play in the WJCs.

What Roy has essentially done is learn to play a well-rounded game in order to earn the ice time that can help him produce thanks to a creative offensive game that has evolved into something dangerous during his development.

Once at the NHL level, Roy may not be a play driver, but his game has evolved to the level where he can play with the better players as a solid complement on a line, playing solid transition defence, retrieving pucks, creating offensive chances, setting up line mates and even completing scoring opportunities.

It would be a home run to see Roy emerge as a solid top-6 player after getting nabbed in the 5th round of his draft year, but a solid double if he becomes a two-way, third line player that can score 20 goals and help shut down opponents in the process, capable of covering in the top-6 in case short term injuries..

If Hughes is capable of building a lineup where Roy is forced into a third pairing role, the Habs will only be stronger for it.

Still, for now, until proven otherwise with him playing in the NHL, Roy has remaining upside as a regular top-6 player there.

Hughes would need to add two top-6 wingers before Roy gets relegated to such a third line role on the prospects' depth chart and on a competitive NHL roster.

NHL Top-9:

Caufield - Dach - Slafkovsky
XXX - Suzuki - XXX
Newhook - Beck - Roy

With such a top-9, I can see Caufield in an ideal position with size in the middle and on the other wing, both of his line mates being able playmakers. However, as with Suzuki, both would need to shoot more than they naturally do to keep opposing Ds guessing and create more space for Caufield than he already does by weaving in and out of open ice.

Hughes will also need to acquire a top end scorer who can also play defensively for Suzuki's line and a complementary, two-way winger to complete that line, however he achieves this; draft, trade, UFA market.

Acquiring wingers is always easier than Cs and 1st pairing Ds.

The third line, with Montreal hitting a solid double, both via the Newhook acquisition -- with this role better suited for him -- and Roy lining up on the RW, is an ideal complementary line. Beck's a F/O beast that aligns speed, defensive acumen and offensive upside as a creative C. Newhook aligns speed and two-way skills, able to play a solid D game and owning a genuine NHL wrist shot. Roy, although slower than the other two players, he can be complementary piece on that line as a trailer who puts his hockey IQ to user as one who lends support on the forecheck. Roy can play both sides the ice and win one on one battles for the puck that can help keep pressure in the O-zone.

I believe that we have a top-9 C-line in the making with Dach - Suzuki - Beck and can find a 4th line C better than Evans either within the system, or by acquiring a veteran presence at a relatively cheap price on the UFA front.

We're still 5 years away from having a complete rebuild/lineup and being anywhere near in player development to mount charge for a long playoff run.

Plenty of time to acquire, develop and complete our line up, given that timeline.

On D, while I certainly don't believe that all prospects reach their projected ceilings, I think we have too many prospects or young NHLers with high ceilings on the backend not to end up with a solid (if not impressive) top-4 in 5 years from amongst Guhle, Reinbacher, Hutson, Mailloux, Barron, Engstrom, Xhekaj, Struble and Konyushlin.

A veteran like Matheson would better serve as trade ammo (along with prospectsor draft picks) to acquire a top-6 winger. As a 29 year old, now, he would already be a 33-year old when we become early contenders. Plus, along the way he'd likely block Guhle and Hutson's development at the NHL level.

That's it in a nutshell, I think, without falling into this D+ trap where everything is a cookie cutter analysis.

Appreciate your post.

My (free) opinion is not only based on the D+X years.

Tho, Suzuki and Knies are good example of how an A prospect should enter the league after his 2 NCAA/CHL years. Roy had to came strong in camp, i don't think the organisation would have had any problem ditching one of RHP, Ylonen, Pearson for Roy, like they did with Armia, if he would have been an NHL player. He failed to came strong.

It will be the same with Beck and Mesar next year, they will habe to come strong. And if they don't, same doubt will emerge.

I am putting my toes in the water before the fact and indeed Joshua Roy can still become a top six players there is no denying that. I would be ecstatic if that was the case and like you quoted, i would happily eat crow as an appetizer, main meal and dessert.

But, personally i don't appreciate his effort level and his attitude. Nice offensive flashes, but i am dubious about his commitment both from what i saw and from worthless rumors emerging from St. Georges de Beauce.

I don't know if he will be called up this season. If he is, he will have to make the most of this opportunity because next training camp, there will be stronger competition for him than there was this year, especially if Hughes goes on the trade/fa market. Next season is probably the cookie-cutter for him in our organisation.

And before being told that i am rigid, Roy is the only forward in Laval i consider have a future with Montreal, although dubious.
 

cave troll

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Oct 9, 2013
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But, personally i don't appreciate his effort level and his attitude. Nice offensive flashes, but i am dubious about his commitment both from what i saw and from worthless rumors emerging from St. Georges de Beauce.
.
Yep. If you were Canada U-20 coach this lazy bum with attitude issues would never see WJC.
 

JianYang

Registered User
Sep 29, 2017
19,122
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Went against the crowd on Slaf.

Going against the crowd here again.

He is not a future top six fixture. He is on the Charles Hudon highway at full speed.

I will happily eat crow in due time

Charles Hudon? That's pretty extreme.

Slaf will probably be a full time nhler at the very least. I mean, I hope he turns into more, but I think a more reasonable floor is dainius zubrus.
 

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