Prospect Info: Joshua Roy Part 2

[BaseballCoach]

I'm a firm believer in bringing up a player in the role you want him to play. Good enough for Caufield but not for Roy?

OK but 99% of hockey teams do not do that. The reason is that there are usually better players on the team who will resent a rookie being gifted top-6 role over them. The alternative is keeping a guy who should be playing on the third line on the 5th or 6th line for possibly forever.

Saku Koivu despite coming to the Habs in his D+3 after two extra years in Finland played his entire rookie season on the third line. He still made a mark.

Nick Suzuki started his NHL career in his D+3 (age 20) as 4th line RW. He earned his way up to alternating between 2RW and 3C by the end of the year.

Steve Shutt played a whole season as 4LW, scoring just 8 in his rookie season after being a 4OA pick and potting 133 goals his final 2 Junior seasons. He reached the top-6 in his third season.

I could go on and on. Guy Lafleur was the 3RW for most of his rookie season and only made the top line in his 4th year.

Your firm belief is at odds with what most teams do.

 

[jfm133]

What are you talking about? Julien won the cup with Boston. A coach can only be as good as his roster is. As much as some praised MSL as some kind of coaching genius since hired by the Habs. Look at his record. It's bad because his roster is not good. The last game was awful, the team was not ready to perform. Any other coach would have been heavily criticized, but Saint-Louis still has a special status with journalists because he his a former star player.

For a short while i thought you were talking about Claude Julien and i was like NO

 

[Rapala]

OK but 99% of hockey teams do not do that. The reason is that there are usually better oplayers on the teamn who will resent a rookie being gifted top-6 role over them. The alternaiutve is keepoing a guy who shoyuld be olayiubjg on thge third line on the 5th or 6th line for possibly forever.

Saku Koivu despite coming to the Habs in his D+3 after two extra years in Finland played ihs entire rookie season on the third line. He still made a mark.

Nick Suzuki started his NHL career in his D+3 (age 20) as 4th line RW. He earned his way up to alternating between 2RW and 3C by the end of the year.

Steve Shutt played a whole season as 4LW, scoring just 8 in his rookie season after being a 4OA pick and pogting 133 goasls his final 2 Junior seasons. He reached the top-6 in his third season.

I could go on and on. Guy Lafleur was the 3RW for most of his rookie season and only made the top line in his 4th year.

Your firm belief is at odds with what most teams do.

Steve Shutt LOLOLOLOL
The context of who actually is in place please. Roy is far more suited to the top 6 than RHP.
Let's compare our team to a dynasty when talking call ups.

 

[Wateredgarden]

For a short while i thought you were talking about Claude Julien and i was like NO

Claude Julien has been the best coach in the NHL at least two seasons.

 

[Nevins]

https://x.com/NHLRankKing/status/1715713367699022328?s=20

https://x.com/NHLRankKing/status/1715713367699022328?s=20

A man named Mason Black, who created PNHLe, an application that allows you to determine the projection of a prospect in the NHL, placed the Canadian's hope ahead of Matvei Michkov in his ranking, no less. Roy is, according to Black, who considers himself the ranking, at the top of the list of prospects.

 

[montreal]

posters were asking why the AHL site didn't have him listed as a rookie, it's been fixed now. Can't say I remember the last time I looked up the AHL top scorers page and #1 and 2 were our players.

 

[JeffreyLFC]

People forget that Caufield also started in the AHL and he was also sent down the following year. It's not like they put Caufield on the first line instantly. Roy can learn in the AHL and if continue like that, it won't be long before he get called up.

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

Roy is exactly the kind of player to make the PP scoring goals.
Whatever scoring or passing, creating good scoring chances.

 

[Sorinth]

People forget that Caufield also started in the AHL and he was also sent down the following year. It's not like they put Caufield on the first line instantly. Roy can learn in the AHL and if continue like that, it won't be long before he get called up.

I mean he played 2 games in the AHL and then his first game was on a line with Tatar and Danault. It's about as close to instant as you can get without techincally being instant.

 

[BaseballCoach]

I mean he played 2 games in the AHL and then his first game was on a line with Tatar and Danault. It's about as close to instant as you can get without techincally being instant.

Cup of coffee, at a time when Gallagher was hurt. He did not stay on that oline and his ice time dropped in the following 4 games. Fact is, Caufield was healthy scratched the first two playoff games. No goals until his 10th playoff game.

Farrell also got some games on the third line last year. Even if Sean plays on a top 6 line in Laval and even if he scores 1 ppg, you can bet he will not start his next NHL stint on a top 6 line.

 

[Spearmint Rhino]

Not sure why people say there’s no opening in the Top 6 when half of them aren’t top 6 players. Bring him up to play first line and let him take a run at the Calder

 

[Habs4Life]

Not sure why people say there’s no opening in the Top 6 when half of them aren’t top 6 players. Bring him up to play first line and let him take a run at the Calder

No need to rush him. Let him dominate the ahl gain confidence. We are in a rebuild mode anyways.

 

[Spearmint Rhino]

No need to rush him. Let him dominate the ahl gain confidence. We are in a rebuild mode anyways.

We’ve rushed 18 yr olds that weren’t close to being ready. Roy is 20, dominated juniors last 2 years and is dominating the AHL, confidence isn’t a problem and we have several options to get him into the top 6

 

[ReHabs]

We’ve rushed 18 yr olds that weren’t close to being ready. Roy is 20, dominated juniors last 2 years and is dominating the AHL, confidence isn’t a problem and we have several options to get him into the top 6

It's his first season of professional adult hockey. He doesn't need to be thrown into the NHL. Training Camp just ended not even a month ago and he didn't earn a spot on this roster. Let him cook. There is absolutely nothing wrong with giving him, a rookie pro hockey player, more than 5 games in the AHL before he's called up.

 

[Spearmint Rhino]

It's his first season of professional adult hockey. He doesn't need to be thrown into the AHL. Training Camp just endd not even a month ago and he didn't earn a spot on this roster. Let him cook. There is absolutely nothing wrong with giving him, a rookie pro hockey player, more than 5 games in the AHL before he's called up.

Saying he didn’t earn a spot is not really accurate. He wasn’t a vet and didn’t need to go on waivers so was an easy choice to send down. He’s obviously gone down with the right attitude and lighting it up to show them where he belongs.

 

[NotProkofievian]

It's his first season of professional adult hockey. He doesn't need to be thrown into the NHL. Training Camp just ended not even a month ago and he didn't earn a spot on this roster. Let him cook. There is absolutely nothing wrong with giving him, a rookie pro hockey player, more than 5 games in the AHL before he's called up.

I like what the habs are doing with Roy. They sent him down to the AHL with a job to do, and he's doing it. When he removes any and all doubt that he is NHL ready, he will be promoted. When he makes the show, and I say when not if, he will know that he earned it. This is how it ought to work.

 

[ReHabs]

Saying he didn’t earn a spot is not really accurate. He wasn’t a vet and didn’t need to go on waivers so was an easy choice to send down. He’s obviously gone down with the right attitude and lighting it up to show them where he belongs.

You have to bust down the doors as a rookie, it's just how it works. The Habs roster is as weak as it gets and Roy, being a rookie, couldn't secure his place out of training camp. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that -- he is earning another look with his performances in the AHL. As @NotProkofievian says, this is how it ought to work.

In the summer I said, based on a gut feeling, that Roy will be a positive factor for the Habs in the coming year. I have zero insight or prediction capacity but I felt like his performances in the Q weren't just the result of abusing bad Q defensive players. At the WJs he showed he could keep up with better ranked prospects. There's something there for sure. I think we're all eager to see him achieve better things.

 

[Doc McKenna]

We’ve rushed 18 yr olds that weren’t close to being ready. Roy is 20, dominated juniors last 2 years and is dominating the AHL, confidence isn’t a problem and we have several options to get him into the top 6

Yeah like not playing armia. I saw gally scored but missed the game. Did a puck get caught in his jersey and someone shovelled him into the net?

 

[ReHabs]

Yeah like not playing armia. I saw gally scored but missed the game. Did a puck get caught in his jersey and someone shovelled him into the net?

He barrelled into the net as the F3 and smashed it in. More bowling ball Gallagher, like old times. (Not a sustainable way to play in the NHL, as we've learned).

 

[BaseballCoach]

Steve Shutt LOLOLOLOL
The context of who actually is in place please. Roy is far more suited to the top 6 than RHP.
Let's compare our team to a dynasty when talking call ups.

Seriously? You ignore all of the examples I gave because I included Shutt whose rookie season by the way came after a first round exit? And there are people who 'liked' that non-answer?

What about Koivu, who joined up after missing the playoffs, or Suzuki, same circumstance?

Then you try to claim that Roy is better suited to the top 6 than RHP. OK, maybe, but he still might not be ahead of all these guys on the first day he comes up:
Suzuki-Caufield-Dach-Monahan-Newhook-Anderson

Furthermore, even if Roy sneaks in as #6 because he is already better than Anderson and Slaf and Pearson and RHP in your mind, that hardly makes it a RULE like you and others wanted to make it - that a player must rot in the minors if he is not ready for a top-6 role the day he is called up. Third line = not good, beneath the player. I once had a 12 year old tell me that "I'm not playing right field, it's a stupid position" after he made an Intercity team when in the past he played shortstop in house league. Brilliant - he got to play bench instead.

How about instead of twisting yourself into a pretzel to avoid ever admitting you made a (gasp) overly zealous claim, you just admit that a third line role with say a Monahan or Dach or Newhook at C is worthy of most rookies' entitled eminence. Or that playing with Jake Evans, while maybe just a stepping stone, won't kill him. Cheese is Price.

By the way, I really like Joshua Roy and think he is our best winger prospect. But enough is enough. The AHL is not the NHL, and thousands have lived the difference and had to adjust to the best league in the world before seeing their roles grow.

 

[Hins77]

Not saying he's as good but Roy gives me Kucherov vibes. Very stealthy and knows how to find open spots with ease. May not be the most visible by the eye test but will show up on the score sheet. If he improves his skating......look out.

Same, If he reach the roof, we could have a Kucherov between our hands. And I think his floor is somebody like David Perron. A player like David Perron could also be a good thing

 

[DAChampion]

It will be something if Joshua Roy actually outproduces Shane Wright this year. The latter has 1 point in 2 AHL games, as his team has only played two games.

With respect to Nikita Kucherov, he like Roy played in the AHL in his D+3 season, he had 13 goals and 24 points in 17 games. One year later he was a good NHL player, and two years after that he was a PPG player.

 

[Vachon23]

Same, If he reach the roof, we could have a Kucherov between our hands. And I think his floor is somebody like David Perron. A player like David Perron could also be a good thing

Perron is a good comparaison but it’s not his floor. I would be extremely happy if he become as good as Perron

 

[MasterD]

OK but 99% of hockey teams do not do that. The reason is that there are usually better players on the team who will resent a rookie being gifted top-6 role over them. The alternative is keeping a guy who should be playing on the third line on the 5th or 6th line for possibly forever.

Saku Koivu despite coming to the Habs in his D+3 after two extra years in Finland played his entire rookie season on the third line. He still made a mark.

Nick Suzuki started his NHL career in his D+3 (age 20) as 4th line RW. He earned his way up to alternating between 2RW and 3C by the end of the year.

Steve Shutt played a whole season as 4LW, scoring just 8 in his rookie season after being a 4OA pick and potting 133 goals his final 2 Junior seasons. He reached the top-6 in his third season.

I could go on and on. Guy Lafleur was the 3RW for most of his rookie season and only made the top line in his 4th year.

Your firm belief is at odds with what most teams do.

Koivu came in as a center behind Damphousse and Turgeon.

Shutt came in on a team with Mahovlich x2, Lafleur, Henri Richard, Guy Lafleur, Serge Savard...

Basically you're comparing Roy joining this year's team to guys joining contending/cup winning teams with very good top 6 players. Makes 0 sense

 

[FrankMTL]

That last WJC really solidified my opinion regarding Roy. Besides all the points he scored, he was playing complete hockey that whole tournament. He was playing on the PK, on the PP, he was back checking, he was honestly everything you could want out of a top prospect and the hockey IQ was just so apparent. I mean, i'd be lying if I said I knew he's have this much success this early in the AHL, but I can't say i'm surprised either. Players like him, they just get the game. and make it seem easy.