Player Discussion Josh Norris C 6’1” - Part 2

[stempniaksen]

This narrative that DBC was not put in a position to succeed is ridiculous. He got first pp and then was put on a line with two good player with favorable matchups. He was the biggest problem on that line. He created nothing on his own. Norris is a much better player.

Good players make players around them better. DBC didn't do that. Pinto scored just as much without him.

Without getting into DBC specifically because I truly don't care anymore now that he's a Wing, this is categorically untrue. Batherson was significantly worse in almost every facet of the game and dragged down every line he was on more than DBC.

To try and turn this back to Norris, JN is going to need a much much better of Batherson (both offensively and defensively) coming off injury. I think they are going to need to rely on each other this season in all honesty to mask each others deficiencies. Maybe they both get stapled to one of Brady or Claude to start the season as babysitters.

 

[HSF]

Straw man? Your argument was awful and I simply pointed it out then gave a tangible example. Reinhart produces with Lundell and Luosterainen. There's another one. Debrincat was the problem not the linemates.

Batherson and Pinto should be more than enough if you want 8 million a year.

Pinto looks just as good with Tyler Motte as he does with Debrincat. So who's the problem? Pinto or Debrincat.

If Pinto was so good why did we constantly use other option as the 2C option in Brassard, Greig, and Patrick Brown. You aren't going far with a 35 point 2C

Batherson also admiitted he was hot garbage due to injury.

Lastly if you want a 40 goal scorer you need to play them with solid players

What does Pinto 'looking good' even mean....he put up 35 points

 

[aragorn]

If Pinto was so good why did we constantly use other option as the 2C option in Brassard, Greig, and Patrick Brown. You aren't going far with a 35 point 2C

Batherson also admiitted he was hot garbage due to injury.

Lastly if you want a 40 goal scorer you need to play them with solid players

What does Pinto 'looking good' even mean....he put up 35 points

Pinto was a 35 pt C as a rookie, he will get better for the next few yrs & I expect him to increase his pt totals each yr, however, he will need some players on his wings who can also make plays & put the puck in the net.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Pinto was a 35 pt C as a rookie, he will get better for the next few yrs & I expect him to increase his pt totals each yr, however, he will need some players on his wings who can also make plays & put the puck in the net.

Pinto is just getting started he showed a lot of parts to his game.. Playing a season at 3C will help.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

I didn't find any of the 3 particularly good this last year, but DBC was still the best of the group imo.

 

[bert]

If Pinto was so good why did we constantly use other option as the 2C option in Brassard, Greig, and Patrick Brown. You aren't going far with a 35 point 2C

Batherson also admiitted he was hot garbage due to injury.

Lastly if you want a 40 goal scorer you need to play them with solid players

What does Pinto 'looking good' even mean....he put up 35 points

Legitimate 40 goal scorers score consistently on open looks create opportunities and make players around them better. Debrincat didn't do that. Stop blaming everyone else for him not performing. Why is it on Pinto and not Debrincat?!?!?! Honestly. Debrincat did not perform. Relative to realistic expectetions and where they are on their developelment cycles. Which player actually came close to meeting their expectations at the start of the season?... The rookie who was 2nd in goals in the entire league or the 40 goal scorer who had 26 and was -31.

Shitting on Pinto and making excuses for Debrincat. You keyboard warriors are lost. Pinto also was the defensive conscious on the line. But yeah he was the problem. You probably think he is finished developing too.

 

[bert]

Pinto is just getting started he showed a lot of parts to his game.. Playing a season at 3C will help.

Or maybe with a winger that will actually finish open looks and do some dirty work out there. Maybe someone that will get in on the forcheck and create some space.

 

[Ice-Tray]

DJ mentioned that Batherson told him that he’d be willing to switch to the left side so that Tank could play the right, presumably with him and Norris.

The guys want to win, and I love that a guy like Bath is willing to offer up the switch without being asked.

 

[Cosmix]

Pinto is just getting started he showed a lot of parts to his game.. Playing a season at 3C will help.

I think Pinto is a 3C. He has not shown me enough to think he will become a 2C. I hope he does.

 

[OD99]

I think Pinto is a 3C. He has not shown me enough to think he will become a 2C. I hope he does.

Hard to tell.

He didn't excel as rookie #2 but he scored 20 goals - which is impressive for any position. He is fairly responsible defensively, has a great shot, is already good in the dot and has the size and speed to be an effective 200ft C.

He hasn't shown me he can distribute the puck well enough yet but we also know he came to competitive hockey at a fairly late age, is a great athlete and seems to have the drive to make himself better.

Of course, he needs to sign a contract and actually play...so there is that.

 

[Alf Silfversson]

I didn't find any of the 3 particularly good this last year, but DBC was still the best of the group imo.

I agree.

Batherson was listless and lazy at times last year. Pinto was a solid rookie but not far enough along in his development to be a good 2C. Not his fault; a victim of circumstance. DBC had a subpar year. Missed chances he should have buried and overthought the game at times, but he was the best player on that line. It was kind of a disaster though. It should have been broken up, but it wasn't.

 

[HSF]

DJ mentioned that Batherson told him that he’d be willing to switch to the left side so that Tank could play the right, presumably with him and Norris.

The guys want to win, and I love that a guy like Bath is willing to offer up the switch without being asked.

He doesn't want to end up on the 3rd line. Good on him for offering but he knows Giroux and Tarasenko are locks to play on the side of their choice

 

[Golden_Jet]

He doesn't want to end up on the 3rd line. Good on him for offering but he knows Giroux and Tarasenko are locks to play on the side of their choice

Bath was probably talking about second line. Norris centre and Tank on the right, is one option.

 

[HSF]

Legitimate 40 goal scorers score consistently on open looks create opportunities and make players around them better. Debrincat didn't do that. Stop blaming everyone else for him not performing. Why is it on Pinto and not Debrincat?!?!?! Honestly. Debrincat did not perform. Relative to realistic expectetions and where they are on their developelment cycles. Which player actually came close to meeting their expectations at the start of the season?... The rookie who was 2nd in goals in the entire league or the 40 goal scorer who had 26 and was -31.

Shitting on Pinto and making excuses for Debrincat. You keyboard warriors are lost. Pinto also was the defensive conscious on the line. But yeah he was the problem. You probably think he is finished developing too.

I am not shitting on Pinto. He was not a 2C last year but was forced to play it. It is what it is but that that second line really struggled without an established center.

If your center struggles in a role good luck having your wingers be their best. Hence why Norris being back is one of the most talked about improvements this offseason

Putting up 40 goals would be next to impossible without a good center and not being the top option

 

[Micklebot]

He doesn't want to end up on the 3rd line. Good on him for offering but he knows Giroux and Tarasenko are locks to play on the side of their choice

Bath struggled last year but he still outscored Tarasenko both in raw production and pace, idk if you can say Tank is a lock to play ahead of him. They'll figure out who works best where and with who, and sort out hurt feelings later imo.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Bath struggled last year but he still outscored Tarasenko both in raw production and pace, idk if you can say Tank is a lock to play ahead of him. They'll figure out who works best where and with who, and sort out hurt feelings later imo.

Yeah I think Bath was playing to his versatility and wanting the established shooter to be in his best position to score. It makes a lot of sense. There is also the welcoming side of making sure the new star vet feels like he fits in and is welcomed.

Like you said DJ will play the guys and they will see who fits best where.

 

[Micklebot]

Yeah I think Bath was playing to his versatility and wanting the established shooter to be in his best position to score. It makes a lot of sense. There is also the welcoming side of making sure the new star vet feels like he fits in and is welcomed.

Like you said DJ will play the guys and they will see who fits best where.

I still think the best solution may be to spread the wealth across three lines, prior to the Formenton situation and Norris getting hurt, I thought the same thing with last year's group, and with the addition of Kubalik and Greig, I think that strategy is potentially even more beneficial this year,

I posted this in another thread, but slot in Greig, Kubalik and Pinto in whatever arrangement you want and I personally think any of these duo's is likely to form at least an average quality top 6 caliber line

xxx-Stu-Giroux
Tkachuk-Norris-xxx
Tank-xxx -Batherson

Alternatively, any of these duos work too

Tkachuk-Stu-xxx
xxx-Stu-Tank
xxx-Norris-Giroux
xxx-Norris-Batherson
Tank-xxx-Giroux
xxx-Stu-Batherson

 

[Ice-Tray]

I still think the best solution may be to spread the wealth across three lines, prior to the Formenton situation and Norris getting hurt, I thought the same thing with last year's group, and with the addition of Kubalik and Greig, I think that strategy is potentially even more beneficial this year,

I posted this in another thread, but slot in Greig, Kubalik and Pinto in whatever arrangement you want and I personally think any of these duo's is likely to form at least an average quality top 6 caliber line

xxx-Stu-Giroux
Tkachuk-Norris-xxx
Tank-xxx -Batherson

Alternatively, any of these duos work too

Tkachuk-Stu-xxx
xxx-Stu-Tank
xxx-Norris-Giroux
xxx-Norris-Batherson
Tank-xxx-Giroux
xxx-Stu-Batherson

I think you slot Joseph with Pinto and Kubalik and give him some stability as well. He’s a forgotten player that I think has more to give with stable partners as well.

I think the top nine looks really good any way you slice it, and that’s without Grieg given a spot.

I wouldn’t mind seeing him add some scoring and D to the fourth line to start with Smegal or MacEwen on the other side of Kastelic.

 

[Micklebot]

I think you slot Joseph with Pinto and Kubalik and give him some stability as well. He’s a forgotten player that I think has more to give with stable partners as well.

I think the top nine looks really good any way you slice it, and that’s without Grieg given a spot.

I wouldn’t mind seeing him add some scoring and D to the fourth line to start with Smegal or MacEwen on the other side of Kastelic.

Don't think we can fit in Pinto extended and keep Joseph if we want to stay under the cap, I guess you could move Brannstrom instead but that would be a bit tighter.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Don't think we can fit in Pinto extended and keep Joseph if we want to stay under the cap, I guess you could move Brannstrom instead but that would be a bit tighter.

Yup, and that may be the play. Either way it will be interesting to see how it plays out.

 

[DanyHeatley]

What expectations do we have for a full season of 2C Norris?

30+g, 60-65 pts?

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

What expectations do we have for a full season of 2C Norris?

30+g, 60-65 pts?

I'd be happy with that. Guy missed a full year and the team has more talent up front so I think it'll take him time to adapt and ease back into the line up. Probably going to have a slow start, and he won't be getting quite as many big minutes as he did two seasons ago.

 

[OD99]

35+ goals and 30+ assists if he gets 82 games and #1PP time.

I would hope he can trend close to PPG next season.

His total point production needs to be measured against his overall game as well. He will good for the PK and overall play.

It is shaping up for the Senators to have 3 strong C who have the ability to put the puck in the net and be strong in all 3 zones.

 

[DanyHeatley]

we’ll have 8+ players who can crack 40+ points with two outliers in Stutzle and Tkachuk

75+
Stutzle
Tkachuk

60+
Giroux
Tarasenko
Batherson
Norris

40+
Kubalik
Chabot
Chychrun
Pinto

 

[bicboi64]

What expectations do we have for a full season of 2C Norris?

30+g, 60-65 pts?

30g30a is what I expect along with solid defensive play. Not the "step up" that I'd have expected if he played last year to build on 35g scored, but I'd be happy with him easing back into it with a solid 60pts