Player Discussion Josh Norris C 6’1” - Part 2

[Cosmix]

Because it's not about keeping the GM box warm. That does very little. It is about rebuilding the entire organization. You need someone that can come in and restructure the scouting staffs, the coaching staffs and figure out why the medical staff has allowed situations like Pinto and Norris to happen.

Bowness would still have the same people giving him advice as Dorion has.

Assen na yo!

But we need a new competent GM asap; unfortunately we have to wait until new ownership takes over.

Well, if you guys find a way to fire all the doctors, can you send them all out to BC? We need them over here

You might not want ours!

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Signing him long term was so, so stupid since we already knew the shoulder was a concern.

So much for our core. 8 million AAV down the drain.

 

[Masked]

None of the things you're talking about are happening until the sale is over. In the meantime it's damage control for a zombie gm that's able to make more potentially damaging decisions// moves that hurt us after he's gone and frankly i trust bowness' eyeballs more than dorions itchy trigger finger at this point.
Trying to be pragmatic as the wheels are coming off. Something has to budge.

I am well aware that nothing is happening until new ownership takes over. You'd replace a zombie gm with someone who has no experience as a GM? That makes little sense. If you're afraid of what Dorion might do, just don't let him do anything but trade away the guys who don't fit into next season's plans.

Assen na yo.

 

[CorrectOpinion]

Are you kidding me

 

[GCK]

This is idiotic.

"Oh the rehab didn't take so let's just let him play and potentially make the injury worse which will lead to surgery and possibly chronic long-term shoulder issues for our top center who is here for 8 years."

Good god.

Your anger with 6 years of losing blinds you to reality. Team Doctors and Josh's doctors signed off on his being ready and he has been taking contact in practice for at least a couple weeks. Josh didn't want surgery, he wanted to try rehab, it obviously didn't work. I don't see the point in assigning blame, it's almost like you think DJ put him in the lineup before the doctors and Josh felt he was ready, which is idiotic to believe could happen.

 

[coladin]

That isn't a reasonable argument. Pretend we were sitting at a table chatting. You wouldn't say that.
It's a completely different situation and different injury. How would wearing a facemask be equal to not being able to take face offs due to injury? Please don't lash out. I'm not sure why posters get so sensitive and argue against logic?
Norris could not take a face-off due to the severe risk of reinjuring his shoulder. That seems like an unreasonable position to put the kid in. If it was my son, I would have advised against it because it was simply a terrible idea. Why do you continue to gas light? Enough.

I think it is a reasonable argument. We are taking one facet of Norris game, which is faceoffs due to precautions. In the same token, Zub getting boarded , that cage will do jack shit. Or an elbow to the head, face area. My logic lies in the assumption that the cage does not make Zub immune to injury no more than Norris not taking a faceoff. I understand your point. I resent the gaslighting comment. I have no reason to , if this is what I believe in. If you think I am here to gaslight people, well, that couldn't be further from the truth

 

[Norris4Norris]

The best ability in professional sports is availability.

Josh Norris, by that definition, has been one of our worst players. Will his shoulder ever be good again? Don't know, but it looks bad, real bad.

 

[coladin]

Signing him long term was so, so stupid since we already knew the shoulder was a concern.

So much for our core. 8 million AAV down the drain.

Does a thre year contract change anything?

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Maybe SJ would consider a swap for Karlsson? Could be considered a long term piece for their rebuild.

 

[senswon]

I am well aware that nothing is happening until new ownership takes over. You'd replace a zombie gm with someone who has no experience as a GM? That makes little sense. If you're afraid of what Dorion might do, just don't let him do anything but trade away the guys who don't fit into next season's plans.

Assen na yo.

I wouldn't say an assistant GM has no experience and i don't subscribe to the idea that only someone that's done the job, can do the job. Bowness has been around long enough for a shot imo.
Dorion is talking about being a buyer at the deadline. Feeling confident he's gonna get it right THIS time?
I don't.
Fire that turkey and let young Bowness hold the reigns for 20min. The moment we hired him, it felt like he was an insurance policy to me.

 

[Big Muddy]

The new owners To Do list just got a little longer.

Add the following task: Identify top shoulder medical specialist.

 

[Sensinitis]

Signing him long term was so, so stupid since we already knew the shoulder was a concern.

So much for our core. 8 million AAV down the drain.

Way to be doom and gloom lol

That’s the whole point of surgery

 

[Ice-Tray]

He should be 100% after surgery, which should fix the issues with both previous injuries. That’s the good news.

Pinto certainly hasn’t shown any lingering effects after his surgery.

Sucks that rehab didn’t work, but now we know and he’ll get the permanent fix and be ready for camp next season.

 

[Billy Bridges]

A bunch of randoms on the internet pretending they know more than medical professionals. What is this, another pandemic?

 

[JungleBeat]

The Sens probably have the worst medical group in the league

 

[BondraTime]

He should be 100% after surgery, which should fix the issues with both previous injuries. That’s the good news.

Pinto certainly hasn’t shown any lingering effects after his surgery.

Sucks that rehab didn’t work, but now we know and he’ll get the permanent fix and be ready for camp next season.

He's already had surgery on the shoulder. There is no permanent fix, there is just fixing it, same as last time

He will be 100%ish, but will be very prone to reinjuring it, even moreso than he was after his 1st shoulder surgery 3 years ago

 

[Que]

I thought this injury was in the same shoulder but in a deferent area than previously injured.

Which could mean that this surgery won’t stress the previous scar tissue and could actually help clean the first injury up as that is what Josh aggravated at the end of last season.

Is any of this correct or am I way off base here?

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

The Sens probably have the worst medical group in the league

Probably are only able to afford veterinarians.

 

[enviro61]

Your anger with 6 years of losing blinds you to reality. Team Doctors and Josh's doctors signed off on his being ready and he has been taking contact in practice for at least a couple weeks. Josh didn't want surgery, he wanted to try rehab, it obviously didn't work. I don't see the point in assigning blame, it's almost like you think DJ put him in the lineup before the doctors and Josh felt he was ready, which is idiotic to believe could happen.

ok, he got injured in his second game back on what appeared to be routine nhl hockey. No insane generational hit. Obviously the team doctors made a serious error in judgement on his ability come back and play and any whomever recommended that he should avoid surgery do have to assume blame in this.

This is a failure of the team and whomever encouraged rehabilitation rather than surgery and whoever said he was ready to return. Epic failure

 

[WORLDSTARHIPHOP]

Probably are only able to afford veterinarians.

At least Debrincat will be looked after

 

[slamigo]

I think it is a reasonable argument. We are taking one facet of Norris game, which is faceoffs due to precautions. In the same token, Zub getting boarded , that cage will do jack shit. Or an elbow to the head, face area. My logic lies in the assumption that the cage does not make Zub immune to injury no more than Norris not taking a faceoff. I understand your point. I resent the gaslighting comment. I have no reason to , if this is what I believe in. If you think I am here to gaslight people, well, that couldn't be further from the truth

Okay fair enough (and I will apologize for the gas lighting comment), but I feel the likelihood of injury seems much greater if you can't even take a faceoff rather than the chances of being injured while wearing a full face mask.
Hockey sticks are essentially a lever that can generate a LOT of force. It's basically a giant pry-bar. If your shoulder is injured, it's so easy to damage it if you're holding onto a long lever.
Common sense should have dictated to whoever made the decision - be it Norris, Team, Training staff, doctors, etc, that if he couldn't take a face-off, he wasn't likely healthy enough to play hockey.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

The new owners To Do list just got a little longer.

Add the following task: Identify top shoulder medical specialist.

Norris already has a “ shoulder specialist” that is who he consulted, and rehabilitation and surgery were the two recommendations…. Norris chose rehabbing, because going in for survey is 100% the players choice, not the team.

 

[DueDiligence]

ok, he got injured in his second game back on what appeared to be routine nhl hockey. No insane generational hit. Obviously the team doctors made a serious error in judgement on his ability come back and play and any whomever recommended that he should avoid surgery do have to assume blame in this.

This is a failure of the team and whomever encouraged rehabilitation rather than surgery and whoever said he was ready to return. Epic failure

The Senators went beyond "team doctors" for opinions of whether he should play or not. Not unlike every other pro sports team.

 

[swiftwin]

ok, he got injured in his second game back on what appeared to be routine nhl hockey. No insane generational hit. Obviously the team doctors made a serious error in judgement on his ability come back and play and any whomever recommended that he should avoid surgery do have to assume blame in this.

This is a failure of the team and whomever encouraged rehabilitation rather than surgery and whoever said he was ready to return. Epic failure

Yes, they should get blame for Josh needing surgery instead of *checks notes* needing surgery.

Josh wanted to see if it was possible to avoid surgery. It wasn't, so now he's getting surgery.

 

[Micklebot]

I think it is a reasonable argument. We are taking one facet of Norris game, which is faceoffs due to precautions. In the same token, Zub getting boarded , that cage will do jack shit. Or an elbow to the head, face area. My logic lies in the assumption that the cage does not make Zub immune to injury no more than Norris not taking a faceoff. I understand your point. I resent the gaslighting comment. I have no reason to , if this is what I believe in. If you think I am here to gaslight people, well, that couldn't be further from the truth

Players suit up with a full cage all the time after breaking a jaw, don't think I have ever seen the situation you're describing occur though, heck, I can't recall a guy ever reinjuring a broken jaw from coming back too soon

It's also worth pointing out coming back too soon from a broken jaw and re-injuring it might mean missing another 4-6 weeks if surgery is needed, the stakes are a touch higher with shoulders

And I mean, on the one hand, you're putting a guy in who should be ok, but just in case he's got extra protection, on the other, you have a guy that should be ok but if he isn't, oh well?.