Value of: Jordan Harris

[Derailed75]

Lots of talk on social media about Harris being on the market.

With Matheson , Ghule , Wifi on the left there is no room for him really,
Then you have Hutson, Engstrom, Struble in the pipeline as well.

Some say he could be a top 4 LHD in the NHL

What is your offer ?

So some say he could be a top4 on some team in the NHL? or he's a top 4 in all the NHL? Cause he wouldn't snif top 4 on the Canes most likely not even play in Raleigh

 

[Captain Mountain]

Lots of talk on social media about Harris being on the market.

With Matheson , Ghule , Wifi on the left there is no room for him really,
Then you have Hutson, Engstrom, Struble in the pipeline as well.

Some say he could be a top 4 LHD in the NHL

What is your offer ?

Huh? There's no real talk of Harris being on the market. At all.

As to his value? Who knows. He had a good rookie season and is only 23. The notion of Montreal trading him now because they may have guys ready in a couple of seasons is a pretty stupid idea TBH.

 

[pth2]

Give him another season to show if he's closer to Victor Mete (worthless) or Josh Gorges (2nd rounder) or Eric Weinrich (real value), otherwise he's unlikely to fetch anything worthwhile.

 

[Dr Quincy]

Harris was drafted in the 3rd
hes no longer n ELC/ exempted a left D

he doesn’t have much value in his own.

you can trade him fir a similar player around 23 yrs old has to clear waivers and is a F

he gets traded as part of a larger trade.

him getting a 1st or 2nd? Not happening.

A 1st? No chance.

A 2nd? Maybe, but not worth arguing about.

But it's ok to admit that you haven't watched him play very much.

 

[Agalloch]

Keep him for now. He might be worth more in 2 years.

 

[BLNY]

Talk by anyone credible?

Kid is just putting it together. Was solid last year. Not flashy, but smooth and doesn't wilt under pressure. There's no way they get value to make it worthwhile because he's still worth more to them than anyone else.

 

[Treb]

Romanov got traded for #13 + #98
Harris holds close to he's value.
So 2 second (LA being a late one) is fair for a NHL ready D, 23 years old at 1,4mil signed for 2 more years.
Jezz second picks are not worth that much to be honest.

Dach might not even play in the NHL,, Harris does allready.

1. Harris has nowhere near the value of Romanov. If we traded Romanov and the main return would have been an Harris-level D, I would have been mad.

2. Harris can play RD, so the LD logjam is not that much of an issue. We can still wait until Hutson, Mailloux, Reinbacher and Engstrom start pushing.

3. Harris play in the NHL, but as of now, he's pretty run of the mill bottom pair D.

 

[dirtydanglez]

3rd round pick maybe

 

[CapSpace]

Romanov got traded for #13 + #98
Harris holds close to he's value.
So 2 second (LA being a late one) is fair for a NHL ready D, 23 years old at 1,4mil signed for 2 more years.
Jezz second picks are not worth that much to be honest.

Dach might not even play in the NHL,, Harris does allready.

Wait what

 

[Thechozen1]

Every team has similar caliber players. Value wouldn’t be very high.

Wasn’t he the sweetener many habs fans were trying to peddle in packages for Dubois that didn’t move the needle?

 

[Djp]

A 1st? No chance.

A 2nd? Maybe, but not worth arguing about.

But it's ok to admit that you haven't watched him play very much.

Many teams have similar players in their system have such a player.

he’s not a needle mover. Teams can just use their comparable system D call ups if needed.

 

[Hunter368]

Not much value to bottom pairing D, all teams have them

 

[pth2]

Every team has similar caliber players. Value wouldn’t be very high.

Wasn’t he the sweetener many habs fans were trying to peddle in packages for Dubois that didn’t move the needle?

Well, we have to keep in mind that being suggested by many fans doesn't mean a player is bad, just that fans can see he might be available based on other players a team has.
With Matheson, Guhle and Xhekaj as LD, and Hutson on the way, it's easy to think Harris might be available.
If the Habs had never moved Petry (ie, no Matheson) and hadn't drafted Guhle, Harris would be the future on LD and not seen as available.

That being said, it's too early in his career for him to have shown enough to fetch much, but if he takes that next step, he could be valuable in a year or two, possibly worth as much as Romanov to a GM who really sees him as a fit. I don't see enough upside for that, but I'm often wrong, so, I'm in "wait and see" mode.

 

[TBF1972]

Wait what

Still one of my favorites

Proposal: - NJ & MTL

NJ needs to fix things quickly . Habs could offer help right now for future Habs : Chariot + Drouin + Armia + Ylonen for NJ Holtz + Mercer

forums.hfboards.com

The worst thing he hasn't learnwd anything. He still proposes rebuilding teams overpay in futures for win now* pieces. So the value being completely off is not even the worst thing.

* actually lose now

 

[Petes2424]

He’s probably worth a 3rd or 4th round pick as we speak. I rate him in the 3rd for sure, but I could see why others would say 4th rounder.

He’s in the same spot as about 30-40 other players at his position right now. He does the basics well enough to become a regular NHL player, but nothing that stands out enough for a team to decide to pencil him in for the next few years. One of those players a team is always looking to upgrade from. Which is going to be an issue for him in Montreal as they try matching all that size that’s going to be on Atlantic Blue Lines over the next decade.

I think he’s asserted himself well since coming from college, walking straight into the league. That’s not easy. Just don’t know what real upside is there to justify anything more than a 3rd round pick. He’s a keeper for now.. At least until someone comes in and takes his spot.

 

[Belial]

His biggest value is on our own team.

 

[biturbo19]

Romanov got traded for #13 + #98
Harris holds close to he's value.
So 2 second (LA being a late one) is fair for a NHL ready D, 23 years old at 1,4mil signed for 2 more years.
Jezz second picks are not worth that much to be honest.

Dach might not even play in the NHL,, Harris does allready.

I mean...at least this helps to explain where your completely outlandish value appraisal is coming from.

It's completely off base, but i can see better where you're going completely off track asking unreasonable prices as a baseline.


Romanov is a big, heavy, physical Top-4D with upside to be more. Harris is a small bottom-pairing D who doesn't really excel particularly in anything and realistically has more like...#4/5 tweener upside. He's a decent player, but not one that anyone is ever really beating the doors down to acquire.


If you think these two are of similar caliber...you need to make a significant adjustment to the evaluation. One of these types of player is highly coveted around the league. The other is...pretty dime a dozen.



Just doesn't make sense for Habs to bother trading Harris for the 4th or maybe late 3rd they'd get for him. And that's if you even really found a taker. Most teams already have their own guys in a similar position that they're trying to get into games to see what they can develop into. Either he's a throw-in piece to a bigger deal, or you just keep him.

 

[Djp]

I mean...at least this helps to explain where your completely outlandish value appraisal is coming from.

It's completely off base, but i can see better where you're going completely off track asking unreasonable prices as a baseline.


Romanov is a big, heavy, physical Top-4D with upside to be more. Harris is a small bottom-pairing D who doesn't really excel particularly in anything and realistically has more like...#4/5 tweener upside. He's a decent player, but not one that anyone is ever really beating the doors down to acquire.


If you think these two are of similar caliber...you need to make a significant adjustment to the evaluation. One of these types of player is highly coveted around the league. The other is...pretty dime a dozen.



Just doesn't make sense for Habs to bother trading Harris for the 4th or maybe late 3rd they'd get for him. And that's if you even really found a taker. Most teams already have their own guys in a similar position that they're trying to get into games to see what they can develop into. Either he's a throw-in piece to a bigger deal, or you just keep him.

Like I mentioned up thread….

the other option is they trade him for a similar age player who now lost waiver exemption and is on a bridge. One trade I recall that Sabres did was McNabb for Deslauriers with kings. At TDL they we’re both finishing their 3 yr ELCs and both looked to be outside looking in next year

 

[Dr Quincy]

Like I mentioned up thread….

the other option is they trade him for a similar age player who now lost waiver exemption and is on a bridge. One trade I recall that Sabres did was McNabb for Deslauriers with kings. At TDL they we’re both finishing their 3 yr ELCs and both looked to be outside looking in next year

Again, I don't think you really watched him, which is fine I guess. But Harris has very good advanced stats. It's a small sample-size and his usage probably protected him some...

but on a far worse team, his Goals Above Replacement was better than Mattias Samuelsson.

He's a young, capable NHL D, so his value isn't a 23 year old F who is on the outside looking in. I'm not sure what you are trying to prove, other than you own lack of knowledge on the player outside of looking at his birthday on hockeydb.

More even strength pts per 60 than Samuelsson, Lybushkin, Jokiharju, Bryson and Clague. A little less (.03) pts per 60 than Power, but more goals per 60 than him.

His relative xGF% was better than Jokiharju, Samuelsson and Power(not saying he's in the same universe as Power and probably will not be close to Samuelsson in the long run).

The view by many is his ceiling is low as he's not big, and won't put up a ton of points. But he's an effective, capable NHL D.

I'd certainly rather have him playing than Erik Johnson and Henri Jokiharju and Connor Clifton. I think now that he's not on BOS you are going to see Clifton's adavance stats plummet. He's um.. an adventure.

 

[Mersss]

I mean...at least this helps to explain where your completely outlandish value appraisal is coming from.

It's completely off base, but i can see better where you're going completely off track asking unreasonable prices as a baseline.


Romanov is a big, heavy, physical Top-4D with upside to be more. Harris is a small bottom-pairing D who doesn't really excel particularly in anything and realistically has more like...#4/5 tweener upside. He's a decent player, but not one that anyone is ever really beating the doors down to acquire.


If you think these two are of similar caliber...you need to make a significant adjustment to the evaluation. One of these types of player is highly coveted around the league. The other is...pretty dime a dozen.



Just doesn't make sense for Habs to bother trading Harris for the 4th or maybe late 3rd they'd get for him. And that's if you even really found a taker. Most teams already have their own guys in a similar position that they're trying to get into games to see what they can develop into. Either he's a throw-in piece to a bigger deal, or you just keep him.

Romanov 6'1 210
Harris 5'11 195

Huge difference

Is Romanov nore physical? Yes, bur Harris is better than Romanov at everything else hockey related. Bring me ONE stat beside hitting where Romanov is better. Only one

I'll wait

 

[HabsAddict]

Well, we have to keep in mind that being suggested by many fans doesn't mean a player is bad, just that fans can see he might be available based on other players a team has.
With Matheson, Guhle and Xhekaj as LD, and Hutson on the way, it's easy to think Harris might be available.
If the Habs had never moved Petry (ie, no Matheson) and hadn't drafted Guhle, Harris would be the future on LD and not seen as available.

That being said, it's too early in his career for him to have shown enough to fetch much, but if he takes that next step, he could be valuable in a year or two, possibly worth as much as Romanov to a GM who really sees him as a fit. I don't see enough upside for that, but I'm often wrong, so, I'm in "wait and see" mode.

Stop stealing my brain!

Asset Management 101...don't move a good asset until he proves his worth.

He's worth a 2nd now and unlikely to go lower. On the other hand he can develop to a top 4 and his value skyrockets to a mid 1st or better.

 

[yianik]

No reason to trade Harris and we will get nothing of value for him straight up. I don't see anybody offering a 2nd. Let's see how he and the other guys develop this year.

 

[hawksrule]

Stop stealing my brain!

Asset Management 101...don't move a good asset until he proves his worth.

He's worth a 2nd now and unlikely to go lower. On the other hand he can develop to a top 4 and his value skyrockets to a mid 1st or better.

He isn’t a top-4 dman, so the argument that he’ll be worth a mid-first if he becomes one is worthless because it can be applied to any d-prospect in the league.

 

[biturbo19]

Romanov 6'1 210
Harris 5'11 195

Huge difference

Is Romanov nore physical? Yes, bur Harris is better than Romanov at everything else hockey related. Bring me ONE stat beside hitting where Romanov is better. Only one

I'll wait

It is an absolutely huge difference. It's the difference between a guy who is physically imposing on the ice vs a guy who gets completely pushed around and framed out. They're on complete opposite ends of the spectrum of effective size. The difference doesn't get much more pronounced than that.


What exactly is Harris so good at that Habs fans think he's better than, and worth more than Romanov? Other than...still playing for the Blue Blanc et Rouge? Seriously...what are ya'll seeing there, or is this a fancystats thing? Where Harris comes out looking "decent" in the distortions of a bad team, relative to someone like Savard getting catastrophically caved in drowning in the toughest minutes?


Because so far as i've seen, Romanov does everything at least as well as Harris if not better, while also having that major size and physicality advantage. The one thing i'd maybe give Harris the edge is in his first pass. But aside from that...Romanov played a Top-4D role with a raft of fairly tough minutes and a ton of PK duty on a better, very nearly playoff team and handled them pretty well. He also has the more dynamic skillset both physically and offensively. Harris played a nebulous softer Top-4ish role out of necessity on an injury riddled D-Corps.



Honestly...if you threw up a poll between Romanov and Harris, it'd probably be locked for lopsided results within 48 hours. I'm really not getting what some Habs fans are apparently seeing with Harris here...while simultaneously suggesting that he's trade bait because he's not good enough to crack the Habs defence. Or maybe...what you're not seeing with Romanov?

Like i said above...just keep Harris. See what he turns into, if there's any more there. He's not going to be worth much as a standalone unless he really solidifies himself as a rock solid, Top-4D on a contender sort of player. Even then, he's what...basically a Sam Girard? You're just not going to get much value for him at this point, certainly not what you think he's worth, if you believe he's a more valuable piece than Romanov. Just let it ride.

 

[Mersss]

It is an absolutely huge difference. It's the difference between a guy who is physically imposing on the ice vs a guy who gets completely pushed around and framed out. They're on complete opposite ends of the spectrum of effective size. The difference doesn't get much more pronounced than that.


What exactly is Harris so good at that Habs fans think he's better than, and worth more than Romanov? Other than...still playing for the Blue Blanc et Rouge? Seriously...what are ya'll seeing there, or is this a fancystats thing? Where Harris comes out looking "decent" in the distortions of a bad team, relative to someone like Savard getting catastrophically caved in drowning in the toughest minutes?


Because so far as i've seen, Romanov does everything at least as well as Harris if not better, while also having that major size and physicality advantage. The one thing i'd maybe give Harris the edge is in his first pass. But aside from that...Romanov played a Top-4D role with a raft of fairly tough minutes and a ton of PK duty on a better, very nearly playoff team and handled them pretty well. He also has the more dynamic skillset both physically and offensively. Harris played a nebulous softer Top-4ish role out of necessity on an injury riddled D-Corps.



Honestly...if you threw up a poll between Romanov and Harris, it'd probably be locked for lopsided results within 48 hours. I'm really not getting what some Habs fans are apparently seeing with Harris here...while simultaneously suggesting that he's trade bait because he's not good enough to crack the Habs defence. Or maybe...what you're not seeing with Romanov?

Like i said above...just keep Harris. See what he turns into, if there's any more there. He's not going to be worth much as a standalone unless he really solidifies himself as a rock solid, Top-4D on a contender sort of player. Even then, he's what...basically a Sam Girard? You're just not going to get much value for him at this point, certainly not what you think he's worth, if you believe he's a more valuable piece than Romanov. Just let it ride.

Again, bring me one stat where Romanov is better beside hits. i'll wait

Harris defensive and offensive advanced stats were ALL better while playing on a shittier team