Kings News: Jonathan Bernier to TML for Matt Frattin, Ben Scrivens, & 2nd ('14 or '15) (pst#276)

[Live in the Now]

Bernier is going to take the job from Reimer. He was too good to be a backup here and not good enough to take Quick's spot. So it is what it is. Hopefully Frattin can slot in and play on the 2nd line or push King out of that third line role. Scrivens will play like 15 games. Hopefully he's good enough to win about half of them.

 

[DocWest]

I trust Dean on this. Looking forward to see what Frattin can do.

 

[cyclones22]

One thing about Reimer was that he stunk at handling the puck and would prematurely smother the puck for a faceoff too many times. Hows Berniers puckhandling? Scrivens is probably even worse with the puck unfortunately

That's one of Bernier's strengths. He's a very good puck handler. Of course, that could just very well be the perception because Quick is a gong show handling the puck. But I don't remember Bernier making any glaring mistakes handling the puck in his time in LA.

 

[CNS]

That's one of Bernier's strengths. He's a very good puck handler. Of course, that could just very well be the perception because Quick is a gong show handling the puck. But I don't remember Bernier making any glaring mistakes handling the puck in his time in LA.

Uhh....what?

Bernier is not good handling the puck. He's no Quick but that's because Quick is the worst in the league. The only reason you'd think Bernier isn't bad handling the puck is because he doesn't do it a lot. It's far from a strength of his.

 

[LeafOfBread]

Uhh....what?

Bernier is not good handling the puck. He's no Quick but that's because Quick is the worst in the league. The only reason you'd think Bernier isn't bad handling the puck is because he doesn't do it a lot. It's far from a strength of his.

You sure? He's not the first person I've seen around here to say that, a lot of Kings fans have mentioned that to us as well as other people who watched Bernier in general

 

[Telos]

Uhh....what?

Bernier is not good handling the puck. He's no Quick but that's because Quick is the worst in the league. The only reason you'd think Bernier isn't bad handling the puck is because he doesn't do it a lot. It's far from a strength of his.

I disagree, he is very good at handling the puck. It usually ends up on the stick of a King and he looks up and surveys his options. Quick handles the puck blindly and half the time it ends up on the other team's stick. What on earth has Bernier shown that makes him out as a bad puck handler? That aspect of his game has always been solid.

 

[kingsfan]

And if it wasn't, you take the Read deal. I'm not sold on Frattin and I won't be until I see him play in our system.

-Read is a UFA in a year, Frattin isn't.

-If you pro rate Frattin's numbers over 42 games (same as what Read played this year) he has 22 points, are two fewer than Read. And Read played in a system which most say overinflates offensive numbers.

-Frattin plays a very good style for our system and is more physical than Read.

-I think one of the biggest parts of the deal for DL is the retention of $500,000 in cap space. Considering Philly's cap situation I very ugly, I doubt they offered to eat any cap space.

 

[CNS]

I disagree, he is very good at handling the puck. It usually ends up on the stick of a King and he looks up and surveys his options. Quick handles the puck blindly and half the time it ends up on the other team's stick. What on earth has Bernier shown that makes him out as a bad puck handler? That aspect of his game has always been solid.

There were a few times this year where he made some bone headed plays with the puck on his stick that I remember. The only two areas I see Bernier not being very good in are puck handling and in shootouts.

Again though, Bernier didn't really handle the puck that much. And he did make the smarter, short passes to his defenseman below the goal line. But when he tried to do something besides that, it wasn't great. I'm not saying he's Quick level with it, but I really would not call him good.

 

[no name]

Uhh....what?

Bernier is not good handling the puck. He's no Quick but that's because Quick is the worst in the league. The only reason you'd think Bernier isn't bad handling the puck is because he doesn't do it a lot. It's far from a strength of his.

You're wrong. He's long been trumpeted as a great goalie with the puck. Every since he was drafted, in the minors and as a King. I don't know what you are seeing.

 

[CNS]

-Read is a UFA in a year, Frattin isn't.

-If you pro rate Frattin's numbers over 42 games (same as what Read played this year) he has 22 points, are two fewer than Read. And Read played in a system which most say overinflates offensive numbers.

-Frattin plays a very good style for our system and is more physical than Read.

-I think one of the biggest parts of the deal for DL is the retention of $500,000 in cap space. Considering Philly's cap situation I very ugly, I doubt they offered to eat any cap space.

-Being a UFA doesn't concern me. Again, I've pointed this out before but we acquired Regehr as a UFA to be and he signed with us. Read would have gotten a chance to be a 2nd line winger with two VERY good players on a team that won the Cup and went to the WCF the year after that. If he wouldn't want that role, then I wouldn't want him.

-As many Leafs fans have pointed out, Frattin's numbers were high because he started out on fire. And they said he wasn't great in the playoffs. You are right on the system though. But I think the thing you may be overlooking a bit is their actual talent level and what they bring. We have plenty of physical players. We need more talented ones. And Read can skate well too, which would be really nice to have.

-Your last point is a very very good one. $500,000 certainly helps. After redoing my cap projections, I have a 24 man roster with $800k in cap space. Lose a player and you're around $1.5M. That's decent enough with how much the cap is going down this upcoming year.

Overall, I see us getting a 3rd liner, nothing more than a career backup (and I'm not sure how good of one will be. Don't like some aspects of his game but he's not terrible), and a 2nd rounder. For a guy that I feel will be one of the league's 10 best goalies in due time. My ideal trade would have either been for Read or a 1st round pick as both would address major needs. I thought our 3rd line was just fine going in to next year as Lewis-Stoll-Toffoli. I didn't see us needing an upgrade there.

 

[Reaper45]

So

Brown-Kopitar-Williams
Frattin-Richards-Carter
King-Stoll-Toffoli
Clifford-Fraser-Lewis
Nolan

Doughty-Mitchell?
Voynov-Regher
Greene-Muzzin
Martinez/Ellerby

Quick
Scrivens

 

[KingsFan7824]

-I think one of the biggest parts of the deal for DL is the retention of $500,000 in cap space. Considering Philly's cap situation I very ugly, I doubt they offered to eat any cap space.

You could look at it as though Scrivens will have a cap hit of just over $100,000 next year. If he's any sort of NHL goalie, where are you getting another goalie for the number? A number well below the league minimum. What would a veteran backup cost? $1 million? $1.5? That's a huge different for a backup when Quick's cap hit shoots way up.

Since the only goalie I can remember that, at least recently, brought back a 1st round pick was Varlamov(and that was the following season's 1st round pick), we can probably not worry about the Kings being offered 1st round picks. It most likely didn't happen, and especially for 2013.

Look what goalies in general get traded for. It's not exactly star talent.

Matt Read would've been great. He scores, and he's cheap. Which are the exact same reasons the Flyers, who also have cap issues, would want to hold onto him.

 

[bansheebeat]

Matt Read is great but you'd rather a guy like Frattin come playoff time. He has incredible speed, hustle, and unbelievable strength. I can see him getting 50pts and 140hits in a season or two. Just don't underutilize him in your bottom 6 because he needs skilled players around him to be really effective.

 

[MsMeow]

Looks like the same age to me.

Actually 2 years, Frattin is 25, Read is 27.

 

[HockeyFanSince86]

You guys just got a good player in Frattin. You will like the way he plays, fits west coast hockey to a tee. Hard hitter, fast skater, skilled when paired likewise players. He won't start on your 2nd line but can fill that role if need be.

Scrivens is a very smart goalie, he won't steal games but is positionaly sound. If he lets in a bad goal, for us it could always be traced back to our D.

Good luck to both of them going forward, both good people and wish them the best.

 

[KingsFan7824]

Overall, I see us getting a 3rd liner, nothing more than a career backup (and I'm not sure how good of one will be. Don't like some aspects of his game but he's not terrible), and a 2nd rounder. For a guy that I feel will be one of the league's 10 best goalies in due time. My ideal trade would have either been for Read or a 1st round pick as both would address major needs. I thought our 3rd line was just fine going in to next year as Lewis-Stoll-Toffoli. I didn't see us needing an upgrade there.

That's the thing. You feel he'll be a top 10 goalie. That's why goalies don't go for that much. They're so invaluable to the success of a team, that if one is getting traded, there has to be a reason why. More so than other positions. You feel he'll be a top 10 goalie some day, but he isn't a top 10 goalie today. The other team is taking a risk that he may not be that.

You can hide a forward or defenseman. Move them up or down a line or pairing. You can get something out of them in some other way if one part of their game isn't on that night. Goalies are in for the entire game, or they're on the bench.

If the Kings were to make Quick available, do you think they would get fair value for him? He is the most important player on the Kings, without question. If the Kings were ready to deal him, what would that say about him? What would that do to his value?

 

[jml87]

Matt Read is great but you'd rather a guy like Frattin come playoff time. He has incredible speed, hustle, and unbelievable strength. I can see him getting 50pts and 140hits in a season or two. Just don't underutilize him in your bottom 6 because he needs skilled players around him to be really effective.

So Richards and Carter then? That would be nice. Would certainly solve a lot of problems.

 

[CNS]

That's the thing. You feel he'll be a top 10 goalie. That's why goalies don't go for that much. They're so invaluable to the success of a team, that if one is getting traded, there has to be a reason why. More so than other positions. You feel he'll be a top 10 goalie some day, but he isn't a top 10 goalie today. The other team is taking a risk that he may not be that.

You can hide a forward or defenseman. Move them up or down a line or pairing. You can get something out of them in some other way if one part of their game isn't on that night. Goalies are in for the entire game, or they're on the bench.

If the Kings were to make Quick available, do you think they would get fair value for him? He is the most important player on the Kings, without question. If the Kings were ready to deal him, what would that say about him? What would that do to his value?

I totally understand the point you're trying to make but if Read was indeed on the table, I think it was a mistake choosing the package we chose. Goalies are terribly underrated and it's pretty ****ing sad when it's in my opinion ( and I am VERY biased) the most important position in the game.

As for Quick, if he was made available, he'd return a HEFTY ransom.

 

[ScoreZeGoals]

So

Brown-Kopitar-Williams
Frattin-Richards-Carter
King-Stoll-Toffoli
Clifford-Fraser-Lewis
Nolan

Doughty-Mitchell?
Voynov-Regher
Greene-Muzzin
Martinez/Ellerby

Quick
Scrivens

Still don't like our left wings. Ideally Frattin would be on the 3rd line, Clifford on the 4th line, and King somewhere else. With those lines, we are a Brown yearly slump away from having close to no production from our left wings

 

[Swervin81]

Matt Frattin is the best part of the deal for you guys. He has heart, can hit like a truck, can stand anyone up, and has good speed and a good wrister. You can put Frattin on the 3rd line (Toffoli on the 2nd line), and he can play on the 2nd line in a pinch. Surrounded with the right guys, he has 20G potential IMO. After that the 2nd is meh, and Scrivens is a decent backup, but when he handles the puck, you'll see why we call him Scary Scrivens. For him, simply wrapping a puck around the glass is like going through the Ocarina of Time Water Temple. Seriously, it's that kind of an adventure. Not only that, but he plays the puck every chance he can get, so beware of heart attacks.

Can anyone here give me an idea of Bernier's strengths and weaknesses?

 

[Kbs]

Matt Read is great but you'd rather a guy like Frattin come playoff time. He has incredible speed, hustle, and unbelievable strength. I can see him getting 50pts and 140hits in a season or two. Just don't underutilize him in your bottom 6 because he needs skilled players around him to be really effective.

I wouldn't say Frattin has incredible speed, he's good enough for the type of player that he is. He has a pretty underrated wrister though, and if it was more accurate, his goals per season would sky rocket.

Anyway, I like the deal for both sides. Frattin has a style of play that Sutter should really like and I think he'll fit into the Kings' lineup pretty easily.

 

[Mxpunk]

I'm satisfied with this trade. Lets face it. With our cap situation, we couldn't afford to get a superstar in return, and every team knows it. Also, there is a glut of goalies available (Luongo, Ryan Miller, Halak, possibly Hiller and Kiprusoff). If we didnt pull the trigger, we would've gotten a lot less. We are getting a good offensive prospect that can possibly contribute now (and we don't have many of those), a solid backup, a draft pick, and cash for Bernier, who would never get a chance with us.

 

[officialmark7*]

Leaf fan here, you guys are going to love Frattin. He is the type of player that gives 100% every shift, and is very skilled. He has a great shot, and is one of the better skaters in the league, plus he actually goes to the dirty areas, and isn't afraid to throw the body. You'll notice that he never falls, and is like a bull on skates. He's the type of player you want on your team in the playoffs.

Scrivens is a backup at best, I was never really impressed with him, but from what the Leaf media has shown he is a great locker room guy, and I'm sure Quick helping him will only help. He has potential to be a starter, but realistically he will be a solid backup.

 

[Dykstra]

Well, 4 of the last 6 second-round picks from Lombardi resulted in Simmonds, Voynov, Clifford and Toffoli, so im okay with this pick.

 

[Vamos Rafa]

I'm sorry, but he's not handsome like Bernier.