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John Tavares Discussion

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Leafs are a 4 headed dragon and Tavares is one of those heads. He hasn't been as productive this year, but given the fact he's aging and being used in a secondary role, it's not surprising. He's still been pretty productive and better than any other 2C we could get. Overpaid at 11M? Yea, but that comes with signing UFA's at their peak to long-term contracts. Overall he's still producing and Dubas was able to fill out the rest of the team fine so imo he's still a net positive.
 
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WillyC said:
Lol… was just checking out TBs forum… yup, they got the same bunch of entitled crybaby fans over there, that we have on here.

Imagine how awesome we’d be with two $4 million dollar players and not Stamkos?

How long do we have this anchor Stamkos on the books?

Worst re-signing ever.

It’s because of Stamkos we’re not winning.
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It's the same with every fanbase. Panthers fans are saying Barkov and Huberdeau are playoff failures and the organization won't go anywhere.
 
Stephen said:
That's the thing though. Sundin wasn't lit up daily on these boards. When he came to the city there was still this old school Canadian vs European angle and getting traded for Wendel certainly didn't ingratiate himself at the beginning, but he won the majority of the fanbase over and was seen as a star on an island that never put the right supporting cast around him.

Game in game out, year in year out, he gave about 1 goal or 1 assist like clockwork and had a flair for scoring big OT goals. Sundin was also never slow. He was obviously not a roadrunner but played the entire 200 feet of ice any pace you want.
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I was a member of the old Toronto maple leaf official message board. He was lit up daily.
 
All Mod Cons said:
It's the same with every fanbase. Panthers fans are saying Barkov and Huberdeau are playoff failures and the organization won't go anywhere.
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Well they are down 2-1 to Washington… so kinda justified to the Panther entitled crybabies.
 
Jamason said:
Short of putting him with Matthews and Marner, which would probably help his stats but hurt the team, how do you "get him going"?
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I don't know but I do know that putting him on the 4th line isn't going to do anything for him he needs 1 bounce
 
NJG said:
Every free agent is overpaid that's the point of free agency, everyone get's more then they would normally get because other teams are also interested and willing to pay the price.

The depth has been the reason why we are up 2-1 right now and if it wasn't for Simmonds we might even be up 3-0 right now. As long as he's doing other things and helping the team win in other areas of the game (which he is) that's all that matters. Kampf has two goals, Mikheyev has two goals... so by that logic then I guess Marner is a bust? Since he only has one goal in three games and his price tag is much higher then Kampf or Mikheyev... It doesn't matter who is scoring as long as the team is scoring. People need to relax and stop complaining about every little thing. It's funny how people who have never made it anywhere playing hockey or people that don't even play hockey want to talk shit about a guy who actually plays hockey at the highest level. Everyone on these forums is a professional online hockey player.
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Oops. Not true. Marner not only has two goals, but also leads the team in assists and points, and leads all forwards in +/-.
 
Warden of the North said:
.....imagine that you could give a realistic scenario for acquiring said top tier defenseman
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I rememeber the year we were talking about signing Tavares a bunch of Leaf fans wanted to wait a year and try and sign Drew Doughty instead. Aren't we glad we didn't do that, considering Doughty has dropped off an even bigger cliff than Tavares and wound up resigning anyway? ...I'm not even going to mention the "TRADE MARNER FOR DOUGHTY!" morons...
 
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LEAFANFORLIFE23 said:
Stamkos has 1 point in 3 games too, and nobody is talking about putting him on the 4th line.

You don't put star players on the 4th line
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Yes, Stamkos has one secondary assist on a PP goal, exactly the same as Tavares. But Tampa has only three goals that weren't on the PP, while Toronto has eleven. And in case you hadn't noticed, Stamkos has been absolutely robbed of a goal.

I agree, you don't put star players on the fourth line, but we're talking about Tavares, and I didn't say we had to put him on the fourth line, but asking where?
 
Jamason said:
Yes, Stamkos has one secondary assist on a PP goal, exactly the same as Tavares. But Tampa has only three goals that weren't on the PP, while Toronto has eleven. And in case you hadn't noticed, Stamkos has been absolutely robbed of a goal.

I agree, you don't put star players on the fourth line, but we're talking about Tavares, and I didn't say we had to put him on the fourth line, but asking where?
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Second line. End thread.
 
Stephen said:
Not really.

A Sundin to Tavares comparison can only be made based on the fact that both guys wore the C and score about 1 PPG in any regular season. No similarities exist between those players beyond that.

Sundin didn't play second fiddle to a much bigger star center, he didn't have a Marner equivalent during his career year in Toronto, played the bulk of his prime in the "Dead Puck Era", scored his 1 PPG pace well into his late 30s with no real decline (Tavares is 31 and we talk about him like he's Spezza/Marleau), was a clutch scorer. And he played the entire 200 feet of ice any pace, any style you wanted and elevated guys like Ponikarovsky and Antropov very late in his career. (Let's see Tavares score 80 points on a line with Engvall and Mikheyev for comparison).
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That’s not fair for JT, as Antropov can’t skate like Engvall and Soup. Lol.
 
TheGoldenJet said:
Good luck shipping out Tavares, Dubas made that particular boat anchor un-shippable.
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Not true... It is front end loaded and large signing bonuses every year. I could easier see a team needing to get to the cap floor picking him up after the signing bonus is paid out at the end of next year. His actual salary would be close to $9M for the last two years after the signing bonus is paid. Thats an average of $4.5Mil for the last two years. This is very moveable for a PPG center who is good on the faceoff and good defensively.
 
Jamason said:
I think it's coming to the point of "do we do something for him or for the team?"
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Why is there such a push to change anything? We are winning. We don’t absolutely need Tavares to score. It’s just something people want to feel good about the contract. We are up 2-1. No need to change anything.

Would it be nice if Tavares potted one yes, but it’s not a something that needs to happen for us to win the series.

Voodoo Child said:
I’m not here to defend JT’s play, it’s been bad - and too many times this year has it been bad, even though he does eventually return for a nice heater.

But someone said Stamkos led Tampa to two cups. Steven Stamkos?

He didn’t even play in one of the runs!

Those cups were Vasilevskiy, Hedman, Kucherov, Point and Palat in about that order and then maybe Stamkos with Gourde, Killorn and McDonagh.

He’s not a choker but he hasn’t ever carried the team on his back (like Vasi, Hedman, Kucherov and Point have).
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How has it been bad? He’s literally been on the ice for 1 goal against. His Faceoff percentage is really high. How is that bad. Some of you are on strange medication
 
deltamachine said:
Sundin dragged around a 200 lb anchor named Jonus Freakin Hoglund and turned him into a 20+ goal scorer. 'nuff said.
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Do you know how many guys got paid on the Island because of John Tavares?

Justin Bailey, Matt Moulson, Kyle Okposo. Most elite centers help elevate average wingers. Tavares, Crosby, Matthews ect have all done that for at least one player
 
Jamason said:
Yes, Stamkos has one secondary assist on a PP goal, exactly the same as Tavares. But Tampa has only three goals that weren't on the PP, while Toronto has eleven. And in case you hadn't noticed, Stamkos has been absolutely robbed of a goal.

I agree, you don't put star players on the fourth line, but we're talking about Tavares, and I didn't say we had to put him on the fourth line, but asking where?
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Probably 3rd line.

Bunting Matthews Marner
Engvall Kampf Mikheyev
Kerfoot Tavares Nylander
Blackwell Spezza Kase
 
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Stephen said:
Not really.

A Sundin to Tavares comparison can only be made based on the fact that both guys wore the C and score about 1 PPG in any regular season. No similarities exist between those players beyond that.

Sundin didn't play second fiddle to a much bigger star center, he didn't have a Marner equivalent during his career year in Toronto, played the bulk of his prime in the "Dead Puck Era", scored his 1 PPG pace well into his late 30s with no real decline (Tavares is 31 and we talk about him like he's Spezza/Marleau), was a clutch scorer. And he played the entire 200 feet of ice any pace, any style you wanted and elevated guys like Ponikarovsky and Antropov very late in his career. (Let's see Tavares score 80 points on a line with Engvall and Mikheyev for comparison).
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See just about the only thing in the post quoted of note was team makeup. If you check over the same age period, you may be surprised how they both rank amongst their peers. Can Tavares perform with lesser linemates? Don't know currently, though he has much of his career. Tavares' contract ends at what, 34? If you keep getting Pt/GP, near league leading FO, good D etc. he affords us well above average strength down the middle until the big three become veteran men, at which point we move on.
 
roosterman said:
Not true... It is front end loaded and large signing bonuses every year. I could easier see a team needing to get to the cap floor picking him up after the signing bonus is paid out at the end of next year. His actual salary would be close to $9M for the last two years after the signing bonus is paid. Thats an average of $4.5Mil for the last two years. This is very moveable for a PPG center who is good on the faceoff and good defensively.
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Who needs to get to the cap floor? Ottawa and Arizona? Will John want to go there?
 
Larcos_Unal said:
Stamkos is not Tampa's best player. Their comparable to losing Matthews would be losing Hedman/Vasilevsky
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Stamkos is the equivalent to Tavares. Us winning with Tavares not showing up is equivalent to Tampa winning without Stamkos.
 
John Tavares is not going anywhere… he will retire a Toronto Maple Leaf after his Spezza contracts and will likely work for the team post retirement.
 
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