calder candidate
Registered User
He would easily make EDM top 4, he miss most of last year and has been fine this year even after missing training camp and the start of the season
Beating out Kulak or Barry isn’t really a challenge…
Proposal: Joel Edmundson to Oilers
- Thread starter Goldenhands
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Beating out Kulak or Barry isn’t really a challenge…
Let's start with give aways and then we can move on to fancy stats if needed
SupremeTeam16
5-14-6-1
He’s been brutal this year, statistically one of the worst defenders on your team, and guys he’s been paired with generally have been better away from him. For a guy who’s a supposed defensive stalwart they’ve been starting him in the offensive zone an awful lot, over 55% this year. Wonder why they’re trying so hard to keep him out of his own end lol.
Also Barrie sucks so bad his 21 pts would make him the 3rd highest scoring player on the Habs.
Don't judge his position by his play on Montreal. He instantly be becomes one of Edmontons most physical and dependable D. He easily slots into # 4. He won't make the blueline night and day better but he would improve the overall defensive numbers.
calder candidate
Registered User
Please continue… Statistically the worst D man in the NHL last year, 5 worst this year. Pretty sure he wasn’t the worst on is team let alone in the NHL.
Habs Halifax
Loyal Habs Fan
I'm not a firm believer of top 6/top 9 line for all players. I would say he is a middle 6F type but has very low confidence/momentum right now. Not a sure shot top 6 guy but better than average 3rd liner.
You never want to see a top 5 pick disappoint like that.
ManofSteel55
Registered User
If he can't cut it on the 2nd pair in Montreal, why should we think he can in Edmonton?
There is no world where Edmundson takes the role Barrie currently has. Kulak is our 3LD, whether Edmundson can beat him out or not is irrelevant. We don't need an upgrade at 3LD. We need an upgrade at 1RD or 2LD.
calder candidate
Registered User
Getting high percentage of OZ start has nothing to go with keeping out of is own zone because he doesn’t provide any offense anyway, that a statistically anomaly that going to regress to the mean, maybe he can’t be used because there were icing and if it is to shelter someone it is likely is partners switch are usually rookies. Also he missed all of training camp and the first 10games and he has been playing 20min a games so he isn’t being sheltered that much
What has getting 21pts and where that rank in MTL lineup have to do with being a good Dman, if Edmundson were in EDM he would get more ice time than Barrie, Barrie you still rack up the pts on the PP. Never say Barrie suck, he isn’t a great defensive player, he is a great offensive player, but he isn’t the guy you put on the Ice at the end of the game to protect your lead in the playoff.
Oilers are like top 5 in term of scoring the reason they aren’t higher in the ranking isn’t lack of scoring it the fact they allow to many goal…
Edmundson would be a improvement over the current D in EDM, you might argue how much or what is the value the team should pay but you can argue that Edmundson is bigger, tougher a more reliable defender for more minutes and that gap is even significant come playoff time.
calder candidate
Registered User
He is a upgrade on your 2LD, Barrie roles is PP / offensive D man you don’t want him playing 20min a night 5 on 5 or the PK, no one is arguing that Edmundson is going to out produce Barrie offensively, that doesn’t mean he can play more or tougher minutes… EDM need to find a why to keep the puck out of their net… Oilers have 34pts in 30 games and Mtl have 30pts in 29 games for two team at completely deferent stage, the gap between these two team probably isn’t that significant as one would hope and the biggest reason defense. Again you can argue on the cost of acquiring him or how big of a improvement that would be but I do not think you can argue that it would be a improvement and that is strengths help adresse the Oilers weakness…
Holy cow. Montreal fans are in a full-court press, trying to push this guy onto the next unsuspecting buyer. Talk about an aggressive sales pitch.
Edmundson was routinely benched on the Blues Cup run, and has had recurring back issues since 2018. The guy is blood and guts, but any team conned into paying a 1st for him deserves to be severly disappointed.
Edmundson was routinely benched on the Blues Cup run, and has had recurring back issues since 2018. The guy is blood and guts, but any team conned into paying a 1st for him deserves to be severly disappointed.
Superlative Soup
Lights too bright
Blame the Panthers for caving on Chiarot. Got them in fantasy land.
ManofSteel55
Registered User
I don't know if he is an upgrade on our current 2LD (Broberg). He's more experienced, and plays a style of game that we are lacking, but I don't think he is a better player at this stage. I also don't think Holland would trade for him to bump Broberg down the lineup.
Barrie has played better this season when he plays over 20 minutes a night, so he is proving that "only 3rd pairing PP specialist" narrative to be incorrect. It's almost like nobody has watched Barrie play since he left Toronto and thinks his one awful season failing under Babcock is normal. Edmundson would play more defensive zone minutes, but by the way his advanced stats look, that thought is troubling as well. Montreal is playing very well this year because of defense, but Edmundson's pairings have been the weakest for you guys all year. Any team icing Edmundson as a 2nd pair defenseman at this stage in his career has a problem on their 2nd pair.
I agree that we have too many puck movers and not enough defensive defensemen. I said that before the season started. I fail to see how putting a guy currently best suited to a bottom pair on our 2nd pair will help though.
SwedishFire
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- Mar 3, 2011
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Oh yeah??
Barrie is still a very good offensive producer, and better than Bouchard defensivly. Kulak is rock steady as a leader of 3rd pairing. Can slide in as a 4th D if needed. Im very happy with both of them. If Barries contract was 3 millions, he would be a no-brainer to keep. Now he is 4,5 millions. Are more reliable than Boychard, but has a cap at 4,5 wich makes trade upgrades hard.
Barrie is Oilers 3rd best defender. He is not a bad player. Kulak is overall not as good as Barrie, but he is REALLY needed here. Edmundson seems to be a bad skater, so he is not what oilers need. Bad skating Ds is not great.
What qould edmundson be here?
Better than nurse, Ceci? Id say no. Barrie is a diffent type. Bouchard is Barrie incarinated with a better shot, cant be compared to Edmundson.
left is Kulak- who is 3rs pair rock, so we dont need another 3rd pair guy.
and Broberg, who probably already is better than edmundsom. Great skater.
So that would make Edmundson at best a 4thD, who is a bad skater. Well... kulikov cost a 3rd rounder - so I equal this.
We can take Edmundsons contract for a 3rd.
Its easy to block shots, when you are to slow to skate away from them.
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Lets not forget Edmonton bottom 6 are mostly AHL players because of injuries. We are also missing Kane. Not an excuse it is a fact and why Edmonton needs to be deeper and not give up much for a declining asset.
I like how Montreal fans flip flop. When Edmonton was rebuilding and a player put up decent numbers it was because they were stat padding. Montreal rebuilding and their players would do great on a better team.
Puljujarvi for Edmundton straight up. take it or leave it.
pth2
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That's near-certain to be beat by other teams.
If it isn't, I'm willing to bet next summer or next deadline there will be a much better offer.
calder candidate
Registered User
I actually agree that Barrie is getting a bad rep even when he was in Toronto is partner would causing him lot of issues, but ultimately he still not a guy your going to put in the defensive zone in the last minute of a game or PK especially not on the left side or a guy that going to be able to clear up the front of the net…also not sure Kulak or Bouchard or Ceci are ideal partner for him or that he is a great partner for Nurse…
I was under the impression that Edmundson would check a lot of boxesfor EDM (size, reliable D, tough, experienced, cheap, 2 years) if he doesn’t I guess I can’t argue with you but where I will argue is that Edmundson isn’t a 3 pair D, he would be #4 on half of the team in the league. He might not be able to beat out any #2 or many #3 but when you look at every lineup you quickly see that there are a lot of guy than can’t play 20min or that people probably would not consider or want in there top 4 over Edmundson especially if you consider going far in the playoff…Edmundson filled that role basically is whole career and he as done it in the playoffs, he has limitations just like all players, but he hasn’t regressed, he isn’t someone that just happen to be play 10min on great teams or looking good on a bad team but crumbling with a better team or bigger minutes come playoff time. The fact that he is a big stay a home D that doesn’t provide much offense doesn’t automatically make him a 3rd pairing D, there probably is 90 D that are better than him but there aren’t 128 D, especially if you only consider situation of a team acquiring him for the next two playoff.
ManofSteel55
Registered User
Edmundson's STYLE is what we need. But we need someone who can do it at a higher level ideally. I'm not sure what Holland would even do, as it would require shuffling some chairs. It isn't that any of our defensemen are bad NHL'ers, they just mostly fit the same mold, so what would be ideal, which won't happen of course, is to find an upgrade that we can make a package for. Not just any old random physical tough as nails guy. But that player is kind of hard to find, so I get that people would think Edmundson might be a good consolation prize. I just don't see the fit, unless we have a season ending injury on the back end.
calder candidate
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No one saying that Barrie is bad but he can’t bring what Edmundson does bring and I don’t see the reste of the D bringing it either. Barrie can still do is thing while Edmundson get more time 5on5 or PK…
Kulak is great I probably was is bigger defender while he was with MTL but he ain’t Edmundson… he might be a faster but Edmundson isn’t a bad skater it pretty hard to get around him + he won’t fall while skating backward or get push out of the way… I don’t want to try to convince you that you need him personally don’t care about you team… I saw it as a very natural fit especially on 2nd pair with a guy like Barrie, if it ain’t I not going to argue with you but you can $hit all you want on Edmundson is a good and reliable #4 in the NHL. The fact that many here think he is some kind of fringe NHL player is just bizarre. Kulak the guy you are very happy with and acquired for a 2nd + wasn’t in the lineup every night in MTL while Edmundson was playing 23min, that is the gap that exist between those 2 players.
SwedishFire
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- Mar 3, 2011
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Well, a #4D isnt going to net a 1st rounder to begin with, but thats already being sorted out in this thread.
And that Edmundson you are talking about was before injury, and he isnt that now. So.... what to do now...
A slow defender wasnt a big deal before. Then being mean and physichal was all you needed. But now.
Deep analysis of todays NHL game : Slow defender in todays NHL sounds just sad. And thats also a hit to the sport. Speed cant be all, that destroys the diversity in the sport. hockey is great because all the elemnt was in it, but that seems to redeem. To bad. Anyways...
I can give you pulju + 2nd for Edmundson + 3rd. Pick swap
calder candidate
Registered User
They issue is guy that do it at a higher level aren’t #4D and even if they are available the cost acquisition or cap situation are going to be significant… I understand not wanting to fall into the trap of a player fitting the style but ultimately not being able to fill the role, but Edmundson, has proved to be able to do that job consistently, I would understand more if we were talking about a guy like Schenn A rental that was never able to handle it and who looking good on a bad team with a good partner, won cup with a great team but didn’t contribute playing 10min, to me that the kind of guy that I would be skeptical of and see as consolation prize.
ManofSteel55
Registered User
I'd rather Schenn than Edmundson based on current play. Edmundson has been far less consistent than Schenn this season. Not that I think either fill the need. I know what we need isn't going to be available, which is why I'd just rather not blow our wad on a depth guy that won't make us any better, like either Edmundson or Schenn.
What's makes you think Edmonton defense is any better man wise than Montreal???..short answer is....they are not better man wise. Edmundson is better in 80 percent of game play than barrie especially at playoff time . Of course you need an upgrade at 1rhd or 2 lhd LOL...that doesn't mean JE isn't an slight upgrade...try again
ManofSteel55
Registered User
You're rambling again. Edmundson isn't awesome in Montreal this year, so why would we even want to try him out? I won't respond to your player assessments further as it is obvious you don't know what you are talking about, but even IF he is a slight upgrade on any of Edmonton's current defensemen, a "slight" upgrade is worth a mid round pick. Montreal wants more for him than that. So the value isn't a fit.
Why would a defensively poor team want an upgrade at defence right??? Logic and advanced stats say he is middle.of the pack defender which would be an improvement over several Edmonton D including Barrie.
Your a novice but that's OK. I never once said I would pay a first but that's doesn't mean he won't fetch a decent pick and Edmonton needs all the help they can get. Think about it like this homer ....Edmonton doesn't have alot of upgrade options . They don't have alot.of playoff hope either, but without an improvement it's over before it starts . You can sit desperately on your 2md round pick pray the hockey gods drop a decent defensive D in your lap before mcdavid bolts or you can improve yoir team....regardless they ain't winning anyways but really only a few pcs away..LOL schools out
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