Player Discussion Jimmy Vesey

[haveandare]

Look at this guy from Arizona



http://www.todaysslapshot.com/one-timers/craigs-list-vesey-makes-curious-choice-maloney-moves-on/

Craig Morgan is another one of these clueless hockey writers. The 2nd contract was a big factor. Craig needs to pay more attention.



http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/...and_harvard_star_is_narrowing_list_for_monday

Most of the these guys are a bunch of lazy bums. They complain about having to work and travel during the season. They have the entire summer or winter off depending upon which sport they cover. Most of these guys can't attend a morning practice after a night game.

Rob Vollman bases everything on statistics. He looks at past ECAC players and compares them to Vesey.

I love the idea that his second contract will be based on anything other than how he plays during his first one.

If he plays like a top 6 winger for the first deal he'll be paid handsomely in the second one regardless of what team he's on. If he plays like garbage he probably won't get a second one no matter the team.

 

[Beacon]

I just watched some old rangers games off iTunes and damn every game I watched brassard was a huge factor in the games ... Even if he wasn't putting up points he was setting up plays etc

Hope this kid we got in the trade can fill in cause that was a big loss for us

We can rebuild right now on the fly by trading guys like Brassard for really good young kids like Mika or we can wait 3 years and get scraps. We could've got a real return for Adam Graves in 1998 when he still had a 38-goal season ahead of him, but we chose to wait until after his 10-goal season and instead traded him for Mikael Samuelsson who was promptly shipped away after an 8-goal season. Even Leetch didn't bring back all that much (in the end of it was Korpikoski, who was sent away for Enver Lisin).

The lesson: trade the vets while they have their maximum value or suffer through half a decade of Dark Ages.

 

[aufheben]

I love the idea that his second contract will be based on anything other than how he plays during his first one.

If he plays like a top 6 winger for the first deal he'll be paid handsomely in the second one regardless of what team he's on. If he plays like garbage he probably won't get a second one no matter the team.

Are you looking at the facts though? The Rangers have finished 3rd and 7th in goal-scoring the last two seasons. Do you see 1st, overall? I don't.

 

[Levitate]

We can rebuild right now on the fly by trading guys like Brassard for really good young kids like Mika or we can wait 3 years and get scraps. We could've got a real return for Adam Graves in 1998 when he still had a 38-goal season ahead of him, but we chose to wait until after his 10-goal season and instead traded him for Mikael Samuelsson who was promptly shipped away after an 8-goal season. Even Leetch didn't bring back all that much (in the end of it was Korpikoski, who was sent away for Enver Lisin).

The lesson: trade the vets while they have their maximum value or suffer through half a decade of Dark Ages.

There are some guys you don't trade even if they're on the other side of 30, because they're still good and you won't get a return that makes up for it. However, the Rangers don't have anyone like that other than possibly Lundqvist.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

That's because 90% of prospects are overrated by fans. When a team says that so-and-so is a good prospect, the fans think they might be getting a star. There's an absolute frenzy around anyone who scores over 100 points in the Juniors, and even a point per game leads to talk of how good the kid is. But ppg guys rarely make the NHL and 100 points is not uncommon in the Juniors. The lottery doesn't produce the expected results either: the problem is that outside of the top 2-3 picks, you're as likely to get a third line scrub as a first liner, but the hype that you got a "top-10 pick" gives fans hope for years.

Then the kid hits the pros and unless he performs better than 70% of 100-point CHLers, better than 95% of ppg CHLers, and better than 50% of those drafted at #4-10, he's just a run of the mill NHL role player or even a bust. The team that is empty of quality NHLers adds a couple role players, maybe one top-6 guy, but fails to get significantly better. The confused fans just can't understand how their great prospect pool with a dozen guys scoring 70-100 points in the CHL didn't result in the bright future they were all expecting.

Edmonton, however, is different. For one, they got a legit superstar in McDavid. On top of that, they got a ton of support staff like Draisatl, RHN, Eberle, Nurse, Klefbom, and Hall/Larsson, etc. They were so bad for so long that they couldn't help themselves but get better.

Exactly. Prospect pool is 1 thing, but our team has a core of proven NHL-players who are still in their RFA years. Kreider, Stepan, Zibanejad, Miller, Hayes and McDonagh are all proven NHL-players and aside from Zibanejad and Miller, they all have quite a lot of post-season experience too.

I pick 5 players with their experience at age 26 and under over a prospect pool Toronto has which is considered the most talented in the NHL. We are not missing out first rounders.

 

[Luger]

The Rangers were the oldest team in the NHL last season, but are much younger now. Counting F12 and D6 regulars with Lindberg in and Glass out (you gotta believe that a more experienced Lindberg beats out an older Glass, with McIlrath in the lineup) this is what I got.

The forwards' avg age was 28.0 in the playoffs. In October/November, the avg age will be 25.4.

The blue line avg age was 32. It will be 27.5.

The team avg went from 29.15 to 26.55.

That's enough to be in the youngest 10. If Gorton finds a way to deal away Staal and Girardi and replace them with someone younger, it would drop the avg age to 26.

 

[JanErixon20]

I popped up the Isles board over the weekend. Not sure if we can repost stuff from other boards so I won't, but there was one where the poster was obviously pissed off and frustrated. Vesey will be Josh Bailey light, basically, and the Isles forwards are 1000 times better then what the Rangers have. He listed guys in the minors and juniors and some KHL player who he compared to Buch.. How great their defense and prospect pool is and of course, Tavares. I just imagined the guy turned red as he wrote more and more.

As for Vesey, I am glad he signed here but I honestly don't know much about him. But I do like how the Rangers have adjusted to not having the picks using these free agents the past couple of years. I wasn't looking forward to last season but I am looking forward to this upcoming one.

 

[Irishguy42]

I popped up the Isles board over the weekend. Not sure if we can repost stuff from other boards so I won't, but there was one where the poster was obviously pissed off and frustrated. Vesey will be Josh Bailey light, basically, and the Isles forwards are 1000 times better then what the Rangers have. He listed guys in the minors and juniors and some KHL player who he compared to Buch.. How great their defense and prospect pool is and of course, Tavares. I just imagined the guy turned red as he wrote more and more.

As for Vesey, I am glad he signed here but I honestly don't know much about him. But I do like how the Rangers have adjusted to not having the picks using these free agents the past couple of years. I wasn't looking forward to last season but I am looking forward to this upcoming one.

I'd love to see those names. Because I highly doubt that the Islanders have more than one prospect who is as skilled as Buchnevich is.

The Islanders don't have that astounding of a blueline. And their goalie carousel is not the best.

 

[JanErixon20]

I'd love to see those names. Because I highly doubt that the Islanders have more than one prospect who is as skilled as Buchnevich is.

The Islanders don't have that astounding of a blueline. And their goalie carousel is not the best.

This is a portion of the post, I hope it's okay to repost, if not, apologies...

PLUS solid young players like Lee, Nelson, Strome, Cizikas, etc.; PLUS five (5) legit blue-chip prospects like Barzal, Bellows, Beauvillier, MDC, Ho-Sang, etc. (that the Rangers simply cannot match)...
The Isles fourth-round pick, Anatolyi Golyshev, went 25-19-44 in 56 KHL games and he isn't even close to the top of the Isles prospect pool, like Buchevich is for the Rag$.

I'm not one for talking up prospects. Who the hell knows what an 18 year old kid is going to turn into.

And to be fair, there were more then one Islander fan posts basically saying the Rangers aren't as bad, or in as bad of shape, as Islanders fans think they are.

 

[Irishguy42]

This is a portion of the post, I hope it's okay to repost, if not, apologies...

PLUS solid young players like Lee, Nelson, Strome, Cizikas, etc.; PLUS five (5) legit blue-chip prospects like Barzal, Bellows, Beauvillier, MDC, Ho-Sang, etc. (that the Rangers simply cannot match)...
The Isles fourth-round pick, Anatolyi Golyshev, went 25-19-44 in 56 KHL games and he isn't even close to the top of the Isles prospect pool, like Buchevich is for the Rag$.

I'm not one for talking up prospects. Who the hell knows what an 18 year old kid is going to turn into.

And to be fair, there were more then one Islander fan posts basically saying the Rangers aren't as bad, or in as bad of shape, as Islanders fans think they are.

Someone needs to eat a Snickers.

I saw later that Buchnevich would apparently be the 9th best prospect on the Islanders. LMAO.

 

[Tawnos]

Cmon guys it always happens like this, even around here. Prospects are always talked about as if they'll definitely be making the NHL and hitting their ceiling, while its more likely to remain skeptical about other teams prospects.

On the other hand, while almost no elite players have come out of this, the Rangers are pretty damn great at developing guys in NHL players.

 

[Beacon]

Cmon guys it always happens like this, even around here. Prospects are always talked about as if they'll definitely be making the NHL and hitting their ceiling, while its more likely to remain skeptical about other teams prospects.

On the other hand, while almost no elite players have come out of this, the Rangers are pretty damn great at developing guys in NHL players.

Truth is the Rangers missed out big by not getting Stamkos. I know people don't like the idea of getting UFAs for a ton of money, but every team that won the Cup had an elite center. Stamkos qualifies, Stepan doesn't. Stamkos scored over a point per game in 5 of his 8 NHL seasons, and I am not a big believer that he's on the way down as a 26 year old, same age as Stepan.

Plus, instead of getting Mika for Brassard, the Rangers would've gotten a good defenseman, or alternatively, Brass for Mika, then Stepan for a defenseman.

The cap space would've been easy to make: we have about $3 left open right now, so trade Nash and the cap space is wide open. Ultimately, the Rangers will need to figure out a way to acquire a star center because one is not coming from withing the organization.

 

[FLYLine27*]

In March, Pierre McGuire was on TSN 1050 and said the following about Jimmy Vesey:

He was head and shoulders better than anyone else on the ice at at Harvard/BC practice he attended
"Jimmy Vesey was off the charts"
"He is a tremendous kid"
Vesey is fluent in both English and Mandarin
"Brilliant kid"
His linemates at the World Juniors were JT Miller and Johnny Gaudreau
He is NHL ready
He is an "extreme talent."

He said on TSN 690 in March "he is a brilliant kid who takes pride that he went to Harvard University and will graduate from there. That kid is above reproach, he is a phenomenal, phenomenal young man. That is solid as solid can be."

Pierre added that Vesey is "a Home Run offensive player. He's ready. He is going to be a very good offensive player."

Thanks Pierre

https://www.sny.tv/rangers/news/pierre-mcguire-is-a-big-fan-of-jimmy-vesey/197030584

 

[darko]

Thanks Pierre

https://www.sny.tv/rangers/news/pierre-mcguire-is-a-big-fan-of-jimmy-vesey/197030584

Massive praise.

 

[Placid]

Truth is the Rangers missed out big by not getting Stamkos. I know people don't like the idea of getting UFAs for a ton of money, but every team that won the Cup had an elite center. Stamkos qualifies, Stepan doesn't. Stamkos scored over a point per game in 5 of his 8 NHL seasons, and I am not a big believer that he's on the way down as a 26 year old, same age as Stepan.

Plus, instead of getting Mika for Brassard, the Rangers would've gotten a good defenseman, or alternatively, Brass for Mika, then Stepan for a defenseman.

The cap space would've been easy to make: we have about $3 left open right now, so trade Nash and the cap space is wide open. Ultimately, the Rangers will need to figure out a way to acquire a star center because one is not coming from withing the organization.

No no no. And no. I for one hope that there wont be any more ****** contracts (IE, big contracts which you then cannot get rid of). The Rangers have had more than their share of those, and Stamkos would have added yet another.

Is Stamkos an excellent player ? Yes he is, absolutely no question about that. But i am happy we passed on him.

I'll also repeat my belief that we are certainly not a center upgrade away from a cup

 

[Kovalev27]

Now that he's a Ranger let's see Pierre's updated article where he's a nice player but not enough of an impact player to really help the Rangers who are in big trouble......

 

[TheTakedown]

Seriously, what an absolutely horrible trade in hindsight. Eric Staal was utterly useless.

Would have better off keeping Saarella and the 2 2nd round picks, and trading Yandle at the deadline if they NEVER planned on resigning him.

Right?! They went from possibly gaining a 1st, an A+ prospect, and a replacement roster player to spending 2 2nd's + a B- Prospect, and getting stomped in 5 games. So sad.

 

[haohmaru]

There's no way a team that's 2nd or 3rd in the conference is trading their 1 or 1A D at the deadline for draft picks. It remains a ridiculous narrative.

 

[Levitate]

There's no way a team that's 2nd or 3rd in the conference is trading their 1 or 1A D at the deadline for draft picks. It remains a ridiculous narrative.

Yeah I don't get why anyone thought that was a possibility. It's a fantasy world people need to stop living in

 

[FLYLine27*]

There's no way a team that's 2nd or 3rd in the conference is trading their 1 or 1A D at the deadline for draft picks. It remains a ridiculous narrative.

Who said anything about getting only draft picks?

How about a young defenseman who hasn't reached his potential yet, who can still step in and play good hockey? Obviously they wouldn't have made a trade if they were getting a replacement back for him.

Yandle's 1 point in the playoffs really did a lot.

 

[haohmaru]

Who said anything about getting only draft picks?

How about a young defenseman who hasn't reached his potential yet, who can still step in and play good hockey?

Yandle's 1 point in the playoff really did a lot.

Show me the last time a team 2nd in the conference traded their best offensive defenseman and possibly best defenseman at the deadline for lesser players and draft picks. Or anything else.

Citing what Yandle, or the team, did two months later is meaningless speculative hindsight.

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

We can mock Pierre for all his quirks and superlatives, but the guy knows the game and is a good spotter of talent.

 

[RangerBoy]

I keep checking my phone but the Rangers already landed Vesey.

 

[Doctor King Schultz]

We can mock Pierre for all his quirks and superlatives, but the guy knows the game and is a good spotter of talent.

Like Kovalev said I wouldn't be surprised if Pierre changes his story now that the Rangers picked him up

 

[JanErixon20]

Truth is the Rangers missed out big by not getting Stamkos. I know people don't like the idea of getting UFAs for a ton of money, but every team that won the Cup had an elite center. Stamkos qualifies, Stepan doesn't. Stamkos scored over a point per game in 5 of his 8 NHL seasons, and I am not a big believer that he's on the way down as a 26 year old, same age as Stepan.

Plus, instead of getting Mika for Brassard, the Rangers would've gotten a good defenseman, or alternatively, Brass for Mika, then Stepan for a defenseman.

The cap space would've been easy to make: we have about $3 left open right now, so trade Nash and the cap space is wide open. Ultimately, the Rangers will need to figure out a way to acquire a star center because one is not coming from withing the organization.

Not sure if the Rangers were ever really going to get Stamkos. And, "trade Nash." Easier said then done.