Speculation: Jets General Rumour, Trade, Free Agent and Waiver Speculation 15-16 Part XIII

[sully1410]

I think your valuation is reasonable. Trouba hasn't shown much (or had the opportunity to show much) that should put him above that amount. I don't really think Jones is fully in the discussion as a comparable, he'd be the upper absolute boundary. But with any of these negotiations you're buying up UFA years on speculation so they'll cost more driving the AAV up.

Also still think we're seeing a shift in where the max value contract for players will be going forward. It'll be one of two deals, when they are coming off their ELC, typically with 4 years of RFA left. The second will be when they're coming out of that RFA/UFA combined deal they signed.

Eight year deals will favor the teams in the sense that Trouba would be 28. Still young but you'll hear rumblings about him "being close to 30" during the next negotiation so you'll likely see shorter terms (5 years), maybe with higher AAV kind of like Buff's deal. A six year deal would favor the player - in Trouba's case (or Scheifele's for that matter) he's more likely to get a better, longer contract coming off a six year deal at 26 because the meme will be "just a year over 25" but at 26 the agent will be spinning it something along the lines of "well, at 30 you gave Buff a big deal for five years carrying him out to 35 years old, so my client being 26 will want an 8 year deal with similar AAV (would be nine but eight is max term). Six years and eight years gives a guy like Trouba 14 years of pay. Eight year deal out of ELC likely only results in a five year deal subsequently meaning he loses a year of term (he could sign again as a 34 year old of course) and probably overall a decrease in AAV.

So why would these guys sign an eight year deal? I can't imagine any agent thinks they are good ideas. Seven as you propose? Kind of that compromise where maybe you get consecutive seven year deals. I think if I'm a player with no loyalties early in my career then I really only want to sign a six year deal. And that's not to cast aspersions on Trouba's loyalty or not, it's just good business sense.

I totally agree. This was my summation as well in another thread awhile ago.

The only way you'd get these guy to sign for eight is if you jack the price up at the end of it to reflect what their ability is at the end of it. Which most teams won't do because there is a lot of inherent risk in doing that. And the player won't go for keeping it at the same number because they will have progressed past it (in their mind anyways) and are leaving as much as six million on the table for those two extra years.

Six is much more likely at this stage.

 

[Hobble]

I hope Chevy screens his calls today, because Canadian GMs are getting hosed in trades.

Just put your head down between your knees and pray.

 

[folix]

I hope Chevy screens his calls today, because Canadian GMs are getting hosed in trades.

Just put your head down between your knees and pray.

Am I the only one who knows Subban is a hated personality? Publically he says and does all the right things, however inside that dressing room he does have his issues.

As well his defensive game is rather lax, and for the first couple years the Habs win this deal. I suppose they could always just buy Weber out after his productivity vs his money isnt very good.

Id rather have Laine going up against Subban then Weber.

The Oilers on the other hand, should we be calling and offering Myers for McDavid?

 

[folix]

Am I the only one who knows Subban is a hated personality? Publically he says and does all the right things, however inside that dressing room he does have his issues.

As well his defensive game is rather lax, and for the first couple years the Habs win this deal. I suppose they could always just buy Weber out after his productivity vs his money isnt very good.

Id rather have Laine going up against Subban then Weber.

The Oilers on the other hand, should we be calling and offering Myers for McDavid?

If im Chevy im looking now at what Myers or Enstrom's value is.

 

[RustyCat]

Not only did Jim Benning not get PK, he is out 50k for being a moron.

As a side note, got to think the barometer is set for Trouba to get a deal done here with the likes of Reilly and Jones showing market value.

 

[sully1410]

Am I the only one who knows Subban is a hated personality? Publically he says and does all the right things, however inside that dressing room he does have his issues.

As well his defensive game is rather lax, and for the first couple years the Habs win this deal. I suppose they could always just buy Weber out after his productivity vs his money isnt very good.

Id rather have Laine going up against Subban then Weber.

The Oilers on the other hand, should we be calling and offering Myers for McDavid?

There is no way you could possibly know that.

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

I'd be shopping trouba rigjt now after seeing the return jersey got for Larsson haha

 

[Savardian Spinarama]

There is no way you could possibly know that.

I agree, and I was under the impression that when making statements like this (I've seen others on other threads), you need to point to something substantial to bolster these sorts of statements. Not a "I know a guy who knew a guy", or "it's obvious by just the look on his face or the way he talks".

Like I said, I've seen similar statements without any clear indication of what evidence of bad behavior/attitude actually exists.

 

[sully1410]

I agree, and I was under the impression that when making statements like this (I've seen others on other threads), you need to point to something substantial to bolster these sorts of statements. Not a "I know a guy who knew a guy", or "it's obvious by just the look on his face or the way he talks".

Like I said, I've seen similar statements without any clear indication of what evidence of bad behavior/attitude actually exists.

As far as I'm concerned..if you can't source it, it didn't happen.

 

[Nickel eye Heel hers]

Am I the only one who knows Subban is a hated personality? Publically he says and does all the right things, however inside that dressing room he does have his issues.

As well his defensive game is rather lax, and for the first couple years the Habs win this deal. I suppose they could always just buy Weber out after his productivity vs his money isnt very good.

Id rather have Laine going up against Subban then Weber.

The Oilers on the other hand, should we be calling and offering Myers for McDavid?

Subban is a better player, yes even defensively, and younger than Weber. He would have to be hated pretty badly in the locker room. I would guess it might be a management issue with him more than a locker room issue, but really who knows ?
Use this link and compare the 2 players. shot suppression and possession are glaring differences. http://ownthepuck.blogspot.ca/

 

[Guardian17]

I'd be shopping trouba rigjt now after seeing the return jersey got for Larsson haha

I agree with this.

Maybe something will happen.

 

[almostawake]

I'd be shopping trouba rigjt now after seeing the return jersey got for Larsson haha

Edmonton was the only team that desperate for a defenceman.

It isn't a data point on the market for defencemen, it is a data point on how desperate Chiarelli was.

 

[mcpw]

I'd be shopping trouba rigjt now after seeing the return jersey got for Larsson haha

I'm keeping Trouba right now after seeing that good defensemen are almost impossible to acquire.

 

[wpgallday1960]

I'm keeping Trouba right now after seeing that good defensemen are almost impossible to acquire.

Not if Boston offer sheets him and we get 4 1st rounders. Tooo rich to give that up.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Hindsight is 20/20

keep in mind, at that time the Oilers made the Cup finals the season before

imagine if we rejected a hypothetical Boston offer, only for Boston to have 4 1st OA picks

I love Trouba and want him to be our cornerstone #1 for years to come and be happy if we matched him in this hypothetical scenario, but I would certainly look back at those odds and think "gee maybe we missed out"

I don't believe there was ever any substance to this rumour. But if there was I would take the 4 1sts without even blinking. Trouba is good and I have been posting all over HF boards telling people that he simply isn't available but he isn't worth 4 probably high firsts.

 

[mcpw]

Not if Boston offer sheets him and we get 4 1st rounders. Tooo rich to give that up.

That's literally the only "Trouba for futures" scenario in which I wouldn't burn my jersey.

 

[SLAYER]

That's literally the only "Trouba for futures" scenario in which I wouldn't burn my jersey.

Agreed.


Also, today has been great entertainment. HF Habs is crazy right now (I would be too).

 

[Puckatron 3000]

I don't believe there was ever any substance to this rumour.

Dunno. Today's D-man insanity is making me think it could be real.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Subban is a better player, yes even defensively, and younger than Weber. He would have to be hated pretty badly in the locker room. I would guess it might be a management issue with him more than a locker room issue, but really who knows ?
Use this link and compare the 2 players. shot suppression and possession are glaring differences. http://ownthepuck.blogspot.ca/

Bergevin chose to keep his questionable coach over Subban. One had to go. The 4 year difference in age between Subban and Weber = Habs got hosed IMO. Preds should have had to add a good piece here. Time will tell though.

 

[folix]

There is no way you could possibly know that.

Not the one "reporting it" go look back at media clips during subbans contract debacle it was well reported and documented his team mates seemed a whole lot happier with him not around.

 

[mcpw]

Not the one "reporting it" go look back at media clips during subbans contract debacle it was well reported and documented his team mates seemed a whole lot happier with him not around.

Devil's advocate (sort of):

Subban's teammates seem a whole lot happier with him not around.

That tells us a lot about his teammates' desire to win.

 

[nobody important]

Bergevin chose to keep his questionable coach over Subban.

Bergevin.
Therrien.
Subban.

Which of these is not like the others? I wouldn't downplay the importance of having a Francophone coach in Montreal.

 

[truck]

Devil's advocate (sort of):

Subban's teammates seem a whole lot happier with him not around.

That tells us a lot about his teammates' desire to win.

Seemed? When and where? Regardless, more losing won't help morale.

 

[Daximus]

Any interest in Brian Campbell?
I think the Jets should go after him in FA on a 2 or 3 year deal. He's better than Stuart, Chia, Postma and can be brought in to shelter Morrissey until he is ready.

Enstrom - Buff
Campbell - Trouba/Myers
Morrissey - Myers/Trouba

 

[Zhamnov10]

As far as I'm concerned..if you can't source it, it didn't happen.

If you have ever watched any Montreal games it is clear as day how some of the players felt about him.Exact same thing could have been said watching Kane interact with his jets teammates.