Going on a limb here, but would bet you that the majority around here finds Singin's posts a lot more readable than yours. But you be you.
Player Discussion Jeff Gorton Part II
- Thread starter Gardner McKay
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haohmaru
boomshakalaka
The real debate here should be whether or not Gorton should’ve drawn a line in the sand to begin with. DeAngelo crossing it left the GM little choice - “asset management” or not.
It "sounds" like the line was drawn by JD, Gorton, Quinn and frankly the leaders in the locker room.
haohmaru
boomshakalaka
eco's bones
Registered User
FWIW Bitetto last night played alright. 0 goals against in almost 15 minutes of ice time. He certainly doesn't have Tony's skill level but there is more commitment to keeping the puck out of our own net. I don't mind the idea of a 3rd pair that plays 12 to 15 minutes a night and isn't bleeding goals all the time.
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
I'm not sure I see a situation where there shouldn't have been a line drawn.
- Jan 18, 2012
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It sounds like Gorton drew the line tbh. He gave him his last warning and stayed true to this word. Good on him.
haveandare
Registered User
Agreed. I’m not sure anyone deserves infinite leeway, and the fact is Tony can put up nice points but he’s the 3rd best at his side here, and this year he’s done nothing but whine about being scratched and bleed goals against. Some guys will always get a little more room based on how important they are - he’s both not that important and constantly pushing his luck.
It's interesting all this ADA stuff because you see him on camera, hosting interviews with players, getting nominated for funniest guy on the team.
6 games in, 1 fight we know about. "Funniest on the team" and yet the whole locker room wants him gone after that?
Let's say there was a persistent history of issues and everyone was this close to the last straw? SO then why didn't you get rid of him for SOMETHING last season and why'd you give him that contract? That would make them idiots
A lot doesn't add up. It's possible this is bc I really question Gorton so my bias is maybe leading me to assume he just botched this whole thing... but it seems to me like they tried to overplay ADA on the trade market, refused to take a lower offer for him and then here's where it gets really stupid:
They gave him a big money 2 year deal KNOWING the FO AND the locker room was almost fed up with him. Really? That's really stupid.
Or he wasn't really on his last straw but him getting into a blow up after this game was bad enough that they said "let's waive him, killing all potential value. So now if no one picks up his contract we're totally screwed."
Of course there are other possibilities (I say this otherwise some mouth breather responds with "durrr or MAYBE it's this, duhhhh" bc they're too stupid to understand that Im saying this is just what I think happened.)
Either way, this FO sends a lot of alarm signals that make me wonder about their ability to think long term
6 games in, 1 fight we know about. "Funniest on the team" and yet the whole locker room wants him gone after that?
Let's say there was a persistent history of issues and everyone was this close to the last straw? SO then why didn't you get rid of him for SOMETHING last season and why'd you give him that contract? That would make them idiots
A lot doesn't add up. It's possible this is bc I really question Gorton so my bias is maybe leading me to assume he just botched this whole thing... but it seems to me like they tried to overplay ADA on the trade market, refused to take a lower offer for him and then here's where it gets really stupid:
They gave him a big money 2 year deal KNOWING the FO AND the locker room was almost fed up with him. Really? That's really stupid.
Or he wasn't really on his last straw but him getting into a blow up after this game was bad enough that they said "let's waive him, killing all potential value. So now if no one picks up his contract we're totally screwed."
Of course there are other possibilities (I say this otherwise some mouth breather responds with "durrr or MAYBE it's this, duhhhh" bc they're too stupid to understand that Im saying this is just what I think happened.)
Either way, this FO sends a lot of alarm signals that make me wonder about their ability to think long term
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haohmaru
boomshakalaka
Not an argument that I would make. Enough is enough and sometimes all the talent in the world isn’t worth the headache.
Sure, if you ignore the actual sequence of events then it sends a lot of alarm signals. However, if you read the information that's been shared, it all makes perfect sense. This huge rift with the team and Tony only developed in the last month or so. Which is... *checks calendar*.. several months after they gave him a new deal.
I literally acknowledged a lot of other possibilities but of course like I said in that post, doesn't matter how much I try to be fair and acknowledge other possibilities (I even acknowledged I might have a bias here) some HF NYR genius jumps in to say something stupid and/or condescending.
You actually think Im just talking about this ADA thing when I say "either way this FO sends a lot of alarming signals in regards to their ability to think long term"? Be smarter than that.
You actually think Im just talking about this ADA thing when I say "either way this FO sends a lot of alarming signals in regards to their ability to think long term"? Be smarter than that.
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
Sure, but with the full benefit of hindsight JG should have foreseen this.
That does not seem to be the case at all. It seems like Tony was on his best behavior last year and had his best professional season. As such, Gorton and JD figured that a two year gamble was worth it and that even if he was not viewed as part of the long term, he could help the team for the next several years, probably get his value up and they an move him as a part of a bigger deal.
For whatever reason, DeAngelo backslid this year, became an issue in the locker room this year. This is without any of his play on the ice. Was talked to multiple times by management, coaching staff and his own teammates. Went out and mouthed off to a ref and slammed the door. Got properly disciplined for it, but let it affect him. And then promptly instigated an altercation with a teammate.
Not really sure what crystal ball you expect Gorton and JD to have to have foreseen all of this.
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
I think there might have been some of JG/D saying "we're going to make a long-term investment in you and a long-term commitment to you. But we need your best behavior moving forward. And when you're on your best behavior, we've all seen how valuable you can be." Obviously not those exact words, but that idea.
And my comment above was pure factiousness.
not really once it starts affecting the locker room itself and pissing players off, u have to defend the other players if u are management.
He can say his opinions all he wants, but when people tell him to stop or dont want to engage, u have to respect that. Apparently he didnt on many occasions and that is what turned some of his teammates against him.
Oh, I know. Besides, what he does not realize that you are not simply my friend. But my faithful sidekick (now how many long ago years was that?).
Just the fact I saw this tacked onto the end let me know there was no reason to read the rest since you have to be almost TRYING to misconstrue what I said (while ignoring how often "his history, his history!" has been a part of this discussion) in order to think this is at all a valid or intelligent remark.
It's ok to have a discussion without turning it into some kind of pissing contest where you make bitter ass, sarcastic comments while failing to understand the point in the first place. Don't bother responding.
If the rest of your comment was fair and insightful well that sucks but you have a pattern at this point and I just don't feel like rolling my eyes at it again
You're needlessly speculating to support your own bias when we have virtually all the information needed to draw a clear conclusion and I'm the one who needs to be smarter? There are no "what ifs" here. We know virtually everything about the incident and the timeline leading up to it.
If you want to make your own fantasies up to support your bias against Gorton go right ahead. However, you don't get to freely post them without some "HFNYR genius" (Thank you, by the way. I appreciate the compliment.) informing you that it's utter nonsense.
Cool, but that's not what you said in the version of your post that I quoted. Nice try though.
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
Me, "Look I might just have a bias here so this is only what I think, there are other possibilities"
You: "Your bias clearly is manipulating you into thinking things! So that justifies me being a dick about it!"
K
From the outside, it just seems like you are trying to continue your vendetta against Gorton and JD by tying the DeAngelo situation around their collective necks for having extended him. That, in turn, warrants the crystal ball line.
