Speculation: Jakob Chychrun being held out of the Coyotes lineup until a trade is completed

[Golden_Jet]

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So keeps getting lower

 

[hbk]

Only other time was Hall with the Devils. They lied, sure and said he was hurt.

The way it's trending, he isn't going to be dealt by the deadline.

Guess we will see. Seems to be some cap clearing going on by teams with interest.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Guess we will see. Seems to be some cap clearing going on by teams with interest.

Hopefully.

Hopefully Columbus deals Gavrikov soon, too.

Just get this shit moving

 

[Schennanigans]

The way things are going for Arizona, they could win the draft lotto only to have Bedard pull a Lindros on draft day.

That worked out pretty well for Quebec/Colorado though. .

 

[Phion Keneuf]

Call me crazy but does sitting Chychrun potentially lower his value? Teams know that he will most likely get dealt now, otherwise not a good look for the team - scratch buddy and then just tell him to start playing after the TDL.

Plus in the event that he mails it in after TDL / potentially gets injured could ruin his value at the draft.

If I was Yotes GM I’d take best offer I could now. With that said, not a fan of the “sitting for potential trade” route that some teams are taking.

 

[PainForShane]

Which is kind of the opposite of the flex you're promoting it as, because it just emphasizes that force feeding Chychrun preferential deployment is to the detriment of the team and he's not the difference maker his reported desired trade value suggests he is.

Force feeding Chychrun preferential deployment is that right? You're too good of a poster to write nonsense like this.

He's averaging over 23 minutes a game, plays 1st pair on the Yotes (with GhostBear), tops on the team in ice time. If you actually believe it's possible for one of the league's worst rosters to shelter their #1 defenseman for 23 minutes a game (or some version of sheltering), I really don't know what to tell you

 

[FlyguyOX]

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Definitely a fair ask

 

[DKH]

Bruins need to decide which of Gavrikov or Chychrun they are getting by the weekend

 

[Guttersniped]

Which is kind of the opposite of the flex you're promoting it as, because it just emphasizes that force feeding Chychrun preferential deployment is to the detriment of the team and he's not the difference maker his reported desired trade value suggests he is.

I’m not flexing or promoting anything.

I’m poking fun at the over-the-top, irrational outrage of a few melodramatic posters who are calling for the league to take action because Chychrun has sat out 5 games.

A team picking up wins and loser points in a little hot streak can happen for a number of reasons. (I don’t really care why the Coyotes got 8 points in 5 games but good for those plucky players and their new-ish coach.)

 

[toddkaz]

I’m not flexing or promoting anything.

I’m poking fun at the over-the-top, irrational outrage of a few melodramatic posters who are calling for the league to take action because Chychrun has sat out 5 games.

A team picking up wins and loser points in a little hot streak can happen for a number of reasons. (I don’t really care why the Coyotes got 8 points in 5 games but good for those plucky players and their new-ish coach.)

Why do you feel its irrational if three teams are doing it weeks before the deadline?

 

[hbk]

Why do you feel its irrational if three teams are doing it weeks before the deadline?

It’s apparently only an issue when AZ does it.

 

[Guttersniped]

Why do you feel its irrational if three teams are doing it weeks before the deadline?

The TDL is 1 week and 2 days away.

Luke Schenn has missed one game (2/21). Wow. Outrageous.

Vladislav Gavrikov has missed 4 games (2/14, 2/16, 2/18, 2/19)

Chychrun has missed 5 games (2/13, 2/15, 2/18, 2/19, 2/22)

Big whoop. People who are making a big deal about this are being irrational.

These teams and players are still competing and trying to win.

Non-playoff teams will do things that hurt their competitiveness because of the “non-playoff” part though.

They trade roster players in non-hockey trades for future assets. They’re more conservative with injured players, quicker to shut them down and/or have them get surgery.

One of the benefits of those moves is that they open up roster spots to prospects and/or give bigger roles to young players. The teams focus more on development and the future.

So it’s not a big deal to me for these 3 players to miss these few games.

In some cases the GMs might have thought a trade was eminent, for it to only hit a snag after the player was held out.

Once they hold a guy out for a trade it’s ridiculous to go “whoops, never mind, you need to play a few more games here”. It’s an unfair emotional rollercoaster for the player.

So yeah, irrational.

 

[The don godfather]

I think its Bruins holding all this up between gavrikov or chychrun hopefully its chychrun.

 

[GhostofYotesFan47]

Call me crazy but does sitting Chychrun potentially lower his value? Teams know that he will most likely get dealt now, otherwise not a good look for the team - scratch buddy and then just tell him to start playing after the TDL.

Plus in the event that he mails it in after TDL / potentially gets injured could ruin his value at the draft.

If I was Yotes GM I’d take best offer I could now. With that said, not a fan of the “sitting for potential trade” route that some teams are taking.

I don't mean any disrespect in what I'm about to say, but I'm afraid it's unavailable.

That's a losers mentality. Don't trade your stuff for under market value because you fear you'll miss out. I'd sooner let Chychrun walk than let another GM take advantage of me. Set the precedent now, you want my cool toy? Awesome, here's the cost. Chychrun is absolutely a valuable player, his only concern to a GM should be injuries. At his production and cap hit, even if he misses 25% of the season, he's a steal.

I won't touch heavily on the sitting him for trade purposes part because I've talked a ton on it. Bottom line, I think it's fine and even smart given the fact we got burned last TDL/Summer. Plus, I don't give a crap if a team wants to sit a player for any reason other than malice.

If you want a stud on you blue line, meet BA's ask, otherwise move on as far as I'm concerned. I'm totally into keeping, and ideally resigning our best defenseman since prime OEL (who was also a stud).

 

[toddkaz]

The TDL is 1 week and 2 days away.

Luke Schenn has missed one game (2/21). Wow. Outrageous.

Vladislav Gavrikov has missed 4 games (2/14, 2/16, 2/18, 2/19)

Chychrun has missed 5 games (2/13, 2/15, 2/18, 2/19, 2/22)

Big whoop. People who are making a big deal about this are being irrational.

These teams and players are still competing and trying to win.

Non-playoff teams will do things that hurt their competitiveness because of the “non-playoff” part though.

They trade roster players in non-hockey trades for future assets. They’re more conservative with injured players, quicker to shut them down and/or have them get surgery.

One of the benefits of those moves is that they open up roster spots to prospects and/or give bigger roles to young players. The teams focuses more on development and the future.

So it’s not a big deal to me for these 3 players to miss these few games.

In some cases the GMs might have thought a trade was eminent, for it to only hit a snag after the player was held out.

Once they hold a guy out for a trade it’s ridiculous to go “whoops, never mind, you need to play a few more games here”. It’s an unfair emotional rollercoaster for the player.

So yeah, irrational.

So tanking by scratching players weeks before the deadline and questioning it is irrational?


Wow, cool.

 

[PainForShane]

I don't mean any disrespect in what I'm about to say, but I'm afraid it's unavailable.

That's a losers mentality. Don't trade your stuff for under market value because you fear you'll miss out. I'd sooner let Chychrun walk than let another GM take advantage of me. Set the precedent now, you want my cool toy? Awesome, here's the cost. Chychrun is absolutely a valuable player, his only concern to a GM should be injuries. At his production and cap hit, even if he misses 25% of the season, he's a steal.

I won't touch heavily on the sitting him for trade purposes part because I've talked a ton on it. Bottom line, I think it's fine and even smart given the fact we got burned last TDL/Summer. Plus, I don't give a crap if a team wants to sit a player for any reason other than malice.

If you want a stud on you blue line, meet BA's ask, otherwise move on as far as I'm concerned. I'm totally into keeping, and ideally resigning our best defenseman since prime OEL (who was also a stud).

The bolded above is a really good point that no one is talking about, thx YotesFan.

Our GM Bill Armstrong is a first time GM, he was involved in the Blues org for something crazy like 30 years or something, he started as a scout and worked his way up. He's a hockey lifer, one of those people who lives like a block away from the office and probably sleeps there half the time. Everyone in hockey respects him. But, this is the first time he's a GM.

Re: Chychrun, he's said the price publicly so many times literally everyone knows what Chychrun will cost to acquire. 2 firsts, and a second rounder or equivalent. It is known. So, if Bill settles for less of a return, literally no other GM will ever take him seriously in a trade ask for the rest of Bill's career.

So, Bill can't trade Chychrun for less than the original ask, he's basically backed himself into a corner. At this point he really doesn't have a choice

 

[kingsfan28]

The bolded above is a really good point that no one is talking about, thx YotesFan.

Our GM Bill Armstrong is a first time GM, he was involved in the Blues org for something crazy like 30 years or something, he started as a scout and worked his way up. He's a hockey lifer, one of those people who lives like a block away from the office and probably sleeps there half the time. Everyone in hockey respects him. But, this is the first time he's a GM.

Re: Chychrun, he's said the price publicly so many times literally everyone knows what Chychrun will cost to acquire. 2 firsts, and a second rounder or equivalent. It is known. So, if Bill settles for less of a return, literally no other GM will ever take him seriously in a trade ask for the rest of Bill's career.

So, Bill can't trade Chychrun for less than the original ask, he's basically backed himself into a corner. At this point he really doesn't have a choice

He totally can, It's just a starting point. No GM is that stubborn and wouldn't tank a deal, especially one that includes a guy who doesn't want to play there. I bet when Echel was traded, Buffalo wanted 2 first or more, they settled on one plus two players. The 2nd he wants could be a first round prospect or of equal value, so he still gets his 2nd 1st rounder. He may want 2 picks , but nobody's going to give him that.

 

[Faterson]

Can we shorten the thread title a little bit? I suggest:

Chychrun Nothingburger

Sounds a bit like Chicken Hamburger, but it shouldn't confuse too many seasoned HFBoards posters.

Above all else, it would more accurately describe the contents of this thread. (Only 1193 posts so far, really negligible.)

 

[Schemp]

The bolded above is a really good point that no one is talking about, thx YotesFan.

Our GM Bill Armstrong is a first time GM, he was involved in the Blues org for something crazy like 30 years or something, he started as a scout and worked his way up. He's a hockey lifer, one of those people who lives like a block away from the office and probably sleeps there half the time. Everyone in hockey respects him. But, this is the first time he's a GM.

Re: Chychrun, he's said the price publicly so many times literally everyone knows what Chychrun will cost to acquire. 2 firsts, and a second rounder or equivalent. It is known. So, if Bill settles for less of a return, literally no other GM will ever take him seriously in a trade ask for the rest of Bill's career.

So, Bill can't trade Chychrun for less than the original ask, he's basically backed himself into a corner. At this point he really doesn't have a choice

My take is that GMBA still has that scouting mentality. He tries to be overly transparent. He 1st came to Jakob and said he had been getting calls on JC, thinking it was a compliment, that other teams want him. It backfired, Chychrun then told him that he would be okay if they traded him telling Bill Armstrong he wants to play meaningful games and play for a contender and not go through another rebuild. Understandable, considering how competitive he is. Every indication I get from this saga is that Chychrun would be okay if he stayed a Coyote, GMBA is very transparent and not jerking him around, and the Coyotes are competitive, but lack that top offensive skilled players, case in point, the impact Maccelli has had since coming back. GMBA is trying to get those players through the draft and is staying away from overpaying through free agency. I can't see Jakob Chychrun be disappointed if the Coyotes make the playoffs next season while he stays a Coyote. IMO, the trade deadline is the last opportunity teams can bid on JC, afterwards it will be too late.

 

[Schemp]

He totally can, It's just a starting point. No GM is that stubborn and wouldn't tank a deal, especially one that includes a guy who doesn't want to play there. I bet when Echel was traded, Buffalo wanted 2 first or more, they settled on one plus two players. The 2nd he wants could be a first round prospect or of equal value, so he still gets his 2nd 1st rounder. He may want 2 picks, but nobody's going to give him that.

It isn't about Chychrun doesn't want to be in AZ, it never has. It always been wanting to compete in the playoffs. Anyone that knows Chychrun, knows he is a competitor and there is no animosity to the Coyotes organization. Either pay the price or he stays a Coyote.

 

[Habs Halifax]

So tanking by scratching players weeks before the deadline and questioning it is irrational?


Wow, cool.

Personally, I think they should make it against the rules to scratch a healthy player like that. We all get it, they are trying to get futures in a rebuild but what about the player? Seems lob sided towards team management in this case. If the player wanted to play and the team said no, I wonder where that would lead to? I guess he is welcoming the time off?

Scratching players like this actually makes the Escrow get higher. Why? Cause the Coyotes have to replace him in the line-up. Even if it's a $1M player, that still chews into the salary cap. Not a huge effect but an effect none the less.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Personally, I think they should make it against the rules to scratch a healthy player like that. We all get it, they are trying to get futures in a rebuild but what about the player? Seems lob sided towards team management in this case. If the player wanted to play and the team said no, I wonder where that would lead to? I guess he is welcoming the time off?

Scratching players like this actually makes the Escrow get higher. Why? Cause the Coyotes have to replace him in the line-up. Even if it's a $1M player, that still chews into the salary cap. Not a huge effect but an effect none the less.

I don't think the player cares, he gets to go home and chill, he gets paid, he gets to heal up, and he doesn't have to play for a shit team.

Now in this case it might be frustrating because Arizona has been screwing with him for 2 years and he's probably sick of it but in general I don't think the player cares.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

Scratching players like this actually makes the Escrow get higher. Why? Cause the Coyotes have to replace him in the line-up. Even if it's a $1M player, that still chews into the salary cap. Not a huge effect but an effect none the less.

Incorrect. If Chychrun is in the lineup, his replacement is in the press box but still getting paid and still counting against the cap. Nothing changes.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Incorrect. If Chychrun is in the lineup, his replacement is in the press box but still getting paid and still counting against the cap. Nothing changes.

I guess so cause then it's still a 23 man roster and 3 guys sit.

 

[D Wakaluk]

Watch him not being traded - returning to play - and getting injured