Speculation: Jakob Chychrun being held out of the Coyotes lineup until a trade is completed

[Nona Di Giuseppe]

Chychrun to the jackets is best case scenario for my fantasy lineup folks

no one cares

This sitting him out for a prolonged period is bullshit and disrespects the competitive integrity of the sport.

As a fellow team who is tanking this year, it's very obnoxious and I don't like it.

But if I was a Sabres fan, and let's say Chychrun played us 2 weeks ago and put up a goal and two assists to beat us, and now a team I'm competing with in the playoff race like the Islanders is playing Arizona and they've intentionally tied one of their hands behind their back, I'm pissed off.

I also hate gambling in hockey (or at least it's proliferation) but what about the integrity of that? If you bet on certain teams to make the playoffs, you accept that injuries can happen, how are you supposed to believe in the integrity of the bet if some teams just intentionally quit and pull their good players because they aren't even trying to win?

Bad look for the league IMO.

yea, a couple games, okay... 3+ and it is shite

 

[Nona Di Giuseppe]

Are the Canucks really tanking? Or did they try their best to be good and fail miserably because they are inept? Doesn’t look like a strategy to me. Looks like desperately running out of options and having no idea what else to do.

Chychrun has missed two games. That’s happened plenty of times. Arizona has 3 of a possible four points in those games.

Can you show me a source that states it was the Coyotes that initiated this, rather than the player and his representation? His agent watched him play 30 minutes in a meaningless tank game against Chicago in a meaningless back-to-back with travel to St Louis on the road for the next game the next day. It’s the player that requested the trade. The last thing he wants is to get hurt and miss the trade deadline AGAIN.

why does it matter who initiated it? the team made the call

it happening 'plenty' is an argument why it needs regulating.

no one wants to get hurt

it's not meaningless to other teams. as mentioned, it affects the integrity of the game.

 

[lanky]

Did you post or complain when the Devils did it years ago?


skin condition that he could play with when he was being paid $5M that he couldn't play with when he was only being paid $1M. nothing to see there. I'm obviously crazy for mentioning it. Purely coincidental.

IMO it's the doctors in these stories that are the real shysters. Their licences should be revoked if a 3rd party can't validate the diagnosis. That would put an end to the games.

 

[hbk]

They didn't start the year tanking, but have embraced the reality of this year which is, in part, based on historically poor goaltending.

Pointing to results is immaterial, the process is what matters. If I bet every cent I have on the roulette wheel twice and win, it doesn't mean it was a smart move.

Are you serious about 'whether it was the team or player?" Of course it was the team, but the point would stand regardless. So a player wants to hold himself out of games but still be paid his contract and you think the league works that way?

You're a good poster my dude, but this is a bad post.

the source on the request as speculative as it is the PHNX podcast.

 

[hbk]

IMO it's the doctors in these stories that are the real shysters. Their licences should be revoked if a 3rd party can't validate the diagnosis. That would put an end to the games.

in the end it doesn't matter. I just point out these suspicious things that have happened. AZ isn't immune to this shadiness. I mean we must have had a crystal ball when we knew to ask for an extra 3rd round pick that they are receiving this year because Andrew Ladd didn't play this year at all. but I credit the Islanders. They paid a heavy Chychrun trade like price to move a immovable contract to AZ.

All this complaining will result in going forward is less transparency. Which in a league of upper and lower body injuries is something we don't want.

 

[rt]

They didn't start the year tanking, but have embraced the reality of this year which is, in part, based on historically poor goaltending.

Pointing to results is immaterial, the process is what matters. If I bet every cent I have on the roulette wheel twice and win, it doesn't mean it was a smart move.

Are you serious about 'whether it was the team or player?" Of course it was the team, but the point would stand regardless. So a player wants to hold himself out of games but still be paid his contract and you think the league works that way?

You're a good poster my dude, but this is a bad post.

I’d say there’s at least a 1 in 3 shot it was the player.

He asked for a trade 16 months ago. The team waited until the deadline and he got hurt and they couldn’t deal him. On clean out day he made it clear that he expected to be dealt over the summer. He wasn’t. Then in training camp he made some very Frank comments about not wanting to be in Arizona. This reportedly caused some friction in the locker room and made for an awkward situation that wasn’t smoothed over until he returned and started playing his guts out.

Now he’s been back, he’s been performing, he’s been a good soldier. Yet the holiday freeze came and went. Now the deadline is approaching and his coach is playing him 30 minutes in meaningless back to back road games. And he’s maybe thinking “Why am I killing myself for this club? Why doesn’t this GM stop effing around and take care of this business? Is this entire mess going to repeat itself AGAIN?”

It’s not illogical to think that this situation has boiled over from the player’s perspective. The team approached him 16 months ago to ask if he was onboard with a rebuild. He told them no and asked for a trade 16 months ago. This has been a huge distraction in his career and in his life and with his personal relationships.

Look how sick of all this us fans are. You don’t think that it’s 1000x worse for the man himself?

Of course there’s a very real chance it was the player. Also, they may have discussed this in training camp or when he returned from injury or when the holiday freeze passed. They very well may have agreed that two weeks prior to the deadline he’d sit. Who knows?

—————

Now, why would the team handle it how they did? Why just a single “trade related reasons” tweet from their PR team and then no further comments whatsoever?

There could be many reasons. I’ve heard some rumors I won’t get into here (regarding timing of cleanup surgeries, etc) And the Coyotes independent media has certainly insinuated that it’s because it was the player. I really don’t know.

This would make sense if the player took his ball and went home. The team obviously would NOT want that to be known either officially or unofficially. They’re trying to protect the value of the asset. They lose leverage and they lose face if he just went home.

If this was purely on the GM’s terms or amicably and mutually agreed to, would might have, but not necessarily, been given some statement from hockey ops. We weren’t. Only the coach has spoken about it. And what his said was vague and somewhat contradictory.

The team might handle it like this no matter what. But they’d definitely handle it like this if it was the player.

————-

I think it was probably the team. Most likely.

There’s a chance the GM was ticked at the coach for playing him 30 minutes in his last game and maybe that’s why the coach was trotted out to answer questions that nobody had been able to ask the GM or player.

There’s a chance that all sides knew that if we got to mid-February without a trade he was going to be shut down and this surprised nobody internally.

There’s also a chance that the player has finally had enough and just went home.

All of these are realistic.

————-

Spare me the “you really think this is how it works dude” stuff.

Normally, if a player walks away a team would file a grievance and terminate his contract. This isn’t normally. Do you really think Arizona wants to terminate his contract whether he’s refusing to play or not? Do you really think they’d want to amplify that kind of drama with the league or the media while they’re attempting to maintain leverage in trade negotiations and extract maximum value for the asset? Do you think they’d really want to appear desperate at a time like this?They’ve had enough controversy.

I’m not ruling anything out. It all seems plausible to me. And that’s because I’ve been paying extremely close attention to this since the beginning.

it affects the integrity of the game.

no it doesn’t

 

[Nowotny]

There is a possibility that Bill Armstrong's presumption that managers of the teams that are in "win now" or"now or never" position will overpay for Chuchrun.Chances are that those managers are under the impression that Armstrong is under bigger pressure to trade Chuchrun and they will be able to get a bargain (offering second tier prospects,young players with injury problems + bad contract) by holding tight.
This may be one of the situations that both sides are wrong and ultimately both sides will lose.Like Cool Hand Luke said: "What we've got here is failure to communicate"

 

[Jakey53]

Didn’t Taylor Hall sit out for close to a week before being traded to the Coyotes? Did the Devils get accused of tanking? This is not the first time this has happened.

Also, the Coyotes have never benefited from the lottery. They’ve either dropped spots or stayed where they were originally slotted. Overall this seems like a targeted take.

Not only is it dicking around the players, but what about the fans. Fans pay crazy amounts for tickets to see the top talent on the different teams. Fans also are getting cheated. The players that would be a rental are playing for their next contract, so sitting in the press box hurts them. This should not be allowed, period.

 

[Jakey53]

It would be funny if Chychrun doesn’t get traded at the deadline. Does Arizona sit him out the rest of the season? Arizona put Chychrun in mothballs and they didn’t have a trade ready to go.

Exactly.

 

[hbk]

Not only is it dicking around the players, but what about the fans. Fans pay crazy amounts for tickets to see the top talent on the different teams. Fans also are getting cheated. The players that would be a rental are playing for their next contract, so sitting in the press box hurts them. This should not be allowed, period.

should I be upset if I'm a Flyers fan and Torts "sits out" JVR for missing a meaningless defensive zone assignment?

 

[LeftKinger]

To CBJ
EDM ‘23 1st
Puljujarvi (3aav)


To EDM
Gavrikov@50% (1.4aav)
*room for Yamamoto activation

—

To CBJ
Chychrun

To ARI
EDM ‘23 1st
Mateychuk

—

CBJ out: Gavrikov, Mateychuk
CBJ In: Chychrun, Puljujarvi

EDM out: ‘23 1st, Puljujarvi
EDM in: Gavrikov (50% ret.)

ARI out: Chychrun
In: Mateychuk, EDM ‘23 1st

^ admittedly, everything about that is ridiculous.

Back to reality: Kaliyev, Spence, a 1st and some dumps for Chychrun and some meaningless contracts in the AHL.

Back to reality and it’s Kaliyev, Spence and a first? lol I’m betting you’re going to be disappointed by this return when it does eventually happen. You’re expectations are sky high.

 

[hbk]

Exactly.

AZ Coyote fans have been pleading for BA to sit Chychrun out for months.

 

[rt]

Back to reality and it’s Kaliyev, Spence and a first? lol I’m betting you’re going to be disappointed by this return when it does eventually happen. You’re expectations are sky high.

Yep. Two 1sts and a 2nd. That’s the price. Replace Spence with Grans if you prefer. And you can dump Walker or Lemieux or both while you're at it, if that helps.

 

[Kurrilino]

Yep. Two 1sts and a 2nd. That’s the price. Replace Spence with Grans if you prefer. And you can dump Walker or Lemieux or both while you're at it, if that helps.

Kaliev is already assigned a future goal scorer position and is off the table for trades.
We already went through the list of availables so many times.
What is the point of asking again and again?

Just as a reminder, off the table"
1st,23, Byfield, Clarke, Kaliev, Grans, Fagemo,
Roster player: Kempe, Vilardi, Kupari

At this point, a trade has to include either Durzi or Spence for cap reasons.

Any trade proposal including those assets will result in automatic refusal as it happen over the last 2 years.
This is not my idea, it's just my experience from former threads regarding Kings trades and management comments from the Kings side.

 

[Kranix]

Kaliev is already assigned a future goal scorer position and is off the table for trades.
We already went through the list of availables so many times.
What is the point of asking again and again?

Just as a reminder, off the table"
1st,23, Byfield, Clarke, Kaliev, Grans, Fagemo,
Roster player: Kempe, Vilardi, Kupari

At this point, a trade has to include either Durzi or Spence for cap reasons.

Any trade proposal including those assets will result in automatic refusal as it happen over the last 2 years.
This is not my idea, it's just my experience from former threads regarding Kings trades and management comments from the Kings side

Wyshinski says AZ rejected Vilardi and a first last summer.

 

[unicornpig]

Wyshinski says AZ rejected Vilardi and a first last summer.

Probably kicking themselves now

 

[Kurrilino]

Wyshinski says AZ rejected Vilardi and a first last summer.

Yes, that was also before Vilardi exploded and become the leading goal scorer before his injury.
Right now AZ would crouch the floor begging for this trade to happen

 

[rt]

Kaliev is already assigned a future goal scorer position and is off the table for trades.
We already went through the list of availables so many times.
What is the point of asking again and again?

Just as a reminder, off the table"
1st,23, Byfield, Clarke, Kaliev, Grans, Fagemo,
Roster player: Kempe, Vilardi, Kupari

At this point, a trade has to include either Durzi or Spence for cap reasons.

Any trade proposal including those assets will result in automatic refusal as it happen over the last 2 years.
This is not my idea, it's just my experience from former threads regarding Kings trades and management comments from the Kings side.

HahahahahahhhhahAhahahahahahahahagaahgHhahahahahahahahahahahHahahahahahahahahahahahahaha oh man. Hahah. Hahaha. Oh boy. Hoooooo.

Thanks. Needed that.

 

[Kranix]

Yes, that was also before Vilardi exploded and become the leading goal scorer before his injury.
Right now AZ would crouch the floor begging for this trade to happen

He's not the leading goal scorer

 

[Kurrilino]

He's not the leading goal scorer

I said he was the leading goal scorer before his injury.
He is still on pace for 25 goals even sitting out for 2 month

 

[Boxscore]

Chychrun to the jackets is best case scenario for my fantasy lineup folks

Not if you're in a dynasty league lmao. I have Chychrun in fantasy as well and the Jackets are the last of the rumored teams I want him to go to. That blueline is stacked with offensive options - Werenski, Boqvist, Blankenburg, Jiricek, Mateychuk, Ceulemans...

 

[Sm00chy]

Kaliev is already assigned a future goal scorer position and is off the table for trades.
We already went through the list of availables so many times.
What is the point of asking again and again?

Just as a reminder, off the table"
1st,23, Byfield, Clarke, Kaliev, Grans, Fagemo,
Roster player: Kempe, Vilardi, Kupari

At this point, a trade has to include either Durzi or Spence for cap reasons.

Any trade proposal including those assets will result in automatic refusal as it happen over the last 2 years.
This is not my idea, it's just my experience from former threads regarding Kings trades and management comments from the Kings side.

LOL buddy... you think the Kings will get a top pairing, cost controlled D-man at the age of 24 for their 8th best prospect and some cap dumps?

What is happening in this thread hahahaha

 

[Kranix]

LOL buddy... you think the Kings will get a top pairing, cost controlled D-man at the age of 24 for their 8th best prospect and some cap dumps?

What is happening in this thread hahahaha

It's odd that a deranged homer doesn't know his own team stats. He claimed Vilardi was the leading goal scorer on the kings, and when called out on it he rushed over to ihdb and then edited his post.

 

[UrbanImpact]

According to Friedman today on the Marek show:

There is a theory going around which a few teams believe, That Chychrun has re-aggravated an injury (nothing major) but its the actual reason he is being held out and not the fact that a trade is close or imminent.

Friedman says this makes sense because he keeps hearing from sources that LA and Arizona are nowhere near a trade.


This has to be further concerning for any interested buyers. Chychrun's knock has always been that he is injury prone. Goes way back to his CHL days.

IF true, this is very coy of Arizona to make it seem like Chychrun is sitting out because a trade is close rather than because he is dealing with yet another injury.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I don't understand why Kings fans keep talking about Chychrun in here. You obviously don't want him based on literally anyone of value being unavailable, so why not just say "I don't want him" and move on? If Chychrun is traded to the Kings, you're going to be mad because he's going to require multiple of these pieces that you deem "untouchable". If the Kings have the same mindset as you and all of those pieces are actually untouchable, they just won't be getting him.

I don't understand the whole HF "I don't want him, but this is what I'd pay for him" trope. Like if your team is trading for him, they want him and are giving up legitimate value for him. If a team isn't going to trade legitimate value for him, they just won't get him. No one here is a GM, so what anyone here would be willing to pay or what they want to do is totally irrelevant to a discussion around what a Chychrun trade would look like.