Nona Di Giuseppe
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Speculation: Jakob Chychrun being held out of the Coyotes lineup until a trade is completed
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Nona Di Giuseppe
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why does it matter who initiated it? the team made the call
it happening 'plenty' is an argument why it needs regulating.
no one wants to get hurt
it's not meaningless to other teams. as mentioned, it affects the integrity of the game.
IMO it's the doctors in these stories that are the real shysters. Their licences should be revoked if a 3rd party can't validate the diagnosis. That would put an end to the games.
in the end it doesn't matter. I just point out these suspicious things that have happened. AZ isn't immune to this shadiness. I mean we must have had a crystal ball when we knew to ask for an extra 3rd round pick that they are receiving this year because Andrew Ladd didn't play this year at all. but I credit the Islanders. They paid a heavy Chychrun trade like price to move a immovable contract to AZ.
All this complaining will result in going forward is less transparency. Which in a league of upper and lower body injuries is something we don't want.
rt
Clean Hits on Substack
I’d say there’s at least a 1 in 3 shot it was the player.
He asked for a trade 16 months ago. The team waited until the deadline and he got hurt and they couldn’t deal him. On clean out day he made it clear that he expected to be dealt over the summer. He wasn’t. Then in training camp he made some very Frank comments about not wanting to be in Arizona. This reportedly caused some friction in the locker room and made for an awkward situation that wasn’t smoothed over until he returned and started playing his guts out.
Now he’s been back, he’s been performing, he’s been a good soldier. Yet the holiday freeze came and went. Now the deadline is approaching and his coach is playing him 30 minutes in meaningless back to back road games. And he’s maybe thinking “Why am I killing myself for this club? Why doesn’t this GM stop effing around and take care of this business? Is this entire mess going to repeat itself AGAIN?”
It’s not illogical to think that this situation has boiled over from the player’s perspective. The team approached him 16 months ago to ask if he was onboard with a rebuild. He told them no and asked for a trade 16 months ago. This has been a huge distraction in his career and in his life and with his personal relationships.
Look how sick of all this us fans are. You don’t think that it’s 1000x worse for the man himself?
Of course there’s a very real chance it was the player. Also, they may have discussed this in training camp or when he returned from injury or when the holiday freeze passed. They very well may have agreed that two weeks prior to the deadline he’d sit. Who knows?
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Now, why would the team handle it how they did? Why just a single “trade related reasons” tweet from their PR team and then no further comments whatsoever?
There could be many reasons. I’ve heard some rumors I won’t get into here (regarding timing of cleanup surgeries, etc) And the Coyotes independent media has certainly insinuated that it’s because it was the player. I really don’t know.
This would make sense if the player took his ball and went home. The team obviously would NOT want that to be known either officially or unofficially. They’re trying to protect the value of the asset. They lose leverage and they lose face if he just went home.
If this was purely on the GM’s terms or amicably and mutually agreed to, would might have, but not necessarily, been given some statement from hockey ops. We weren’t. Only the coach has spoken about it. And what his said was vague and somewhat contradictory.
The team might handle it like this no matter what. But they’d definitely handle it like this if it was the player.
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I think it was probably the team. Most likely.
There’s a chance the GM was ticked at the coach for playing him 30 minutes in his last game and maybe that’s why the coach was trotted out to answer questions that nobody had been able to ask the GM or player.
There’s a chance that all sides knew that if we got to mid-February without a trade he was going to be shut down and this surprised nobody internally.
There’s also a chance that the player has finally had enough and just went home.
All of these are realistic.
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Spare me the “you really think this is how it works dude” stuff.
Normally, if a player walks away a team would file a grievance and terminate his contract. This isn’t normally. Do you really think Arizona wants to terminate his contract whether he’s refusing to play or not? Do you really think they’d want to amplify that kind of drama with the league or the media while they’re attempting to maintain leverage in trade negotiations and extract maximum value for the asset? Do you think they’d really want to appear desperate at a time like this?They’ve had enough controversy.
I’m not ruling anything out. It all seems plausible to me. And that’s because I’ve been paying extremely close attention to this since the beginning.
no it doesn’t
Nowotny
Registered User
There is a possibility that Bill Armstrong's presumption that managers of the teams that are in "win now" or"now or never" position will overpay for Chuchrun.Chances are that those managers are under the impression that Armstrong is under bigger pressure to trade Chuchrun and they will be able to get a bargain (offering second tier prospects,young players with injury problems + bad contract) by holding tight.
This may be one of the situations that both sides are wrong and ultimately both sides will lose.Like Cool Hand Luke said: "What we've got here is failure to communicate"
This may be one of the situations that both sides are wrong and ultimately both sides will lose.Like Cool Hand Luke said: "What we've got here is failure to communicate"
Not only is it dicking around the players, but what about the fans. Fans pay crazy amounts for tickets to see the top talent on the different teams. Fans also are getting cheated. The players that would be a rental are playing for their next contract, so sitting in the press box hurts them. This should not be allowed, period.
should I be upset if I'm a Flyers fan and Torts "sits out" JVR for missing a meaningless defensive zone assignment?
Back to reality and it’s Kaliyev, Spence and a first? lol I’m betting you’re going to be disappointed by this return when it does eventually happen. You’re expectations are sky high.
AZ Coyote fans have been pleading for BA to sit Chychrun out for months.
rt
Clean Hits on Substack
Yep. Two 1sts and a 2nd. That’s the price. Replace Spence with Grans if you prefer. And you can dump Walker or Lemieux or both while you're at it, if that helps.
Kaliev is already assigned a future goal scorer position and is off the table for trades.
We already went through the list of availables so many times.
What is the point of asking again and again?
Just as a reminder, off the table"
1st,23, Byfield, Clarke, Kaliev, Grans, Fagemo,
Roster player: Kempe, Vilardi, Kupari
At this point, a trade has to include either Durzi or Spence for cap reasons.
Any trade proposal including those assets will result in automatic refusal as it happen over the last 2 years.
This is not my idea, it's just my experience from former threads regarding Kings trades and management comments from the Kings side.
Kranix
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unicornpig
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- Dec 8, 2017
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Probably kicking themselves now
Yes, that was also before Vilardi exploded and become the leading goal scorer before his injury.
Right now AZ would crouch the floor begging for this trade to happen
rt
Clean Hits on Substack
HahahahahahhhhahAhahahahahahahahagaahgHhahahahahahahahahahahHahahahahahahahahahahahahaha oh man. Hahah. Hahaha. Oh boy. Hoooooo.
Thanks. Needed that.
Kranix
Deranged Homer
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I said he was the leading goal scorer before his injury.
He is still on pace for 25 goals even sitting out for 2 month
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- Jan 22, 2007
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Not if you're in a dynasty league lmao. I have Chychrun in fantasy as well and the Jackets are the last of the rumored teams I want him to go to. That blueline is stacked with offensive options - Werenski, Boqvist, Blankenburg, Jiricek, Mateychuk, Ceulemans...
Sm00chy
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LOL buddy... you think the Kings will get a top pairing, cost controlled D-man at the age of 24 for their 8th best prospect and some cap dumps?
What is happening in this thread hahahaha
Kranix
Deranged Homer
- Jun 27, 2012
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It's odd that a deranged homer doesn't know his own team stats. He claimed Vilardi was the leading goal scorer on the kings, and when called out on it he rushed over to ihdb and then edited his post.
According to Friedman today on the Marek show:
There is a theory going around which a few teams believe, That Chychrun has re-aggravated an injury (nothing major) but its the actual reason he is being held out and not the fact that a trade is close or imminent.
Friedman says this makes sense because he keeps hearing from sources that LA and Arizona are nowhere near a trade.
This has to be further concerning for any interested buyers. Chychrun's knock has always been that he is injury prone. Goes way back to his CHL days.
IF true, this is very coy of Arizona to make it seem like Chychrun is sitting out because a trade is close rather than because he is dealing with yet another injury.
There is a theory going around which a few teams believe, That Chychrun has re-aggravated an injury (nothing major) but its the actual reason he is being held out and not the fact that a trade is close or imminent.
Friedman says this makes sense because he keeps hearing from sources that LA and Arizona are nowhere near a trade.
This has to be further concerning for any interested buyers. Chychrun's knock has always been that he is injury prone. Goes way back to his CHL days.
IF true, this is very coy of Arizona to make it seem like Chychrun is sitting out because a trade is close rather than because he is dealing with yet another injury.
Empoleon8771
Registered User
I don't understand why Kings fans keep talking about Chychrun in here. You obviously don't want him based on literally anyone of value being unavailable, so why not just say "I don't want him" and move on? If Chychrun is traded to the Kings, you're going to be mad because he's going to require multiple of these pieces that you deem "untouchable". If the Kings have the same mindset as you and all of those pieces are actually untouchable, they just won't be getting him.
I don't understand the whole HF "I don't want him, but this is what I'd pay for him" trope. Like if your team is trading for him, they want him and are giving up legitimate value for him. If a team isn't going to trade legitimate value for him, they just won't get him. No one here is a GM, so what anyone here would be willing to pay or what they want to do is totally irrelevant to a discussion around what a Chychrun trade would look like.
I don't understand the whole HF "I don't want him, but this is what I'd pay for him" trope. Like if your team is trading for him, they want him and are giving up legitimate value for him. If a team isn't going to trade legitimate value for him, they just won't get him. No one here is a GM, so what anyone here would be willing to pay or what they want to do is totally irrelevant to a discussion around what a Chychrun trade would look like.
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