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Confirmed with Link: It's Started! (Management firings)

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Remember the Dynasty said:
Yep & MLB does not have a salary Caap Or Floor ! NEXT !! Protip when in a hole, 1st thing to do is stop digging
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What the hell are you taking about. Your initial point to me was when I said Dubas has failed even with the richest owners in the league. We have no clue how FSG is going to spend with the Pens as they’ve owned them for one full season. Most wealthy organizations don’t get that way by flushing money down the toilet to make up for employee incompetence.

You are one of the least intelligible posters I’ve come across, which is a very low bar.
 
SomeDude said:
We can start with Matt Murray. The same goalie with negative value he traded for last summer.

Hiring a mediocre GM will sink not only the 23-24 Pens, but many seasons beyond.

The biggest defense for Dubas I’ve seen here so far is the same defense JR got. “He’s not afraid to make changes.” Who gives a flying **** how many trades you make if your team is still mediocre, which the Leafs have been for his entire time there.

Again, he has elite players and has failed to surround them with the right supporting cast to make them anything other than paper tigers. I don’t see how you think he would do anything better here when our stars are not able to carry a team anymore. Kyle Dubas has proven to be nothing more than a mediocre GM so far.
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You think he's gonna drag Murray here after what just happened this season? He's not even UFA, and Murray's end here was ugly. Super doubtful.

Dubas' best defense is his trade/signing history over 7 years. Should just look them up on CF and assess for yourself, instead of relying on uninformed posters for opinions. Should be talking to the best objective posters on the Leafs board at the very least. People here don't even remember his moves over these 7 years.

He builds strong teams that get into the playoffs with ease every year.
Pretty weird thing to take for granted, considering we just missed and are likely to do so again if we don't get a good GM.

If the Leafs beat the Lightning 2-1 in game 7 last year instead of vice versa, would that make him a better GM?
If Matthews shot his season average and they advanced past Price and the Habs, would that make him a better GM?
It's such a narrow minded way to judge.

A GMs job is to give them the tools to win. He has done that. It's up to the coach and players after that.
They're good in every core category this year. Average GMs aren't capable of building teams like that long term.
If they lose again to the Bolts it's on the damn players. He's giving them every chance. The Lightning are .485 since February 1.

90% of predictions I've seen are taking the Leafs in this series. That should tell you something about what people think of his roster construction.
 
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SomeDude said:
We can start with Matt Murray. The same goalie with negative value he traded for last summer.

Hiring a mediocre GM will sink not only the 23-24 Pens, but many seasons beyond.

The biggest defense for Dubas I’ve seen here so far is the same defense JR got. “He’s not afraid to make changes.” Who gives a flying **** how many trades you make if your team is still mediocre, which the Leafs have been for his entire time there.

Again, he has elite players and has failed to surround them with the right supporting cast to make them anything other than paper tigers. I don’t see how you think he would do anything better here when our stars are not able to carry a team anymore. Kyle Dubas has proven to be nothing more than a mediocre GM so far.
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How much of them choking is Dubas and how much is it the fact their star players don't seem to produce when it counts?

Only so much a GM can do when your stars produce so little in the post season. How far would the Pens have gone on any of their long Cup runs if Sid and Geno were producing like 2nd line players in the playoffs for their careers instead of producing like 100 point studs?

I think you can blame the GM if the stars perform, but the supporting cast lets them down because that shows he didn't provide them with good enough help. But in Toronto's case, it's often been the stars being no-shows that's caused them to fail.

As far as the only defense being "he's willing to make moves" and comparing that to JR, it ignores the fact he's willing to make moves to fix the obvious areas of weakness. JR was willing to make moves often just for the sake of it, even if the move didn't really address an issue. So painting the two with the same brush ignores a lot of context behind those moves.

In any case, I doubt we land him anyways. He'll likely be re-signed in Toronto. Plus, the Pens seem to like to recycle GMs so we'll probably just pick up someone from the Old Boys Club or sign someone who was in the Pens' organization at some point.
 
SomeDude said:
What the hell are you taking about. Your initial point to me was when I said Dubas has failed even with the richest owners in the league. We have no clue how FSG is going to spend with the Pens as they’ve owned them for one full season. Most wealthy organizations don’t get that way by flushing money down the toilet to make up for employee incompetence.

You are one of the least intelligible posters I’ve come across, which is a very low bar.
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FSG is worth a lot more than Leafs ownership, Nutting is 12th Richest in MLB, what team owners are above him??? all the mega Money owner. You are soo full of shit both eyes are brown. Nutting makes money from the Luxury Tax shush fund, where they said we will give you money so you make money every season whether you lose a hundred games or win a hundred. Burkle had no problem spending & FSG is worth 4 & a Half times as much as him
 
Sidney the Kidney said:
How much of them choking is Dubas and how much is it the fact their star players don't seem to produce when it counts?

Only so much a GM can do when your stars produce so little in the post season. How far would the Pens have gone on any of their long Cup runs if Sid and Geno were producing like 2nd line players in the playoffs for their careers instead of producing like 100 point studs?

I think you can blame the GM if the stars perform, but the supporting cast lets them down because that shows he didn't provide them with good enough help. But in Toronto's case, it's often been the stars being no-shows that's caused them to fail.

As far as the only defense being "he's willing to make moves" and comparing that to JR, it ignores the fact he's willing to make moves to fix the obvious areas of weakness. JR was willing to make moves often just for the sake of it, even if the move didn't really address an issue. So painting the two with the same brush ignores a lot of context behind those moves.

In any case, I doubt we land him anyways. He'll likely be re-signed in Toronto. Plus, the Pens seem to like to recycle GMs so we'll probably just pick up someone from the Old Boys Club or sign someone who was in the Pens' organization at some point.
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Friedman has us connected to Epstein and Greenberg which makes sense for what you are saying only from a standpoint of FSG’s nepotism.
 
Sidney the Kidney said:
How much of them choking is Dubas and how much is it the fact their star players don't seem to produce when it counts?
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Well maybe Dubas shouldn't have paid them $11 million or so a year then :dunno:

Pretty much all of Toronto's issues with their roster are self inflicted. Goaltending is a question mark because Dubas decided to target Matt Murray to be his starter this year. Defense has had issues in the past because he thought OFD like Barrie would address the needs on his blue line. Depth has had issues because Dubas bent over and gave the stars way too rich of contracts.
 
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SomeDude said:
What the hell are you taking about. Your initial point to me was when I said Dubas has failed even with the richest owners in the league. We have no clue how FSG is going to spend with the Pens as they’ve owned them for one full season. Most wealthy organizations don’t get that way by flushing money down the toilet to make up for employee incompetence.

You are one of the least intelligible posters I’ve come across, which is a very low bar.
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Yeah, I post on here.
 
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AuroraBorealis said:
You think he's gonna drag Murray here after what just happened this season? He's not even UFA, and Murray's end here was ugly. Super doubtful.

Dubas' best defense is his trade/signing history over 7 years. Should just look them up on CF and assess for yourself, instead of relying on uninformed posters for opinions. Should be talking to the best objective posters on the Leafs board at the very least. People here don't even remember his moves over these 7 years.

He builds strong teams that get into the playoffs with ease every year.
Pretty weird thing to take for granted, considering we just missed and are likely to do so again if we don't get a good GM.

If the Leafs beat the Lightning 2-1 in game 7 last year instead of vice versa, would that make him a better GM?
If Matthews shot his season average and they advanced past Price and the Habs, would that make him a better GM?
It's such a narrow minded way to judge.

A GMs job is to give them the tools to win. He has done that. It's up to the coach and players after that.
They're good in every core category this year. Average GMs aren't capable of building teams like that long term.
If they lose again to the Bolts it's on the damn players. He's giving them every chance. The Lightning are .485 since February 1.

90% of predictions I've seen are taking the Leafs in this series. That should tell you something about what people think of his roster construction.
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He’s the GM that keeps bringing back that core. You can’t trade Mattews, but you surely could move Marner or Nylander. The amount he paid his core guys was widely considered an overpayment at the time. He then handcuffed himself with the Tavares contract. He’s never fixed the ongoing goalie situation until this year because the guy he brought in to backup Murray is doing well. Even so, we’ll see how he holds up now that it matters.

They’ve been predicted to win 90% of their first round matchups in the last however many years. That should tell you how much they’ve underachieved.

I just don’t get feeling this strongly about defending Kyle Dubas.
 
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If we bring a non-hockey guy in that is just going to put numbers into a computer to spit out who we should sign and for how much, we will finally, truly, be f***** as @Gurglesons foresaw.
 
HandshakeLine said:
Mega money means nothing if you don’t want to spend it, which FSG hasn’t really shown that they want to do with us yet.
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They are spending 3.5 mil to not have Hextall around.

SomeDude said:
If we bring a non-hockey guy in that is just going to put numbers into a computer to spit out who we should sign and for how much, we will finally, truly, be f***** as @Gurglesons foresaw.
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I dunno. Greenberg and Epstein have great resumes in baseball management.

Only hockey minds would say that couldn’t translate.
 
Gurglesons said:
I dunno. Greenberg and Epstein have great resumes in baseball management.

Only hockey minds would say that couldn’t translate.
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I don’t see how success in another sport translates at all to any other.

Edgar Snyder has a great track record of not charging clients unless he wins money for them. Doesn’t mean I’d want him in charge of my real estate portfolio.
 
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BusinessGoose said:
I mean, TECHNICALLY, the Pirates are 13th in MLB standings... Right now... Lol
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I don’t even know where he ranks in owner value anymore. I know at one point he was pretty high for having such a **** product.

Regardless, we already saw what he would do with a good roster. Let it go one piece at a time because he doesn’t want to pay to keep them.
 
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eXile3 said:
That would be awesome. You hire for aptitude and competency.
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Ya I'm in this boat. I actually prefer the head in charge to not be tied to the hockey cult culture in a sense.

Someone that could come in and have sway with ownership. You then fill in people around them with extensive hockey knowledge.

But ya it'd be nice to have new sets of eyeballs and not the same old crap. Maybe it doesn't work but I want something new. Let's go
 
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Brad Treliving is going to be the next GM of the Penguins.

His vision and Sullivans for how a team is built and plays seem to align. Sutter in Calgary used the roster that Treliving built the complete opposite of how they should have been used, just like Hextal and Sullivan.
 
Khelandros said:
Brad Treliving is going to be the next GM of the Penguins.

His vision and Sullivans for how a team is built and plays seem to align. Sutter in Calgary used the roster that Treliving built the complete opposite of how they should have been used, just like Hextal and Sullivan.
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Doubt it.
 
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