Post-Game Talk: ITS OVER- Did we make a huge mistake on Pierre-Luc Dubois Thread?

[expy]

My family is half French and I'm not even from Quebec. This is not about what language he speaks. This is about a legit top 2C like Suzuki who we can acquire.

As it should be, about the hockey part of it.

Unfortunately, this is only really getting as much coverage as it is due to other non-hockey-related factors.

 

[Corky]

But LA Fans dont think they will offer up Vilardi or Byfield, it's a similar thing to Dach why trade Vilardi when he Basically provided the same thing as Dubois did last year

Dach - 58GP - 14g - 24a - 38p - Age 22
Vilardi - 63GP - 23g - 18a - 41p - Age 23
Dubois 73 gp - 27g - 36A - 63p - Age 24

You don't trade Vilardi or Dach for Dubois, it's like turning 2 Nickels into a dime, the goal is to keep him and get Dubois.

Exactly that. If the kings are willing to trade Vilardi or Byfield, and then pay Dubois 9M for 8 years, then by all means do it and we move on.

I really don’t think that’s a good trade for LA though and I don’t think they’re offering that.

 

[Runner77]

Bang on!!!
Take all the pics you want, hanging with Cole, pretty obvious Mr Brisson is playing games at this point!!! LOL

Brisson doing what he needs to do to satisfy his client’s preferred career trajectory. PLD is calling the shots, I guess there is only so much one can take of a place/ team that he can’t stand to play in and that is probably on every other players’ no-trade list.

 

[HabzSauce]

A good player his age usually gets a long-term deal. If he has 5-6 teams on his list, then 4-5 can claim "he was only using us as leverage". It's lame.

What I don't understand is people thinking Dubois owes the Habs a special favour. Why?

He doesn't owe us anything but if he wants to come here then be ready to make the required sacrifices (term and $$).

Lots of perks playing in MTL especially under this new organization. Team is young and very forward thinking. Great coach that gives his players lots of freedom to try things and make mistake. Plus you get to play behind THE best fans in all of sport.

If the cost to play here means you have to settle for 8M instead of 8.5-9M well then so be it. Totally worth it for me if I was in his shoes.

 

[Pompeius Magnus]

Where's Mr. Vachon and his latest rumor? I want to know what's going on!

Mad Dog or Butcher ?

 

[Runner77]

Mad Dog or Butcher ?

Rogatien.

 

[yianik]

Im always surprised by the lack of Josh Anderson in offers, rumors, etc. I mean, he's not old, he's signed for a few more seasons, his game is a GM favorite and most importantly, he's immediate help for Winnipeg. Also can't discount the fact that KH entertained offers for him at the TDL. If you need to include him in a trade for PLD, so be it. Package him with Kovacevic which is known name in WIN, or a prospect like Struble, and call it a day.

Value wise Anderson, Beck ( would hate to lose him) and Florida's 1st should get PLD, unless LA offers up Vilardi plus. As others say, Jets are probably on the NTC though. But a 3rd team could get involved.

I want to use our assets to try to move up first.

 

[nhlfan9191]

Draft day..............lots can go on.
Last year, they had a deal agreed on, and Chevy got greedy, that day, and changed the deal, and Hughes told him to FO......................used his plan B and got Dach.
LOL at Chevy. Karma is a bitch....looks good on Chevy's Day Off...............I hope some GM school's him badly !!
Dubois is not a need, but a very nice addition, if the price is right!!

I heard a little about that. Was it ever comfirmed if the offer the equivalent or more then what we payed for Dach then?

 

[salbutera]

He doesn't owe us anything but if he wants to come here then be ready to make the required sacrifices (term and $$).

Lots of perks playing in MTL especially under this new organization. Team is young and very forward thinking. Great coach that gives his players lots of freedom to try things and make mistake. Plus you get to play behind THE best fans in all of sport.

If the cost to play here means you have to settle for 8M instead of 8.5-9M well then so be it. Totally worth it for me if I was in his shoes.

None of us know what the ask is - there’s a lot of speculating & pontificating by the media, and lots of disinformation, most of which I’m willing to bet originating from Jets who are desperately trying to stir up market demand.

 

[salbutera]

Draft day..............lots can go on.
Last year, they had a deal agreed on, and Chevy got greedy, that day, and changed the deal, and Hughes told him to FO......................used his plan B and got Dach.
LOL at Chevy. Karma is a bitch....looks good on Chevy's Day Off...............I hope some GM school's him badly !!
Dubois is not a need, but a very nice addition, if the price is right!!

Chevaldayoff’s been GM for last 12-years and has very few trades to show for. I suspect he’s realized the best game plan is to maximize on Hellebuyck and once done try to trim the edges w PLD deal because it’s obvious no one’s jumping up & down offering his ask price.

When was the last time a top end player demanding a trade yielded an asking price return? Trouba? Duchene? ROR?

I’d be shocked if it happens all of a sudden for PLD, let leave it at that

 

[Jack Skellington]

Chevaldayoff’s been GM for last 12-years and has very few trades to show for. I suspect he’s realized the best game plan is to maximize on Hellebuyck and once done try to trim the edges w PLD deal because it’s obvious no one’s jumping up & down offering his ask price.

When was the last time a top end player demanding a trade yielded an asking price return? Trouba? Duchene? ROR?

I’d be shocked if it happens all of a sudden for PLD, let leave it at that

Not only demanding a trade, demanding it to a very very small group of teams, possibly just one. Dubois' value goes up with a sign and trade but the fact that he'll only sign it with a handful of teams drops it right back down. I don't think Winnipeg has come to terms with this yet which is why there's such a hold up. It seems like they expect full market value for an openly disgruntled, choosy player. Hope Hughes isn't the one to give in to them.

 

[austin316]

I know a lot of people think this will somehow materialize on draft day, but if Hughes and Cheveldayoff/Brisson don’t get on the same page going into the draft, it’s not really going to matter. Winnipeg’s approach with this sign and trade makes things tough for not only us, but anybody interested. If Winnipeg really doesn’t want to deal with the headache of arbitration with a player whose already publicly said he has no intention of playing with them even on a one year, they’re going to have to come down in price eventually.

I don’t disagree with anything you said. All I’m implying is that I don’t believe this will come to a resolution until at least the draft. For whatever reasons, these types of off-season deals predominantly happen at the draft.

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

If I was to guess the unpredictable trade:
* Anderson
* Dvorak (retention down to $3M)
* Kidney
* Habs early 4th rounder (pick 101 I believe).

Unless you're clearly torching win jets, this trade offer is laughtable. In the same move you get rid of two bad salaries (Ander-Dvo), then you give Kidney and you name him like if losing him was sssso terrible, and then a little 4th round choice. Euhhhh, ... No ! Gm Jets refuse that.

 

[salbutera]

If the Jets want NHL players as the main pieces and Anderson does not have the Jets on his NTC list. Maybe we offer Anderson, Dvorak (with retention) and Kidney.

Anderson and Dvorak totaling $8.5M max. That would bring Dvorak's cap hit for two more years down to $3M. Kidney added as a future center prospect. B or B+ type putting up top end Q numbers since he was 18.

Personally, I don't like the idea of the Habs trading Anderson. I'm a big fan of his game and yeah, I know he is not consistent but man, when he is on, he is on. And he does show up in big games.

If I was to guess the unpredictable trade:
* Anderson
* Dvorak (retention down to $3M)
* Kidney
* Habs early 4th rounder (pick 101 I believe).

Chevaldayoff will not net more than Trouba deal - equivalence of young NHL asset + 20s pick.

Additionally he’s been hemmed into a corner by needing a deal that can help in the now - I.e limiting a solid futures based return if he was allowed to rebuild.

Dvorak + Barron / Harris is my guess at end game.

 

[BaseballCoach]

He doesn't owe us anything but if he wants to come here then be ready to make the required sacrifices (term and $$).

Lots of perks playing in MTL especially under this new organization. Team is young and very forward thinking. Great coach that gives his players lots of freedom to try things and make mistake. Plus you get to play behind THE best fans in all of sport.

If the cost to play here means you have to settle for 8M instead of 8.5-9M well then so be it. Totally worth it for me if I was in his shoes.

$8M is not a sacrifice. It is slightly above market value.

But I still don't get why some people think sacrifices are required to play here. We're going to have a really hard time getting and keeping our share of good players if they are "required" to sacrifice to play here. That being said, I suspect the sacrifice won't actually be required for a player from the US or Europe. It's only le p'tit gars de chez nous that some folks here demand sacrifices from. And many are much harsher than you were, saying he should accept $6M or even $5M presumably to make up for the sins of Martin Lapointe and Jonathan Drouin.

 

[Kimota]

What are you talking about? He wouldn't give up almost half a billion dollars of Salary committments (AKA $15M in Commission a year) to run a team for <$5M a season?

He's also multiple times had players sign long term wiht us, evne in just the last few years, Toffoli and Caufield and now is trying to get Dubois here

Wrong

 

[BaseballCoach]

Unless you're clearly torching win jets, this trade offer is laughtable. In the same move you get rid of two bad salaries (Ander-Dvo), then you give Kidney and you name him like if losing him was sssso terrible, and then a little 4th round choice. Euhhhh, ... No ! Gm Jets refuse that.

Anderson is not such a bad salary.

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

Anderson is not such a bad salary.

Yes but to clear his salary might help a little bit. It's the term the problem, not the $$ per year.

The bad side he's one of our only big forward and he can drop gloves too. Not sure I want him to leave.

 

[SlafySZN]

delete

 

[SlafySZN]

I heard a little about that. Was it ever comfirmed if the offer the equivalent or more then what we payed for Dach then?

It’s made up from people who thinks Dubois was at the draft to get traded lol.

The Dach deal was already done a day or two before the draft. Doesn’t have anything to do with Dubois.

 

[The Great Weal]

The Dach deal was already done a day or two before the draft. Really don’t know where the ‘’Plan B’’ thing come from.

How do you know that? PLD being there tells me the deal was essentially done, why else would he be there? Chevy tried to pull a fast one on Hughes and failed. Now he's still not budging from a crazy asking price (or PLD isn't settling to a contract at 8 million or less) which is why a trade hasn't happened yet.

 

[HabzSauce]

$8M is not a sacrifice. It is slightly above market value.

But I still don't get why some people think sacrifices are required to play here. We're going to have a really hard time getting and keeping our share of good players if they are "required" to sacrifice to play here. That being said, I suspect the sacrifice won't actually be required for a player from the US or Europe. It's only le p'tit gars de chez nous that some folks here demand sacrifices from. And many are much harsher than you were, saying he should accept $6M or even $5M presumably to make up for the sins of Martin Lapointe and Jonathan Drouin.

Yea that's my point - it's barely even a sacrifice. So you make 500k less big whoop.

If you want to build a consistent cup contender year after year in an era where cap is king, you do need your players to sacrifice some moola. Just the way it goes. And in return these same players get to play in a great culture on a winning team. So it still balances out just fine.

We gotta set a standard. Don't want to end up being the leafs and giving stars whatever they ask for just because they're stars

 

[SlafySZN]

How do you know that? PLD being there tells me the deal was essentially done, why else would he be there? Chevy tried to pull a fast one on Hughes and failed. Now he's still not budging from a crazy asking price (or PLD isn't settling to a contract at 8 million or less) which is why a trade hasn't happened yet.

Hughes himself said the deal was already done a day before.

People really took the fact that he was at the draft with his sponsor too seriously lol.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

How do you know that? PLD being there tells me the deal was essentially done, why else would he be there? Chevy tried to pull a fast one on Hughes and failed. Now he's still not budging from a crazy asking price (or PLD isn't settling to a contract at 8 million or less) which is why a trade hasn't happened yet.

Again not likely unless the assets in the Dach trade were completely different than what was offered for Dubois.

 

[SlafySZN]

Again not likely unless the assets in the Dach trade were completely different than what was offered for Dubois.

The asking price for Dach was a high pick, they tried all summer to acquired another one to flip it for Dach and they finally had to offer a player they didn’t necessarily want to trade to finally get it. I find it weird how people made up some Dubois story in this.