Is Cale Makar a generational talent?

[wetcoast]

Makar was definitely better on the PP in their rookie years and probably would have won due to point totals even if Fox played more there, but I think Fox was probably the better overall ES player that year, despite the points. Makar wasn't as dominant as he was this year at ES.

Fair enough but Makar has that dynamic factor which rightly or wrongly influences peoples minds.

Given the progression Makar has taken the only thing really holding him back is health.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

This is a false equivalency here as Makar had 116 first place votes in the Calder the 2nd guy had 53. there was one other first place vote for calder that year.

In Norris voting this year Fox had 40 first place votes, Makar had 31 and Hedman 20. the other 7 first place votes were spit among 5 other players.



we all know why he lost and how close it was and as far as situational it's not because he is a poor PK guy, his metrics are actually really good and he played almost a minute per game on the PK but it's rather how his coach deploys him.



No he wasn't head and shoulders in actual scoring among Dmen in the last 2 years.

NHL Stats

But he is a clear 2nd in PPG among regular Dmen and only behind John Carlson who had a freakish October in 19, otherwise there is no sunlight here.

Is there anyone really taking John Carlson over Makar next year?

You can spin it all you want. Makar is a fine player and has the potential to be the best d-man in the league or even the best d-man of this era but he's not there yet. He is not head and shoulders over his peers. I find it very odd that he has not been recognized as the best d-man in the league much less best player and yet "generational" is being bandied about. That's silly.

 

[Voight]

Nicklas Lidstrom must play golf

Lidstrom was fantastic but he wasn't a generational talent.

Guys like him and Bourque are close, but they dont make the cut.

 

[wetcoast]

You can spin it all you want. Makar is a fine player and has the potential to be the best d-man in the league or even the best d-man of this era but he's not there yet. He is not head and shoulders over his peers. I find it very odd that he has not been recognized as the best d-man in the league much less best player and yet "generational" is being bandied about. That's silly.

He missed 12 games in a 56 game schedule and still almost won the Norris in an unbalanced schedule. You find it odd that voters did award him the Norris?

 

[Voight]

Think Lindström was very near. Especially that longevity was unreal. Generational longevity for sure.

Orr was killed by injuries, same as Karlsson.

People tried to hurt Lidström, but couldn't do it. He just evaded from the contact.

Laperriere was the only successor, getting him out for 6 games. Still, that season ended up for s Stanley Cup win as a Captain.

He was close, with Bourque in that same boat. But neither were generational.

 

[Sasha Orlov]

He’s neither the best player in his team nor the best D in the league, joke thread

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Lidstrom was fantastic but he wasn't a generational talent.

Guys like him and Bourque are close, but they dont make the cut.

Ahhhhh what? The dude won 7 Norris trophies....

 

[These Are The Days]

Lol this guy isn't even the best player on his own team

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

No. A generational player at the very least needs to clearly be the best player on his own team and he isn't.

Pretty much this.

He’s neither the best player in his team nor the best D in the league, joke thread

The funny thing about this is if you read actual Avs fans opinions and not just the stat watchers who don't even watch Colorado play, you'd see that more and more of us think he might be the best player on Colorado already and certainly has a very good chance of becoming the Avs best player in the next year or two.

 

[T REX]

Lidstrom was fantastic but he wasn't a generational talent.

Guys like him and Bourque are close, but they dont make the cut.

I can't even take this post seriously.

SEVEN Norris's?

GENERATIONAL.

And he did it for so long too.

Please, lock this thread. It has jumped the shark.

 

[Zenos]

I can't even take this post seriously.

SEVEN Norris's?

GENERATIONAL.

And he did it for so long too.

Please, lock this thread. It has jumped the shark.

Was Lidstrom ever considered the unanimous best (or even 2nd/3rd) player during his career?
We're not talking defensemen here, but generational player.
I don't think it's crazy to suggest that a guy who never won a Hart or Lindsay (though a Conn Smythe) isn't generational.... After all, there's not a handful of these players each generation.

 

[T REX]

Was Lidstrom ever considered the unanimous best (or even 2nd/3rd) player during his career?
We're not talking defensemen here, but generational player.
I don't think it's crazy to suggest that a guy who never won a Hart or Lindsay (or Conn Smythe) isn't generational.... After all, there's not a handful of these players each generation.

That makes zero sense.

There are generational goalies...as well as defensemen.

You are narrowing the criteria.

Agree to disagree. Nothing new around here.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

Bedard and Michkov are probably the next best shot at generational players.

They’ll enter the league 8 years after McDavid, so that’s probably enough time to consider them the next generations best player.

 

[Alwalys]

Think Lindström was very near. Especially that longevity was unreal. Generational longevity for sure.

Orr was killed by injuries, same as Karlsson.

People tried to hurt Lidström, but couldn't do it. He just evaded from the contact.

Laperriere was the only successor, getting him out for 6 games. Still, that season ended up for s Stanley Cup win as a Captain.

TELL THAT TO HIS NUTS

 

[Sasha Orlov]

The funny thing about this is if you read actual Avs fans opinions and not just the stat watchers who don't even watch Colorado play, you'd see that more and more of us think he might be the best player on Colorado already and certainly has a very good chance of becoming the Avs best player in the next year or two.

Ok good luck with that

 

[Avsfan1921]

Clearly he's not. He's a phenomenal player and every Avs fan is ecstatic with his progression I'm sure. He's a top 5 defenseman in the NHL after his first full season so not much more can be asked of him currently. He's much better defensively than many give him credit for but there are holes to his game in that area. IF he can clean those up while sustaining his offensive prowess then there can be a debate, but that is so far down the line that I'm just trying to enjoy what he brings currently.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Yeah Makar is most definitely not generational at the moment. But his start and the numbers he’s posting are making it so that depending on how his career goes he could get that label. Lots of work to do for that though.

 

[Zenos]

That makes zero sense.

It’s clear that some of us are talking about generational players overall (where by definition there shouldn’t be more than one / maybe two accounting for overlap per generation) while others, like yourself are accounting for generational players at each position.

Id hardly say it "makes zero sense" (why?!) to look at it either way. Relax.

 

[mouser]

Was Makar a generational prospect? No. I’d argue McDavid, Crosby and Lindros were the 3 most recent.

Is Makar a generational NHL player? At this point in time No. Maybe, someday a decade+ down the road we look back over his career and reach a different conclusion.

Is Makar a “generational talent”? I don’t what the bleep that means.

 

[Syckle78]

If you have to ask if a player is generational then the answer is no.

 

[Kaako Kappo]

No but he's certainly enjoying the fruits of playing behind a generational first line

 

[chauron]

You use the word ”generational” but do you know what it means? He’s not one of the all time best players for sure, so therefore he’s very far from being one.

 

[Eisen]

Also, why is he named like a vegetable?

 

[RC51]

Wait a minute, when this guy plays 20 years and proves to be that gen player then he has earned the right. A ton of players had potential but he might get hit by a bus, he might get into drugs, he might a million things before he proves to be a gen player.

 

[hockeydog23]

Oh come on. He played clearly over 30 seconds of penalty killing per game for Avalanche in playoffs. That's more than what Connor Timmins got. A top-5. Isn't that enough?

Serious question - was Bobby Orr a shutdown defender? I only know about his offense, but know little about his defense.