I have serious concerns for next year (2023-24)

[IPS]

The old GM just made a massively impactful move for his new team with a roster that has a lot more restrictions and limitations than the one he left with a lot of flexibility built in. TFYM?

And we're similar to Pittsburgh in what way?

New Penguins fans can explain this one.

 

[geo25]

Most people saw it as a huge win for the Leafs from the minute it happened. Leeman was probably no better than the third best player involved in what IIRC was a 10 player trade, we got the best two players in the deal. Gilmour was an amazing player and had already earned a spot on perhaps the best ever Team Canada roster, I would have seen the trade as a massive win for us, even if he'd been the only player we got in return for the five we gave up.

Some Leaf fans hated the Clark trade but I think they were just letting their emotions get in the way of common sense. I thought it was an obvious big win for us the minute it happened, so did many others.

The Gilmour example (sorry, Leeman example) is just so bad, not sure you could have done worse had you tried. The Clark example is also really bad but your premise is 100% valid. JMHO.


Well said! Clark was amazing, possibly the most charismatic player I've seen play for us. Not possible not to love that guy IMO, he gave 100% all the time and if our current "team leaders" had half the heart Clark did, we'd be enjoying a dynasty.

Agreed....and I hated the trade at the time. Clarke was the leader on that team....wish we had someone like him on this squad.

 

[saffronleaf]

team sucks ass so does newgm

ugly years ahead in hogtown

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

You realize Bertuzzi was on pace for 40 points with the Red Wings right? He only has decent numbers from playing with a stacked Bruins. Bertuzzi is surely an upgrade on Hyman's skill... but I think people will be very disappointed with Domi/Bertuzzi based on how people are talking.



And the worst bottom 6 in the league?

I think people are going to be disappointed when we still don't have a "true top 6", but we have scoring depth.

we have the worst bottom 6 in the league? I hear that all the time and I think It's completely ridiculous.

The bottom 6 has ONE issue.

3rd line center that's it,

If David Kampf was 4th line center instead of 3rd line center there would be no issue but he's not so there is.

But that issue alone does not make it the worst bottom 6 in the league.

You can't have the worst bottom 6 in the league while also having Jarnkrok, Knies, Reaves and Lafferty as your wingers, especially when we know 2 of those, namely Knies and Jarnkrok can slide into the top 6 if they need to.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

team sucks ass so does newgm

ugly years ahead in hogtown

Dubas is in Pittsburgh you should follow your lord and saviour there.

 

[saffronleaf]

max domi is an ugly joke

 

[leafs in five]

Nylander is v handsome

 

[notbias]

we have the worst bottom 6 in the league? I hear that all the time and I think It's completely ridiculous.

The bottom 6 has ONE issue.

3rd line center that's it,

If David Kampf was 4th line center instead of 3rd line center there would be no issue but he's not so there is.

But that issue alone does not make it the worst bottom 6 in the league.

You can't have the worst bottom 6 in the league while also having Jarnkrok, Knies, Reaves and Lafferty as your wingers, especially when we know 2 of those, namely Knies and Jarnkrok can slide into the top 6 if they need to.

Well in your scenario we are running one of the best top 6s and one of the worst bottom 6s.

Assuming our bottom 6 in your scenario is:

Lafferty - Kampf - Jarnkrok
Knies - Holmberg - Reaves

That's bad, for sure one of the worst in the league.

You can't have Knies playing 3LW as that is probably a shutdown line.

I am advocating for spreading out talent with something like this:

Domi/Knies - Matthews - Marner
Bertuzzi - Tavares - Jarnkrok
Knies/Domi - Holmberg - Nylander
Lafferty - Kampf - Reaves

That forward squad looks A LOT better.

 

[Bellzy]

as long as we have marner and matthews wearing the Leaf crest we will not be winners. (unless you count regular season wins as being a winner - which clearly some do - look above)

This is such a bad statement lol

 

[Racer88]

You realize Bertuzzi was on pace for 40 points with the Red Wings right? He only has decent numbers from playing with a stacked Bruins. Bertuzzi is surely an upgrade on Hyman's skill... but I think people will be very disappointed with Domi/Bertuzzi based on how people are talking.



And the worst bottom 6 in the league?

I think people are going to be disappointed when we still don't have a "true top 6", but we have scoring depth.

So then Bertuzzi should be fine here……..aren’t we a stacked team?

 

[conFABulator]

Well in your scenario we are running one of the best top 6s and one of the worst bottom 6s.

Assuming our bottom 6 in your scenario is:

Lafferty - Kampf - Jarnkrok
Knies - Holmberg - Reaves

That's bad, for sure one of the worst in the league.

You can't have Knies playing 3LW as that is probably a shutdown line.

I am advocating for spreading out talent with something like this:

Domi/Knies - Matthews - Marner
Bertuzzi - Tavares - Jarnkrok
Knies/Domi - Holmberg - Nylander
Lafferty - Kampf - Reaves

That forward squad looks A LOT better.

I agree that your lineup looks better, I would tweak it this way...

Bertuzzi Matthews Nylander
Domi Tavares Marner
Knies Kampf Jarnkrok
McMann Lafferty Reaves

Where is gets interesting is if Robertson has a good camp. What then?

Knies Matthews Bertuzzi
Robertson Tavares Marner
Domi Holmberg Nylander
Lafferty Kampf Jarnkrok

That is a very solid group of forwards with lots of PP and PK options. If course, requires us to sit Reaves. Which will happen eventually, thought not out of the gate.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Agreed....and I hated the trade at the time. Clarke was the leader on that team....wish we had someone like him on this squad.

I do too, this team has no heart. If I could add prime Clark or prime Sundin to this team, I'd add Clark even though Sundin is a much better player because we're just desperate for what he brought to the team.

 

[Da Cool Rula]

I’d be curious to see a list of players from the whole league today that even had half the heart of those past players. Money, business, me first attitude etc was slowly seeping in even back then. Now it’s almost fully entrenched.

I do too this, this team has no heart. If I could add prime Clark or prime Sundin to this team, I'd add Clark even though Sundin is a much better player because we're just desperate for what he brought to the team.

 

[notbias]

So then Bertuzzi should be fine here……..aren’t we a stacked team?

Yes, but I am saying he is not going to be a line driver, he is another complimentary piece.

With the way people are talking, I am getting the impression people think he is a line driver.

 

[Mess]

So then Bertuzzi should be fine here……..aren’t we a stacked team?

Speaking of Bertuzzi I have to give Treliving props for tying to fix a broken core 4 and a team in Cap Hell that does leave fans discouraged, by their top heavy forwards.

Last year vs Florida in the playoffs.

Marner 5 games 1-2-3 points, Matthews 5 games 0-2-2 points, Tavares 5 games 0-1-1 assists & Nylander 5 games 2-1-3 points = $40.5 mil cap & 3 goals 7 assists 10 points.
vs
Tyler Bertuzzi 7 games 5 goals 5 assists 10 points for $5.5 mil.

Not only does Bertuzzi add size, strength and grit to a soft core 4 he also showed how effective he can be playing as powerforward and produced as much offense in a single series himself vs Florida then Leafs entire core 4 combined,

So that is the kind of move that does allow for some belief that Leafs are trying to compensate for their well documented shortcomings when their core 4 players perform as complimentary players statistically while hijacking 1/2 the teams salary max. cap.

 

[Racer88]

Yes, but I am saying he is not going to be a line driver, he is another complimentary piece.

With the way people are talking, I am getting the impression people think he is a line driver.

Fair enough. I think you are correct. He will not be the saviour but a decent pickup

 

[conFABulator]

Speaking of Bertuzzi I have to give Treliving props for tying to fix a broken core 4 and a team in Cap Hell that does leave fans discouraged, by their top heavy forwards.

Last year vs Florida in the playoffs.

Marner 5 games 1-2-3 points, Matthews 5 games 0-2-2 points, Tavares 5 games 0-1-1 assists & Nylander 5 games 2-1-3 points = $40.5 mil cap & 3 goals 7 assists 10 points.
vs
Tyler Bertuzzi 7 games 5 goals 5 assists 10 points for $5.5 mil.

Not only does Bertuzzi add size, strength and grit to a soft core 4 he also showed how effective he can be playing as powerforward and produced as much offense in a single series himself vs Florida then Leafs entire core 4 combined,

So that is the kind of move that does allow for some belief that Leafs are trying to compensate for their well documented shortcomings when their core 4 players perform as complimentary players statistically while hijacking 1/2 the teams salary max. cap.

I like the Bertuzzi addition as well, the Domi one also.

However, those are first round stats for Bertuzzi. Most fans here don't care about that...it's all about winning the round and Boston didn't do that. Marner and Matthews had very good first rounds also...and they won. Matthews scored most of his goals later in the series actually.

 

[Hoglund4MvP]

Yes, but I am saying he is not going to be a line driver, he is another complimentary piece.

With the way people are talking, I am getting the impression people think he is a line driver.

This place would only praise the team if we signed the next available Kerfoot

 

[Gilmour1996]

Where is gets interesting is if Robertson has a good camp. What then?

Then you trade him before he gets hurt.

 

[Nineteen67]

So then Bertuzzi should be fine here……..aren’t we a stacked team?

There’s Matthews Marner and Nylander and a whole bunch of meh…

 

[Ianturnedbull]

The last time we had a fun team was the shortened season 2012-2013.

JVR
Bozak
Kessel
Lupul
MacArthur
Grabovski
Kulemin
Kadri
Frattin
Komarov
McClement
Orr
McLaren
Dion
Kostka
Liles
Gardiner
Fraser
Fransen
Holzer
Riemer
Scrivens

People want to talk about a Frattin what if? Or they want to talk about coaching/goalie/team melt-down. I don't want to think about that. They were never supposed to win that series in the first place, but they sure made it interesting. The regular season was so fun and the cherry on top was February 9th, 2013 vs MTL at the Bell Center. 6-0 Leafs victory, 6 fighting majors, and 4 x 10 min. game misconducts. I know it's not for everyone, but this team had an identity.

Do I have majors concerns for Toronto this season? No. Do I hope that they find a back-bone to win in the post-season? I hope so. I do hope that they have an identity and personality. That can go a long way IMHO.

Enjoy:

 

[MCR74]

The last time we had a fun team was the shortened one 2012-2013.

JVR
Bozak
Kessel
Lupul
MacArthur
Grabovski
Kulemin
Kadri
Frattin
Komarov
McClement
Orr
McLaren
Dion
Kostka
Liles
Gardiner
Fraser
Fransen
Holzer
Riemer
Scrivens

People want to talk about a Frattin what if? Or they want to talk about coaching/goalie/team melt-down. I don't want to think about that. They were never supposed to win that series in the first place, but they sure made it interesting. The regular season was so fun and the cherry on top was February 9th, 2013 vs MTL at the Bell Center. 6-0 Leafs victory, 6 fighting majors, and 4 x 10 min. game misconducts. I know it's not for everyone, but this team had an identity.

Do I have majors concerns for Toronto this season? No. Do I hope that they find a back-bone to win in the post-season? I hope so. I do hope that they have an identity and personality. That can go a long way IMHO.

Enjoy:

Was that the game where Grabovski bit what's his face? Good times.

 

[Da Cool Rula]

The last time we had a fun team was the shortened one 2012-2013.

JVR
Bozak
Kessel
Lupul
MacArthur
Grabovski
Kulemin
Kadri
Frattin
Komarov
McClement
Orr
McLaren
Dion
Kostka
Liles
Gardiner
Fraser
Fransen
Holzer
Riemer
Scrivens

People want to talk about a Frattin what if? Or they want to talk about coaching/goalie/team melt-down. I don't want to think about that. They were never supposed to win that series in the first place, but they sure made it interesting. The regular season was so fun and the cherry on top was February 9th, 2013 vs MTL at the Bell Center. 6-0 Leafs victory, 6 fighting majors, and 4 x 10 min. game misconducts. I know it's not for everyone, but this team had an identity.

Do I have majors concerns for Toronto this season? No. Do I hope that they find a back-bone to win in the post-season? I hope so. I do hope that they have an identity and personality. That can go a long way IMHO.

Enjoy:

The game that Parros‘ career basically ended and forever holds a grudge against us as a result.

 

[thewave]

The last time we had a fun team was the shortened one 2012-2013.

JVR
Bozak
Kessel
Lupul
MacArthur
Grabovski
Kulemin
Kadri
Frattin
Komarov
McClement
Orr
McLaren
Dion
Kostka
Liles
Gardiner
Fraser
Fransen
Holzer
Riemer
Scrivens

People want to talk about a Frattin what if? Or they want to talk about coaching/goalie/team melt-down. I don't want to think about that. They were never supposed to win that series in the first place, but they sure made it interesting. The regular season was so fun and the cherry on top was February 9th, 2013 vs MTL at the Bell Center. 6-0 Leafs victory, 6 fighting majors, and 4 x 10 min. game misconducts. I know it's not for everyone, but this team had an identity.

Do I have majors concerns for Toronto this season? No. Do I hope that they find a back-bone to win in the post-season? I hope so. I do hope that they have an identity and personality. That can go a long way IMHO.

Enjoy:

Rather have a team with that character and identity that I knew would never win the cup than a team full of cowardly spoiled players that dazzle with nifty moves and also have no chance of winning. Can't have the depth required with the big 4 players contract demands, just ain't happening.

 

[Primary Assist]

The game that Parros‘ career basically ended and forever holds a grudge against us as a result.

I think that was actually the season opener the next year. The NHL's first (and only) no hit knockout