How will Dahlin rank offensively among D this season?

[Fatass]

Stats? His results are better than all these other guys right now.

I’m not saying he’s elite defensively, but to rank him last out of these players doesn’t make any sense to me.

I wonder if Dahlin is the only one of these guys listed that can play well without needing a very good defensive minded partner?

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

It absolutely makes sense. Who would you have last? Hughes?

Defensively? Yes.

 

[AB13]

I wonder if Dahlin is the only one of these guys listed that can play well without needing a very good defensive minded partner?

All of them can, come on. Dahlin is the best for me, but all of them are amazing regardless of partner.

 

[Fatass]

All of them can, come on. Dahlin is the best for me, but all of them are amazing regardless of partner.

Yes, they are all great young d for sure. Just think Dahlin, although not the same level of offence as Hughes and Makar, is able to function defensively better.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I assumed he'd be among the top, didn't realize he gets that little 5v5 time. Should've just ended it at he's a d-man for the Sabres, lol.

Most misused player in the league.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I’ve started writing a book on this topic.

Dahlin’s Usage

 

[MrOT]

Yes, they are all great young d for sure. Just think Dahlin, although not the same level of offence as Hughes and Makar, is able to function defensively better.

I would't say he nessecarily is worse offensively than them. He has some tools they don't have. How old is he again? 19? 20? How good was Hedman at that age, how good was Lidström at that age? Dahlin could become Lidström with Pettersson's hands and puck poise. It's scary to think about.

 

[Dr Quincy]

You think he will stay the same with all the improvements? Idk if you read the post but he was actually 14th in PPG among defensemen, don't see him going anywhere but up with the new team and his own natural progression.

Their improved offense is more a fact than theory. Hall is a high end offensive talent which alone would be beneficial to Dahlin’s production, then you have Staal who gives us a 2c and 2nd line (Dahlin had neither for both of his seasons and still put up the 14th best ppg as a 19yo). There are other improvements to the team too and Dahlin also happens to be the most talented young D in the league going from 19 to almost 21.

All these improvements.....


the team was 21st in Goals Per Game last year, this year....

26th

 

[GOALOFSSON]

I don't get this. I've watched the Sabres two times this season (including the game I'm watching right now) and Dahlin has looked great. What's going on? Bad luck? Has he really been that bad?

Had a couple games that weren't too great (mostly the first games) and some questionable plays here or there but has also looked pretty good in many games. Overall team offence hasn't done much yet and he could use a more suitable D partner.

Yes, they are all great young d for sure. Just think Dahlin, although not the same level of offence as Hughes and Makar, is able to function defensively better.

I don't think Dahlin is worse offensively than them

I would't say he nessecarily is worse offensively than them. He has some tools they don't have. How old is he again? 19? 20? How good was Hedman at that age, how good was Lidström at that age? Dahlin could become Lidström with Pettersson's hands and puck poise. It's scary to think about.

Turns 21 in just under 2 months

 

[GOALOFSSON]

All these improvements.....


the team was 21st in Goals Per Game last year, this year....

26th

Rough start no doubt. We'll see how the season ends.

 

[MrOT]

Had a couple games that weren't too great (mostly the first games) and some questionable plays here or there but has also looked pretty good in many games. Overall team offence hasn't done much yet and he could use a more suitable D partner.



I don't think Dahlin is worse offensively than them


Turns 21 in just under 2 months

So still extremely young for a #1 D then. I agree that he doesn't look worse offensively than them from what I've seen. Only watched two Sabres games this season I admit but was extremely impressed. He's a generational talent for sure. Can he just improve his foot speed and he'll be almost impossible to stop in his prime, that stickhandling is so crisp and his hockey IQ offensively is off the charts. Needs to be more solid in his D zone but that will come with age.

 

[TopChedder]

So still extremely young for a #1 D then. I agree that he doesn't look worse offensively than them from what I've seen. Only watched two Sabres games this season I admit but was extremely impressed. He's a generational talent for sure. Can he just improve his foot speed and he'll be almost impossible to stop in his prime, that stickhandling is so crisp and his hockey IQ offensively is off the charts. Needs to be more solid in his D zone but that will come with age.

Not saying he is not a generational talent for sure, but aren't true generational players impact players right away?

I know Dmen are different than forwards development wise, but he seems like a good to elite talent.

Buffalo could also be hurting his development a bit (environment wise)

 

[ESH]

Lets compare some defensive and two way stats from 2019-20, with the team rank since these stats are almost irrelevant otherwise, since they are heavily influenced by team puck possession.

Relative CF%
Hughes 6.0, team rank 4
Dahlin 3.6, team rank 4
Makar 2.6, team rank 7
Heiskanen 2.5, team rank 10

Relative FF%
Dahlin 1.5, team rank 8
Makar 2.5, team rank 10
Heiskanen 2.0, team rank 10
Hughes 5.5, team rank 5

Blocks : Heiskanen 84, Dahlin 51, Hughes 46, Makar 47.
Hits: Heiskanen 40, Dahlin 72, Makar 45, Hughes 7
Takeaways/giveaways: Heiskanen - 37, Dahlin - 26, Hughes - 25, Makar -6.

What picture does these stats paint? There is not much to separate them defensively, based on this. Makar is probably slightly worse than the rest in his own zone, but defensive ability is generally not really something you can base on stats, I must admit. Offensively though, there clearly is a substantial difference. Heiskanen has not been able to produce at nearly the same rate as the others outside of one playoff run.

none of these stats really say much about a player’s ability to defend

 

[klozge]

Yes, they are all great young d for sure. Just think Dahlin, although not the same level of offence as Hughes and Makar, is able to function defensively better.

Maybe one day but right now Makar is quite a bit ahead defensively.

 

[MrHeiskanen]

Anyone else find it funny that someone would say a defender who gets benched for defensive blunders, given 15-20 minutes a night semi-regularly is better defensively than the guy who never plays less than 20 minutes a night on one of the better defensive teams in the league?

Something doesn't add up there.

 

[North Cole]

I wouldn't dismiss the best offensive playoff run by a defenseman in this century by a defenseman as "one playoff run".

I have no dog in this race, but I don't think the run was better than the defenseman who won the CS that year.

Hedman last year - PPG was 0.88 vs 0.96 (Heisk), but had 66% more goals, 3 of which were game winners. Head to head in the 6-game SCF, Hedman had 7 points, Heiskanen had 4.

Personally I think Keith in 2014 was also better - nearly identical PPG but Keith had 3 goals (partly because they played 5 less games since they destroyed everyone that year). Keith's goals were 100% GWG which was crazy. Keith also had 50% less turnovers, and played 5 minutes more per game. Karlsson's Ottawa run is probably up there if they win that game 7, since he was 0.95 PPG on a much worse team.

Not to take away from his run, I just don't think it's the best offensive run this century and I definitely don't think it's top 5 best all around runs this century. Defensemen wise.

 

[MrHeiskanen]

I have no dog in this race, but I don't think the run was better than the defenseman who won the CS that year.

Hedman last year - PPG was 0.88 vs 0.96 (Heisk), but had 66% more goals, 3 of which were game winners. Head to head in the 6-game SCF, Hedman had 7 points, Heiskanen had 4.

Personally I think Keith in 2014 was also better - nearly identical PPG but Keith had 3 goals (partly because they played 5 less games since they destroyed everyone that year). Keith's goals were 100% GWG which was crazy. Keith also had 50% less turnovers, and played 5 minutes more per game. Karlsson's Ottawa run is probably up there if they win that game 7, since he was 0.95 PPG on a much worse team.

Not to take away from his run, I just don't think it's the best offensive run this century and I definitely don't think it's top 5 best all around runs this century. Defensemen wise.

Agreed. It was a hell of a run, and maybe the best run for a young guy but not overall.

 

[Buck Naked]

So still extremely young for a #1 D then.

Who's that #1 D you're referring to?

 

[Kreator]

generational?? LOL

 

[TopChedder]

Anyone else find it funny that someone would say a defender who gets benched for defensive blunders, given 15-20 minutes a night semi-regularly is better defensively than the guy who never plays less than 20 minutes a night on one of the better defensive teams in the league?

Something doesn't add up there.

I honestly think Buffalo is not helping this kid at all, and I don't mean to come off like an ass about that organization. He will get better.

In saying that I believe the hype was too damn high on this kid. Once the league slapped the "generational" tag on him it was over, and it's also why he gets the benefit of the doubt on these boards.

But he has not been as good as many of the young D around the league.

 

[BlueMed]

Why do people keep obsessing over young players that aren't even developed yet? Just wait and see for once.

 

[PatrikBerglund]

They forced him to put on weight, now he's an even weaker skater - and his skating speed/acceleration was already very average before this.

 

[koyvoo]

As of this post, Dahlin is the 70th ranked D (minimum of 14 games played) in the NHL based on PPG

 

[LaMasquerade]

I voted top 15 before the season.. that didn't go well..

 

[Buck Naked]

This thread is aging really well. Especially the posts about Dahlin being better than Makar. Dahlin is by far the worst out of the four as of today, in all areas. Still got his potential though, however he might not live up to it unless he learns how to skate again.