How many jobs are on the line?

[Eternal Leaf]

Dubas is not the issue. Logically, he built a good team. There's no denying it.

It's all on the players.

Some guys don't have it mentally and this core is full of those guys. They all play below their abilities in knockout games.

I would remove Nylander and honestly Rielly too if it wasn't for his extension. Just cause a team is good on paper or regular season doesn't mean they are actually good when it matters.

 

[All Mod Cons]

I've been saying this for 2 years now. All these emotional people think its so easy to make changes. The issue is Matthews, Marner, Tavares, Nylander did not get anything done tonight. When the core players you built the team around are struggling to get it done, you can't fix things by snapping your fingers.

2020 - Dubas had a great summer. Brought in Brodie who has been super solid.

2021 - Dubas had a great summer, didn't overspend on Hyman, replaced him with Bunting who has gotten the job done.

For all you know it all's, what do you do to get this team past this hurdle?

A GM that can identify a group of players that can win a playoff round?

A coach that can coach a team to successfully win a playoff round?

For all the blaming the players, who brought those players in? They didn't just appear one day.

Also, and this is actually just the be all and end all of the situation - you can't build a successful team around 3 x 11mil forwards. Simple.

 

[I am Canadian]

How many Dubas draft picks were in the team today? He has " stacked the pool" yet the only one to ever play has been Rasmus

What a stupid way to judge a prospect pool. The Leaf's are acquiring top prospects in the late first/2nd/3rd rounds. Your expecting teenagers to be on the team?

 

[colchar]

bullshit. They lost. don't blame the refs.

Don't try to claim that the refs didn't influence the outcome.

 

[AllDay28]

If Dubass isn't fired I'm not watching a single game next year. I want the axe to drop on Keefe, Shanahan, the assistant coaches, the goalie development coach, I want heads

f*** this team

we will miss you next year.

 

[ReHabs]

What has Dubas done? Most of the talent was there when Toronto took over. I guarantee if Toronto hired Marc Bergevin instead, he would have “bargain binned” a decent supporting cast and won at least one round. I also think Bergevin is an absolute idiot.

The point is to win it all not win just a round, it isn't an iterative process where you win one round and then two and then maybe the whole thing. Sometimes you get many chances with the same core, sometimes you get one (like the Habs last year and their fluke run).

Dubas bet on having star depth and multiple kicks at the can, and he's gotten that out of them, and you saw in the third period on that PP - your best five players are pretty damn good. My gut reaction is that one of them has to be moved (very likely Nylander) but the team itself is (1) a playoff team and (2) actually has two very talented lines. Campbell and the defence are both good enough to win a series or two. I mean you know this is true. So what can Dubas do? Bad luck + bad voodoo.

Anyway, I won't clog up this thread you guys gotta work it out. Cheers.

 

[KuleminFan41]

**** off. We won this series against the back to back champs and it got stripped away from us by the zebras. Dubas has put together a fantastic team

Stop making excuses. Why did the Leafs lose against Montreal? Why did they lose against Columbus? Was it because of the Refs too? I'm tired of hearing excuses and bullshit moral victories people come up with every year they lose. The Leafs can't beat the best team and they can't beat the worst team, do you actually think that deserves a free pass? 4 seasons of failure under Dubas , right now they're the Ottawa Senators of the early 2000s, just a regular season team and nothing more.

 

[OVO16]

How does Nick Paul beast us (our D made it easy for him but can't deny his effort level) but mik and engvall continue to do nothing.

And how did Keefe fall for their little run with the goalie pulled in game 3, costing us game 4 by losing the first period?

If Dubas continues to think mik engvall holl are playoff depth my loyalty ends in 22/23.


Goes without saying I want Trotz in for Keefe.

Pierre engvall is a f***ing disgrace. If the man played with a single pounce of Passion or Aggression, he could've had the same impact Nick Paul did.

Just a travesty. Our organization continues to p***yfy the players

 

[rocketman588]

Stacked? Are you for real?

The team has 3/7 picks in the next draft and already has a bottom 3 prospect pool in the league. One of the best prospect has a brain tumor. Get real.

We did sign a goalie who then got busted for PEDs so that was cool

 

[Michoulicious]

So, you would like the Leafs to trade Matthews, Nylander, Marner & Tavares? I'm telling you Dubas is not the issue, its our core players. Why are we pretending that we would have a different core set of players with Dubas not here? Dubas doesn't strap on skates and mail it in out there.

Then Dubas is responsible for keeping that core for that long and not making changes earlier when it was obvious it could not even win a playoff serie against Columbus or Montreal.

 

[Lightsol]

What has Dubas done? Most of the talent was there when Toronto took over. I guarantee if Toronto hired Marc Bergevin instead, he would have “bargain binned” a decent supporting cast and won at least one round. I also think Bergevin is an absolute idiot.

We could have had prime Scotty Bowman running this team and it wouldn't make any difference, because the problem isn't the lineup, or the coaching, or the management, or any of that. The problem is the NHL and the fact that the only thing they see the Leafs as good for is as a piggy bank. But once the playoffs start? Like all the other Canadian teams, the Leafs can go.

 

[PromisedLand]

• Massive overpayments
• 50% of the cap tied to 4 forwards (did not show up in Game 7s btw)
• Not enough cap left to have decent depth
• Upcoming contracts
• The goalie he signed -> Mrazek will be the #1 goalie. Leafs will not be able to afford Campbell btw
• This core shits the bed when it matters so we need decent depth
  • BUT no cap space left for decent depth
• Hired a rookie coach that continues to SUCK when it comes to playoffs
• Does not even have BALLS to call out biased anti-leaf officiating
• This season the Kadri trade looks even worse than it was orginally

There are so many F-ups.

I do like not throwing away the 1st rounders this year for another 1st round exit. This team did not show up to play in Game 2, Game 4 and Game 7; while turtling in the 3rd period in Game 6 with only 4 shots on goal. Part of is on coaching; he is the one that hired the coach.

If there are any major moves being done then I'd prefer it is not Dubas doing it. Let the new GM come in and make those moves. If you want to remain status-quo then I don't really care whether dubas stays or goes.

If dubas makes any major moves this off season I am going to take a break from Leafs. His screw ups are so massive that I just cannot invest myself emotionally with this team anymore. Life is short; and the experience that is life is being miserable for a lot of people (leafs fans) because of 3 guys making ridiculous decisions

1) Shanahan
2) Dubas
3) Keefe

3 guys should not be ruining it for thousands perhaps millions of Leafs fans. Period!

 

[paulhiggins]

Yep, soft. So soft they just lead the playoffs in penalty minutes AIWEC.

Non Sequitur.

 

[Azail]

Why are you so sure Marner isnt moving?

Man that would take a hell of a trade. It could happen, but Marner did play his best hockey this year. Contract is tough to trade without eating something back just due to the flat cap. I can't imagine this management or another management would trade Marner.

To be clear I don't think there is an easy or 'right' decision here, I just think Nylander is the easiest to trade if they are going to change the core around.

 

[tmlfan98]

Barry Trotz is literally unemployed.

Anyone who is advocating for keeping Keefe until Trotz is hired by another team just wants to lose in round 1 every year.

 

[wingman75]

So, how does anyone get excited for any regular season game next season? Clearly this team can perform there, generally speaking, though there was evidence that they would fail in big moments... not play bad, but fail...

Same thing for the individual stats and awares... they are cool, but have no value to the franchise really.

I had planned to go to Toronto to see my first game there, and of course get the NHL.tv package again... I need to rethink that. I am investing way too much into this while these guys prance around as the great pretenders.

Ah f***, I am so angry right now... dammit.

 

[Lightsol]

Barry Trotz is literally unemployed.

Anyone who is advocating for keeping Keefe until Trotz is hired by another team just wants to lose in round 1 every year.

Trotz have an inside connection to Bettman that will prevent us from getting f***ed by the NHL in the playoffs every year?

 

[GojuLeaf]

Stop making excuses. They lost.

Every team but 1 loses every year.
You guys don't seem to recognize how rare a good team is. You'll miss it when it's gone.

 

[I am Canadian]

Then Dubas is responsible for keeping that core for that long and not making changes earlier when it was obvious it could not even win a playoff serie against Columbus or Montreal.

Okay, and what is your game plan for removing Dubas and improving the Leafs or are you just rage typing? Trading our core players would be idiotic, you wouldn't get fair value for them. Leafs will live and die by if Marner & Matthews can figure it out.

 

[capfit9]

Don't be an idiot. Dubas has made fantastic choices for the team this year. This series is not on him.
The Leafs are going to do it one year, and all they can do is little tweaks here and there.

Bunting, Kase were outstanding pickups. Our prospect pool is stacked. We just need the current crop of players to pull it off for us.

Kadri

 

[Trapper]

This is a tough loss because we did play well.
However, this team is supposed to be a contender, pays a core like champions, and when you fail to win a round 6 years in a row, the excuse that, well at least this time we played well is lame. Shameful if that’s your new excuse. Maybe once, maybe twice, but not 6 times.

Something needs to change as a result.
Does 1 core player need to become a different core player? Maybe. Does money need to be reallocated to a deeper team because we dry up offensively in tight game 7s? Maybe.
Does a coaching change need to happen? That’s probably a huge maybe.

 

[ULF_55]

Dubas has made mistakes.
He believed in the players who just can't step up when it matters.
Not sure changing Dubas without changing the double digits will matter.

 

[OVO16]

Barry Trotz is literally unemployed.

Anyone who is advocating for keeping Keefe until Trotz is hired by another team just wants to lose in round 1 every year.

There's no way Dubas is going to hire Trotz. Literally polar opposites.

Only way Trotz gets hired is if Dubas is let go and the Organization goes through a system overhaul

 

[Goose]

I feel like this team can win a cup, but it takes puck luck, and so far they haven't had any.

Honestly feel like it's just a coinflip who won the last couple of these games. Leafs dominated in the 3rd tonight, so many chances and bounces that could have ended up in the net, but didn't.

I don't love Dubas, but I think he's put together a team that gives us a legit shot a cup for a couple of years.

I get the whole "not getting out of the first round is unacceptable" thing, and yes it matters, but how much does it matter if we lose in the first or third round other than it feels better for a short time?

This isn't a hard opinion, I just can't bring myself to believe this team lacks some mythical ability to close when everything's been so tight with a killer team that's gunning for its third straight cup.

 

[I am Canadian]

Kadri

This is the first series that Kadri has not been suspended for in... 4 years? Kadri brought this on himself.